Opinions on this 1603?

[madigral]

Hello all! New to the forum as I am just getting my first.

I recently saw a matte blue 1603 on a leather strap online and just instantly fell in love. A local broker here was able to source one for me and I was hoping I could get some opinions on the condition of the one he is offering. He's asking 3.3k USD.

I do understand that the lume is likely exhausted due to age and that it's not a quickset, but I just love the aesthetics.

I'm thinking it's both a fair price and in good condition (especially based on what I have read about the blue dials corroding) but I would love any thoughts and opinions from the experts!

[SunTzu]

It's a lovely piece. Nice case and bezel.

For me, the "IE" in "CERTIFIED" on the dial is bugging me. Personally, I like all of the lettering to be visible and legible. Otherwise, definitely nice looking for the blue dials especially around the lume plots (even with a couple missing). That's where you see corrosion.

The clasp appears to be improperly polished judging by the picture. Could be the light or flash. But plenty of detail left in the coronet. How much stretch is in the bracelet? Are the end links correct?

I think $3.3k is a bit steep but a starting point. Do you have a service history on it? How's the movement? How's the crown and crown tube? Plenty of thread left in them? If you really like it, try and diplomatically wiggle some money off. Maybe he's baked that into his asking price and padded slightly. I would mention how much you like it but there a few concerns that you would have to rectify like the clasp, bracelet stretch, movement service or at least fresh gaskets, etc.. You know, your pitch to lower the asking price a tad. Maybe if you offer all cash on top; that may sweeten it a little.

As far as price goes, it boils down to what you're willing to pay for something you truly covet. I don't think the price is exorbitant but I always like to see what someone is willing to do.

Good luck!

[Dan S]

If the hands are original, I think it's a fair price for a blue sigma dial in decent condition. However, the hands look like luminova to me.

[Vlad]

Don't wanna discuss the price, but the watch is looks good. Dial is awesome (though need better photos to make sure all is well). Hands could be newer - but it's not a big deal on a 1603.

[madigral]

Thanks all, especially SunTzu; you've raised some excellent points. I will get to see it in person on Thursday, but I appreciate the points about trying to knock a few dollars off the price.

How would I know if it has luminova hands? UV light and see if they still glow brightly?

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by madigral

Thanks all, especially SunTzu; you've raised some excellent points. I will get to see it in person on Thursday, but I appreciate the points about trying to knock a few dollars off the price.

How would I know if it has luminova hands? UV light and see if they still glow brightly?

Yes, they will respond differently to UV. Most important is whether you find the overall look attractive in person when the watch is on your wrist.

[Dr.Smellody]

Sigma!

[mobster600]

The turn engine bezel is the least desirable of the 1600 DJ’s. But the dial is nice

[madigral]

Originally Posted by mobster600

The turn engine bezel is the least desirable of the 1600 DJ’s. But the dial is nice

Lol, that’s exactly why I love it. Fluted DJs never did anything for me. To each their own, I guess.

[Vlad]

Originally Posted by mobster600

The turn engine bezel is the least desirable of the 1600 DJ’s. But the dial is nice

it's hard to agree with such blanket statement, as 1603 with blue buckley dial and white hands is about as rare as any given (ok, excluding first 100) datejust

... correction - 16030

[Richard Carver]

Originally Posted by mobster600

The turn engine bezel is the least desirable of the 1600 DJ’s. But the dial is nice

LOL, no it isn't...













OP, sorry, got carried away. :) The watch looks good, check the gasket channel for corrosion and check the number of links on the bracelet. I noticed the one showing is only 8 links, a full bracelet is 22 links not counting the 55 end links.

[circles]

Check the case engraving carefully. The area were the model number is looks awfully nice for a watch of that age that had a Jubilee on it.

[SunTzu]

Originally Posted by mobster600

The turn engine bezel is the least desirable of the 1600 DJ’s. But the dial is nice

I have a 16030 with a Buckley dial and turn engine. Hardly "least desirable."

[threeputtbogey]

Looks like a really nice piece!

[zapokee]

Originally Posted by Richard Carver

The watch looks good, check the gasket channel for corrosion and check the number of links on the bracelet. I noticed the one showing is only 8 links, a full bracelet is 22 links not counting the 55 end links.

Do as you're told. Carver has this down.

[steversaurus]

Looks like a nice blue sigma dial. Hard to tell, but is there chipping at the edge of the ~42 minute mark? Still the price isn't terrible. The hands can be fixed relatively easy and bracelets can be restored if there is too much stretch.

