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justdate · 26 December 2015, 12:55 PM

Hi there. I really love the 5205R-010 (the black dial version). Normally I buy watches pre-owned or on the 'grey' market to get a good 20%+ off RRP. However with the 5205R-010 there is very little supply, so buying new from an AD seems to be the only real way to get one at the moment.

I am in the UK and just wanted to see if anyone had any idea of how much a regular AD might look to discount the watch by (if at all) from the list price. Also, buying a PP 5205R new from the AD... dare I ask what sort of depreciation hit is taken when walking out of the store and trying to sell back to the trade?

Thanks for any info on this specific model or in general, I'd love to go ahead and get one, but would like to go in with my eyes open, understanding how much buying new from an AD is going to end up costing me.

rebel_1 · 26 December 2015, 01:08 PM

I can't speak towards the depreciation, but it seems I've seen them for sale on here for around $39,500 US or so.

kneedeep · 26 December 2015, 02:18 PM

IMO in this softening watch market, sub $40k should be achievable via reputable grey market sellers. You'd need to get 20% off from an AD to match this. Doubt an AD will do this unless you have a very strong long-term purchase relationship already established.

KarlS · 26 December 2015, 02:32 PM

But it in UK and get someone to get the 20% VAT back for you.

kilyung · 26 December 2015, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kneedeep

IMO in this softening watch market, sub $40k should be achievable via reputable grey market sellers. You'd need to get 20% off from an AD to match this. Doubt an AD will do this unless you have a very strong long-term purchase relationship already established.

If I'm not mistaken, retail is $46,000 USD. 20% off would be $36,800 - well below used prices. Not impossible to get from an AD but you'd have to have a solid relationship.

cervantes · 26 December 2015, 04:53 PM

A good relationship with an AD good net you 10 to 15 % off list price. But that model is thin on the ground so it would be difficult. Regarding depreciation, there really is no straight formula, but check out chrono24 and see what used prices on that model go for from trusted sellers.

Copasetic · 27 December 2015, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kneedeep

IMO in this softening watch market,

Why do you feel we are in a softening market?

Copasetic · 27 December 2015, 02:10 AM

I have had discussions regarding deprecation with a couple of the larger volume trusted sellers I have done business with this year. I tend to flip too often, so I always ask what kind of hit the piece I'm considering will take on a trade a year or two down the road.

Obviously, they can't predict the market, but my experience from these discussions is that, GENERALLY, a brand new watch from a trusted seller here will quickly depreciate 20 to 25% and a pre-owned model 10 to 15%.

Lots of factors play into this that can change these numbers, but I suggest these are general rules of thumb.

Rinjani · 27 December 2015, 03:30 AM

It is my understanding that the black dial cost more than the white dial. It is also a very difficult watch to find from AD, they will tell you its at least 2 years waiting list. As for the price anything around 40k-42k is a good buy. I believe there is very little depreciation on this watch. Good luck on the hunt!!

justdate · 27 December 2015, 03:41 AM

Ok thanks for the advice. We have had a price drop in the UK this year which means AD list price is around 45k USD. So I don't think that there would be a huge discount buying used, however I think that in the next 2-3 years as the secondary market supply increases, maybe there will be bigger discounts on used ones.

jon_jon · 27 December 2015, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Copasetic

Why do you feel we are in a softening market?

Quote:

Originally Posted by kneedeep

IMO in this softening watch market, sub $40k should be achievable via reputable grey market sellers. You'd need to get 20% off from an AD to match this. Doubt an AD will do this unless you have a very strong long-term purchase relationship already established.

Markets are soft in certain cities/countries and still very strong in other cities like NYC, London, Singapore, etc.

Best prices are found in small to medium sized cities that do not have HNWIs (high net worth individuals) who either live nearby or visit the area regularly.

sgwatch · 27 December 2015, 10:43 AM

Is retail in the USA $46,000 or $48,000? Thanks.

kilyung · 27 December 2015, 11:18 AM

$46,000

sgwatch · 27 December 2015, 02:49 PM

Thanks. I had seen $48,000 a couple of places, and thought my AD had said $48,000. But I've also seen $46,000 in gray market sites. I know many Patek prices were cut 7% in the US earlier this year, but thought the 5205 was reduced less. Hmmm...

thomaspp · 27 December 2015, 03:43 PM

5205r Black dial continues to be my favorite watch. It's just versatile, sexy and the rose gold case magic. Good luck in getting yours!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TimeOnHand · 27 December 2015, 04:21 PM

Used 5205R Black is selling for $34,500 USD in HK!

