Submariner Crown Guards Bad polish?

[Onikage]

I think it better move in with me. Before someone puts it in landfill..

[SubMarine]

You’re showing a highly polished and refinished watch. Haha

Originally Posted by swish77

Nothing wrong with the crown guards, IMHO. I think the reason they look off to some observers is that it's rare nowadays to see the original shape because so many have been polished and rounded off.

I think the case on the OP's example might have been touched up, slightly polished, but the original squared look of the crown guards was mostly left intact. You want to see that ridge line at the crown guards because it usually indicates a watch that hasn't been polished, or minimally polished.

For comparison, here are some photos of my (former) 14060 Sub that had an unpolished case.

[Seibei]

[BisonHead]

Looks fine, mines the same and has not been polished

[xjeeunitx]

definitely not right. look carefully how its chopped off. it is supposed to be rounded out.

[123Blueface]

I am far from an expert on this reference but all it takes is a few clicks and plenty of them to be found looking the same as OP’s.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by 123Blueface

I am far from an expert on this reference but all it takes is a few clicks and plenty of them to be found looking the same as OP’s.

Originally Posted by BisonHead

Looks fine, mines the same and has not been polished

Have to agree a very good example but today once you mention polish the anti polish brigade steps in, but most would not tell a good or bad polish from there ars# or there elbow.

[Swede71]

Camera angles and camera lights can trick you big time in watch pictures - just saying.



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[Seibei]

The watch the OP is asking about has what in my opinion are nasty origami style polished crown guards. (Some pictures of submariners look somewhat similar but it is probably just due to a reflection. The pictures I posted above show the original shape and it does not have the creases and flat surfaces that the watch the OP is asking about has). Thankfully for the owner of that watch there are many people who don't see it as an issue and don't see the difference between this and the original shape as intended by Rolex, so he might be able to sell it for a good price, even in that state. At they end of the day it is up to the buyer to decide.

Polishing to get rid of minor scratches is not a big deal as far as I am concerned but anything that fundamentally changes the shape of the case is a problem.

OP, what is that watch to you? Are you thinking of buying it?

[Ssunnylee24]

When in ANY doubt, pass along.

[Onikage]

I've honestly never taken much notice as to what models have it and possible years, serials etc. Features like that aren't just polished on by some schmuck. Some Subs obviously came with it from the factory. Do the naysayers honestly think some donkey did it trying to remove scratches?

[JP.]

There's some variation even straight from the factory, at least with the 16600 and 16610/16613.

Check this thread out.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=651394

Here you can see a 14060 with other guard thinner than the other. Not polished.

[Bigblu10]

Originally Posted by Onikage

I've honestly never taken much notice as to what models have it and possible years, serials etc. Features like that aren't just polished on by some schmuck. Some Subs obviously came with it from the factory. Do the naysayers honestly think some donkey did it trying to remove scratches?

Some donkey ground them down with his new Dremel moto tool he received from Santa Claus.

[HogwldFLTR]

As I mentioned earlier the 14060 is a very different animal than the 114060. Not only were the watches different but so were the manufacturing techniques. There was much more hand work done on the 14060s and much greater variation coming out of the factory. Personally I'd be happy with that example. For those who believe every variant in lug shape is caused by over polishing then my recommendation is to stay with the 114060s and modern Rolexes only.

Then again there are plenty without knowledge who find safety in calling every watch over polished and saying it very authoritatively. I wish the claims of knowledge came with their impeccably collected data to support their claims. They also seemingly find an ego boost out of being authorities. I'd say the better part of their credibility lies in the landfill.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by HogwldFLTR

As I mentioned earlier the 14060 is a very different animal than the 114060. Not only were the watches different but so were the manufacturing techniques. There was much more hand work done on the 14060s and much greater variation coming out of the factory. Personally I'd be happy with that example. For those who believe every variant in lug shape is caused by over polishing then my recommendation is to stay with the 114060s and modern Rolexes only.

Then again there are plenty without knowledge who find safety in calling every watch over polished and saying it very authoritatively. I wish the claims of knowledge came with their impeccably collected data to support their claims. They also seemingly find an ego boost out of being authorities. I'd say the better part of their credibility lies in the landfill.

Have to agree with you 100% especially plenty without knowledge.

[gunhose]

Ive never in 30 years seen uneven guards leave the factory that bad. Maybe it's the angle of the photo. If not my opinion is been polished at some point ! juho Now hand finished Pateks yes each case unique !!!

