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Old 29 October 2019, 02:46 AM   #31
bearxj86
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I don’t know if there is a way to really qualify some of your metrics. Much of Rolex’ reputation is well earned and deserved. Much of it also comes from possibly the best marketing machine ever. That machine causes the masses to perpetuate their well earned reputation.

GS’s army of fanboys is much much smaller than Rolex. The composition of the army is different as well. GS fans more often are genuine watch fans. Rolex has a vast number of customers who purchase on name only and don’t really care what is inside the watch.

There are no reliability/durability tests that can be used to objectively compare the brands. This leaves it mostly to opinion.


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Agree on many of your points. The one thing i would say is this: There are so many stories of Rolexes going through wars, mud, accidents intact. We know some of their movements are military grade. We know the Daytona movement was up against the Moonwatch for the NASA space program. We know they don't survive plane crashes (thanks to 9/11) very well and they don't survives house fires completely intact. Yes, no one has really done controlled tests of one versus the other, but with millions of rolexes out there, I think the data suggests that Rolexes are very durable as opposed to them being more durable than GS. It is hard to prove a negative here since GS is as yet "untested" in world of use cases and public opinion.

Moreso, most GS are not "dive watches" so its hard to imagine how much damage my 211 snowflake will take versus a James Cameron Deepsea. I can tell you that my money is on the deepsea :)

Maybe one day some smart ass would put them on robots and smash them against each other in a battle royale duel to the death.

Opinions based on experience count but to a less extent than a scientific study don't they? Just saying.
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Old 29 October 2019, 02:50 AM   #32
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Why collect a Seiko/Grand Seiko... because the brand is a very unique entity/manufacturer with a very rabid following and seiko has a different design ethstetic that is based in the Japanese design ideology.

State of the art fully regulated quartz, proprietary electro-mechanical 'Spring Drive', beautifully finished display cased '9s' 28.8 bpm automatics and a really wonderful hi-beat... there are many to choose from at relatively affordable pricing.

And then there is the finishing... all hand built/assembled and all hand finished to an extremely high level.

Expect some depreciation unless you buy used... and I attribute that to the fact they they make to many offerings (not to many watches).

The three eight seven is a very nice choice if you can live with titainium... and these spring drive Ti's are VERY lite. That model comes on the market more often than the 500 pieces would suggest, but those who list them are steadfast in what they want for them.

The best deal in Grand Seiko for me personally is the SBGM231... this gmt complicated 9s movement automatic in stainless steel is absooutely stunning in person and mine ran an extremely accurate +1day until the day I sold it. It's got a great cream dial with hand finished applied indices and a heat blued gmt hand... stunning for about 3.5k otd.



That GMT is an absolute stunner!! Unfortunately it looked tiny on my 7.6Ē wrist
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Old 29 October 2019, 02:53 AM   #33
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Agree on many of your points. The one thing i would say is this: There are so many stories of Rolexes going through wars, mud, accidents. We know some of their movements are military grade. We know they don't survive plane crashes (thanks to 9/11) very well and they don't survives house fires completely intact. Yes, no one has really done controlled tests of one versus the other, but with millions of rolexes out there, I think the data suggests that Rolexes are very durable as opposed to them being more durable than GS.

Moreso, most GS are not "dive watches" so its hard to imagine how much damage my 211 snowflake will take versus a James Cameron Deepsea. I can tell you that my money is on the deepsea :)

Opinions based on experience count don't they?


Absolutely, experience counts. The sheer volume of Rolex experience reinforces their reputation. I wholeheartedly agree.

That doesnít mean a GS canít take a good beating. There just arenít the numbers like Rolex to justify that kind of reputation. Iím not saying GS is equal to the task, only that there is a lack of evidence. Likewise I donít see evidence to the contrary. Iím fine with stamping that one with a big fat question mark.


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Old 29 October 2019, 02:59 AM   #34
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Absolutely, experience counts. The sheer volume of Rolex experience reinforces their reputation. I wholeheartedly agree.

That doesn’t mean a GS can’t take a good beating. There just aren’t the numbers like Rolex to justify that kind of reputation. I’m not saying GS is equal to the task, only that there is a lack of evidence. Likewise I don’t see evidence to the contrary. I’m fine with stamping that one with a big fat question mark.


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Fair enough. Here’s my newest acquisition. Unfortunately or fortunately it’s not going anywhere near mud, war, fires or plane crashes (knock on wood) anytime soon so jury still out for me :)




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Old 29 October 2019, 03:03 AM   #35
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And my latest in the sun.



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Old 29 October 2019, 03:55 AM   #36
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A Grand Seiko is something you have to see in person. Pictures will never do the build quality justice. They're amazing even if pictures online make them appear a bit plain. Other cool thing IMO is you won't see yourself coming and going. Try a few on, see if any of them spin your propeller. And I agree with availability too - no games with a GS. They're not common but they're not impossible to find once you've settled on one.
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Old 29 October 2019, 05:48 AM   #37
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Maybe one day some smart ass would put them on robots and smash them against each other in a battle royale duel to the death.
Well, when I win the lotto, challenge accepted lol

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Old 29 October 2019, 06:32 AM   #38
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That GMT is an absolute stunner!! Unfortunately it looked tiny on my 7.6Ē wrist


Then there are the new quartz GMTís that some mockingly declare is an Explorer copy. There are absolutely similarities, but the sparkle and shine from the dial indexes and hands make an Explorer look boring in comparison.