KarlS · 27 December 2015, 04:53 PM

The 5205 with a deployment buckle is GBP 27995 excl VAT in London. The deployment is an add on. The only downside to the black dial is that whilst I loved the watch the hands against the back ground made it a struggle for me to tell the time...and a waytch has to be functional as well for me.

HL65 · 27 December 2015, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimeOnHand

Used 5205R Black is selling for $34,500 USD in HK!

I know of another that sold last week to a friend for low $30's also. The market is very soft right now so you need to buy right like any other watch.

Muzz · 27 December 2015, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KarlS

The 5205 with a deployment buckle is GBP 27995 excl VAT in London. The deployment is an add on. The only downside to the black dial is that whilst I loved the watch the hands against the back ground made it a struggle for me to tell the time...and a waytch has to be functional as well for me.

Wow!! I just purchase one (WG) in Singapore for 2992 USD literally just picked it up today.

You are correct about the black dial and hands but I am use to it

Muzz · 27 December 2015, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HL65

I know of another that sold last week to a friend for low $30's also. The market is very soft right now so you need to buy right like any other watch.

I picked up my NIB WG black dial for 32. I think it was 3 weeks ago Ken.

red1108nyc · 28 December 2015, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzz

I picked up my NIB WG black dial for 32. I think it was 3 weeks ago Ken.

The WG black is my favorite iteration. If I re-shuffle the collection, I want to add one next year! Congrats bud!

Vipes · 28 December 2015, 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzz

I picked up my NIB WG black dial for 32. I think it was 3 weeks ago Ken.

Did you get this at an AD? Great price and congrats!

Passionata · 28 December 2015, 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HL65

I know of another that sold last week to a friend for low $30's also. The market is very soft right now so you need to buy right like any other watch.

You mean for this particular model or for watches in general?

Muzz · 28 December 2015, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by red1108nyc

The WG black is my favorite iteration. If I re-shuffle the collection, I want to add one next year! Congrats bud!

Thanks Fred!! It is a nice reference. Always wanted the 5130 but in person the 5205 sang a little louder. Wears really nice on the wrist and during the day or in decent lighting the hands are still quite legible to me.

Muzz · 28 December 2015, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vipes

Did you get this at an AD? Great price and congrats!

, it was definitely at my Grey hook up. My AD had one but we didn't discuss the price as I was sure they could not compete with that price. The deployant I picked up was however through Patek. Surprisingly they were able to get it in very quickly, under 2 weeks (shocking fast in my opinion).

HL65 · 28 December 2015, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Passionata

You mean for this particular model or for watches in general?

Watches in general...Buyers market so buy right as no reason not to.

texex91 · 28 December 2015, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HL65

Watches in general...Buyers market so buy right as no reason not to.

It only gets better in Jan and Feb

HL65 · 28 December 2015, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by texex91

It only gets better in Jan and Feb

Agree 100%

iazrollie · 28 December 2015, 10:48 AM

I wouldn't buy a Patek in this market if you intend to flip. You'll sell for 20-25% off list. While some have sold for higher, don't forget that includes the dealer's spread with you wont capture unless you sell directly.

willski · 28 December 2015, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HL65

Watches in general...Buyers market so buy right as no reason not to.

Interesting, and seen the same sentiment in other places. Why do you think that is?

26 December 2015, 12:55 PM	#1
justdate "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Real Name: RJ Location: UK Coast Watch: PP/AP/Rolex Posts: 1,329	Buying New 5205R - Discount & Depreciation? Hi there. I really love the 5205R-010 (the black dial version). Normally I buy watches pre-owned or on the 'grey' market to get a good 20%+ off RRP. However with the 5205R-010 there is very little supply, so buying new from an AD seems to be the only real way to get one at the moment. I am in the UK and just wanted to see if anyone had any idea of how much a regular AD might look to discount the watch by (if at all) from the list price. Also, buying a PP 5205R new from the AD... dare I ask what sort of depreciation hit is taken when walking out of the store and trying to sell back to the trade? Thanks for any info on this specific model or in general, I'd love to go ahead and get one, but would like to go in with my eyes open, understanding how much buying new from an AD is going to end up costing me.