[madigral]

Originally Posted by circles

Check the case engraving carefully. The area were the model number is looks awfully nice for a watch of that age that had a Jubilee on it.

Is this to check that it's not some other 160x that has been re-engraved to 1603 and had a new bezel put on, or?

[mobster600]

1601 fluted bezel w/linen dial - most sought after/most expensive
1600/1601 smooth or fluted w/slate grey white font- very sought after / can be just as or more expensive as linen dial

1600- smooth bezels are rare IDK why, great buy w/ any dial

HIGHLY recommend you get a linen or slate dial- but you will pay up for one but is worth it

Or you can listen to these guys and get a great deal on a 1603 nobody wants.......it’s your choice

[Dan S]

I think it's pretty obvious that you should buy what you like regardless of what others think. I enjoy my 1603.

[SunTzu]

Originally Posted by mobster600

Or you can listen to these guys and get a great deal on a 1603 nobody wants.......it’s your choice

That makes zero sense. Linen dials fluted bezel on a 1601 are not rare. Google it and you'll see them for sale sub $3,500.

"Nobody" wants a blue sigma dial?

One buys a watch because it speaks to them not because its supposedly rarer.

[swish77]

The blue ones are tough to find, so if you love it, go for it, although the hands are definitely newer, which would bug me, and you're missing a couple of lume plots. Still, perhaps there's no need to be as super picky with these old cool DJs.

One thing .... I'd want to see the serial number engraving. The reference number looks a little different/bigger than engravings I'm used to seeing, although maybe it's just the angle/lighting of the photo. Also, the engravings changed a little through the years, so who knows. (See two attached examples to see the difference.) Do you have a movement photo?

[mobster600]

Originally Posted by SunTzu

That makes zero sense. Linen dials fluted bezel on a 1601 are not rare. Google it and you'll see them for sale sub $3,500.

"Nobody" wants a blue sigma dial?

One buys a watch because it speaks to them not because its supposedly rarer.

Originally Posted by mobster600

The turn engine bezel is the least desirable of the 1600 DJ’s. But the dial is nice

The blue dial is really nice, I’m not a fan of the turn engine bezel. See my first post

$3500 is ALOT for a 16xx- unless it’s MINT. You need to do your research, I bought a GREAT condition 1601 2 months ago for $2350.

I feel like I’m lecturing now...... good luck everyone

[madigral]

Originally Posted by swish77

Do you have a movement photo?

Sadly, I do not, but I am buying it from a business who is warrantying it for 6 mo., plus I plan to get my AD to take a look/do a service as soon as I have it in hand.

[SunTzu]

Originally Posted by mobster600

$3500 is ALOT for a 16xx- unless it’s MINT.

I agree. I think the asking price is a bit high. I mentioned that in the first post. Others did too. You don't see a blue sigma dial without corrosion that often, certainly less than a linen dial with fluted bezel.

But, if it's what he truly wants, overpaying a bit now will be none issue years from now and he'll have all the enjoyment in the interim. A truly mint condition blue sigma dial is not too common especially for $2,350.00.

[swish77]

[QUOTE=mobster600;9576119] $3500 is ALOT for a 16xx- unless it’s MINT. You need to do your research, I bought a GREAT condition 1601 2 months ago for $2350. [QUOTE]

Was it a blue sigma dial? Like all vintage Rolexes, the dial is the key. Heck, forget blue. One little line of red can more than double the price of a 1680 Sub.

For context, I sold my blue dial 16030 DJ for $4200 about 15 months ago, although it was a full set. If I still had it, I wouldn't take less than $5K for it now.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=578283

[SunTzu]

My all original 1980 DJ 16030 with turn engine bezel. Bracelet restoration and polish.






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[madigral]

Thanks everyone for all the help and insights--I ended up pulling the trigger on this one! I think the seller pics didn't really do it justice. It's just stunning in person. I had the seller throw it on his timegrapher and it's showing -2s/d with its last service in 2008, so I'm just blown away by that. It has been handed over to my AD for service, and I'm missing it already. Anyway, obligatory wrist shot and thanks a bunch!

[SunTzu]

Congratulations! Very cool. Looks fantastic in the light. Nice contrast with the British tan lizard strap. Glad you're getting it serviced and taking care of it so you'll have years of good use.

Wear it well!

[Richard Carver]

Welcome to the 1603 club where making an ass of oneself over other's watch choices simply isn't done old boy. :) Congratulations! It's a beauty!

[Verdi]

Looks good, congrats!

Were you able to bring the price down a bit considering it needs a service?