[mihaib]

Originally Posted by Seibei

The watch the OP is asking about has what in my opinion are nasty origami style polished crown guards. (Some pictures of submariners look somewhat similar but it is probably just due to a reflection. The pictures I posted above show the original shape and it does not have the creases and flat surfaces that the watch the OP is asking about has). Thankfully for the owner of that watch there are many people who don't see it as an issue and don't see the difference between this and the original shape as intended by Rolex, so he might be able to sell it for a good price, even in that state. At they end of the day it is up to the buyer to decide.

Polishing to get rid of minor scratches is not a big deal as far as I am concerned but anything that fundamentally changes the shape of the case is a problem.

OP, what is that watch to you? Are you thinking of buying it?

Just saw it on Chrono24, not interested in buying it since I already have an 14060m; I was just curious if it was an issue with it or not since my guards are different. Here is the link:

https://www.chrono24.com/ro/rolex/su...RO&SETCURR=EUR

Thanks to everyone for sharing your opinion, I guess the bottom line is we can’t know for sure and it’s safe to purchase a watch like this from a reputable dealer who knows its history.

[Bigblu10]

The watch has clearly been polished. First of all there is not a single scratch on any of the satin surfaces. Secondly looking at the chrono24 images the springbars are virtually sticking out of the lug holes which indicates the lugs have been thinned down. Spring bars do not poke out of the lug holes on an untouched case. There are better examples out there for sale besides this one.

[envuks]

This thread proves that folks on TRF have trouble determining polished or not polished. I really got a kick out of reading the strong opinions from both sides

[padi56]

Originally Posted by envuks

This thread proves that folks on TRF have trouble determining polished or not polished. I really got a kick out of reading the strong opinions from both sides

No the original post was whether the Submariner Crown Guards had a bad polish, yes the watch has been polished like I would expect most all watches of this age, is it bad I would say no.Some are stating the lugs are very thin with the spring-bars sticking out, I can see no evidence of that.Perhaps just a simple case of different non Rolex slightly longer spring-bars fitted.

[Seibei]

Originally Posted by mihaib

it’s safe to purchase a watch like this from a reputable dealer who knows its history.

Really? Some called "reputable dealers" make a habit of saying that polished watches are unpolished. I have seen it time and time again. I don't think it is safe at all. It is up to you to study the watch in question and decide what is what.

And what is to say that this dealer knows anything about the watches history? Chances are he knows nothing about it. He is just selling the watch as is, and of course he is going to present the watch in a positive light.

[123Blueface]

All this polish, polish, polish talk sounds like Marcia, Marcia, Marcia.

So much to do about nothing.
Amazes me how some prefer a beat up watch over a professionally RSC restored one.
I truly believe that the latter is preferred overwhelmingly by the world’s Rolex owners. Not even close.

[Seibei]

I would much rather buy a new old stock 14060m than a used one. Given the superior condition of a new old stock watch, the rarity, the fact that they almost always come with a full set, then the premium is very much worth it to me. In other words, used, polished examples that may lack documentation seem over priced while unused fully documented watches are under priced.

Furthermore, the fact that a used polished watch commands prices that are close to a brand new one supports my argument. I just can't fathom why anyone would pay the same for a watch that has a polish, unknown history and incomplete paperwork that they would for a brand new watch that comes with the full set. I know it may be hard to get a new one at MSRP, but I think the trouble and wait is very much worth it.

With respect to polished vs unpolished, I don't think there is anything wrong with a light skillful polish. I would prefer the watch in original condition but I don't see a light polish as being a big deal. I do however see problems when an unskilled polisher has taken off too much material, rounded of edges that are meant to be sharp, created exaggerated bevels and fundamentally altered the character of a case. I can't see how anyone can be happy with a watch that has received that kind of treatment.

[springer]

This is quite the thread. I didn't realize there are so many experts here on TRF. We are truly blessed. I guess I need to wander out of the Vintage section more often and broaden my horizons with some words of wisdom from all these "new experts."

My curiosity got the better of me after reading this thread, so I couldn't help but click on the link to the 14060 being "dissected" from Chrono 24. My initial observation was "this 14060 doesn't look too bad." But, as I continued viewing the other photos, it became apparent that the case is clearly over-polished. For those that can't see it - the spring bars are definitely protruding too far through the spring bar lug holes on the bottom lug holes. You can clearly see it in some of the photos, and if you can't, magnify the photos and you'll see it.

With that said, my best regards to all the "faux experts" friends and acquaintances here on TRF.