27 December 2015, 03:43 PM	#15
thomaspp "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: N/A Posts: 11,136	5205r Black dial continues to be my favorite watch. It's just versatile, sexy and the rose gold case magic. Good luck in getting yours! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ Instagram: @watches_anonymous

27 December 2015, 04:21 PM	#16
TimeOnHand "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Real Name: Kevin Location: Hong Kong Watch: Rolex Air-King Posts: 4,468	Used 5205R Black is selling for $34,500 USD in HK! __________________ Instagram: timeonhand1010

28 December 2015, 10:48 AM	#29
iazrollie "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Real Name: Ian Location: NY Watch: All of them Posts: 3,245	I wouldn't buy a Patek in this market if you intend to flip. You'll sell for 20-25% off list. While some have sold for higher, don't forget that includes the dealer's spread with you wont capture unless you sell directly. __________________ Rolex, PPs, Breitling

26 December 2015, 01:08 PM	#2
rebel_1 "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Florida Posts: 2,132	I can't speak towards the depreciation, but it seems I've seen them for sale on here for around $39,500 US or so.

26 December 2015, 02:18 PM	#3
kneedeep "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: Not 2 far from u Posts: 3,457	IMO in this softening watch market, sub $40k should be achievable via reputable grey market sellers. You'd need to get 20% off from an AD to match this. Doubt an AD will do this unless you have a very strong long-term purchase relationship already established.

26 December 2015, 02:32 PM	#4
KarlS Banned Join Date: Nov 2015 Real Name: Karl Location: Kuwait Posts: 5,228	But it in UK and get someone to get the 20% VAT back for you.

26 December 2015, 04:53 PM	#6
cervantes "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Real Name: Jay Location: East and West Posts: 1,894	A good relationship with an AD good net you 10 to 15 % off list price. But that model is thin on the ground so it would be difficult. Regarding depreciation, there really is no straight formula, but check out chrono24 and see what used prices on that model go for from trusted sellers.

27 December 2015, 02:10 AM	#8
Copasetic "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Real Name: Howie Location: USA Watch: AP, Patek & Rolex Posts: 501	I have had discussions regarding deprecation with a couple of the larger volume trusted sellers I have done business with this year. I tend to flip too often, so I always ask what kind of hit the piece I'm considering will take on a trade a year or two down the road. Obviously, they can't predict the market, but my experience from these discussions is that, GENERALLY, a brand new watch from a trusted seller here will quickly depreciate 20 to 25% and a pre-owned model 10 to 15%. Lots of factors play into this that can change these numbers, but I suggest these are general rules of thumb.

27 December 2015, 03:30 AM	#9
Rinjani "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Nowhere Watch: 5164,5205r,16610 Posts: 83	It is my understanding that the black dial cost more than the white dial. It is also a very difficult watch to find from AD, they will tell you its at least 2 years waiting list. As for the price anything around 40k-42k is a good buy. I believe there is very little depreciation on this watch. Good luck on the hunt!!

27 December 2015, 03:41 AM	#10
justdate "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Real Name: RJ Location: UK Coast Watch: PP/AP/Rolex Posts: 1,329	Ok thanks for the advice. We have had a price drop in the UK this year which means AD list price is around 45k USD. So I don't think that there would be a huge discount buying used, however I think that in the next 2-3 years as the secondary market supply increases, maybe there will be bigger discounts on used ones.

27 December 2015, 10:43 AM	#12
sgwatch "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Seattle Posts: 432	Is retail in the USA $46,000 or $48,000? Thanks.

27 December 2015, 11:18 AM	#13
kilyung 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cave Watch: Sundial Posts: 33,870	$46,000

27 December 2015, 02:49 PM	#14
sgwatch "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Seattle Posts: 432	Thanks. I had seen $48,000 a couple of places, and thought my AD had said $48,000. But I've also seen $46,000 in gray market sites. I know many Patek prices were cut 7% in the US earlier this year, but thought the 5205 was reduced less. Hmmm...

27 December 2015, 04:53 PM	#17
KarlS Banned Join Date: Nov 2015 Real Name: Karl Location: Kuwait Posts: 5,228	The 5205 with a deployment buckle is GBP 27995 excl VAT in London. The deployment is an add on. The only downside to the black dial is that whilst I loved the watch the hands against the back ground made it a struggle for me to tell the time...and a waytch has to be functional as well for me.

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