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Old 29 October 2019, 07:23 AM   #39
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I'd own that if it wasn't for the yellow... that is the top of the line quartz regulated movement there...
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Old 29 October 2019, 10:41 AM   #40
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I'd own that if it wasn't for the yellow... that is the top of the line quartz regulated movement there...
They come in 2 other colors
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Old 29 October 2019, 12:26 PM   #41
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They come in 2 other colors
the others don't have the +/-5 second star :(
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Old 29 October 2019, 07:35 PM   #42
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the others don't have the +/-5 second star :(


Is it the star you prefer, or the accuracy it represents? Or both?

GS tends to be pretty conservative with the spec on their quartz movements.
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Old 29 October 2019, 11:41 PM   #43
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Accuracy... for me
All black dial and fire blued gmt hand is in order
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Old 30 October 2019, 12:58 PM   #44
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Is it the star you prefer, or the accuracy it represents? Or both?

GS tends to be pretty conservative with the spec on their quartz movements.
I'd say the accuracy that it represents. If they didn't have the star, but had a different caliber movement called 9F86S instead of 9F86, I'd still prefer the extra incremental inching toward perfection from 10 seconds a year to 5 seconds a year.
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Old 30 October 2019, 01:46 PM   #45
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Is it the star you prefer, or the accuracy it represents? Or both?

GS tends to be pretty conservative with the spec on their quartz movements.
Underpromise and overdeliver...that's what they do.
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Old 11 November 2019, 03:41 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSchu View Post
Why collect a Seiko/Grand Seiko... because the brand is a very unique entity/manufacturer with a very rabid following and seiko has a different design ethstetic that is based in the Japanese design ideology.

State of the art fully regulated quartz, proprietary electro-mechanical 'Spring Drive', beautifully finished display cased '9s' 28.8 bpm automatics and a really wonderful hi-beat... there are many to choose from at relatively affordable pricing.

And then there is the finishing... all hand built/assembled and all hand finished to an extremely high level.

Expect some depreciation unless you buy used... and I attribute that to the fact they they make to many offerings (not to many watches).

The three eight seven is a very nice choice if you can live with titainium... and these spring drive Ti's are VERY lite. That model comes on the market more often than the 500 pieces would suggest, but those who list them are steadfast in what they want for them.

The best deal in Grand Seiko for me personally is the SBGM231... this gmt complicated 9s movement automatic in stainless steel is absooutely stunning in person and mine ran an extremely accurate +1day until the day I sold it. It's got a great cream dial with hand finished applied indices and a heat blued gmt hand... stunning for about 3.5k otd.




Two of my favorite watches right there. I am wearing my Air-King as I type and the GS SBGM231 is high on list of a dressy watch. Great pictures. Thanks for sharing.
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Old 19 November 2019, 01:15 PM   #47
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Then there are the new quartz GMTís that some mockingly declare is an Explorer copy. There are absolutely similarities, but the sparkle and shine from the dial indexes and hands make an Explorer look boring in comparison.

I absolutely love this model.

My only concern which might be due to lack of knowledge is Ive heard that they only promise to keep parts for a limited period of time? If you want to hand down the piece I wouldn't be buying GS
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Old 19 November 2019, 07:45 PM   #48
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Problem is, even AUDEMARS PIGUET swiss made, IWC perpetual calendar swiss made, the movement easily stop.

how many times the price compare to seiko and its still working?

OF COURSE SEIKO IS WORTH FOR MONEY.

It cost me $3000+ dollars to repair the AP DIVER CARBON. It makes me sick. Its not my fault. The AP said, yeah there is a movement problem.

I believe made in japan is good, because japan always make trustable product. and for me the quality of GS even better than rolex. But rolex still win because the design is better, more popular and the brand is swiss made.

Your choice of GS is cool
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Old 20 November 2019, 03:15 AM   #49
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Well I try to balance my collection based on what I like. It includes PP, AP, Rolex, Omegaís, Seiko, JLC, Breitling, IWC, Piaget, Times.


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Old 28 November 2019, 11:26 PM   #50
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Thatís an excellent thread! I am on the edge of getting the SBGA211 at a very good discount since the boutique just opened here.. I have 4 Rolex and an Omega which I like them all too much (Kermit, Batman, Hulk, DaytonaC and a PO Limited edition Liquidmetal).. itís a different watch from what I am used so far but I like the history of the maker and the watch itself, have to decide by end of the month if I take the call or not!





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Old 28 November 2019, 11:46 PM   #51
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I absolutely love this model.



My only concern which might be due to lack of knowledge is Ive heard that they only promise to keep parts for a limited period of time? If you want to hand down the piece I wouldn't be buying GS


Where did you here this?

As far as I understand, their policy on parts are not much different than other luxury watch companies.

Iím pretty sure there are plenty of vintage grand seikoís out there ticking away, and have been serviced somehow. You may even see them here on the forums.

A lot of people say a lot of things.
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Old 28 November 2019, 11:48 PM   #52
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I am on the edge of getting the SBGA211 at a very good discount since the boutique just opened here.. I have 4 Rolex and an Omega which I like them all too much ...
Get on board – it’ll soon become another one you “like too much”.
Variety is the spice of life, after all!
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Old 30 November 2019, 12:09 AM   #53
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Great looking watch. You will not be disappointed in GS.
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Old 2 December 2019, 05:45 AM   #54
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Got it already last Thursday and today itself went back and got this amazing diver as well! Very happy with Seiko and GS of course!



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