5205 dial swap, value impact?

[JJ WA]

In a recent thread, a fellow TRF member said he had a dial color swap on his 5205. I might be interested in doing the same for a 5205 that I plan to purchase. Since Patek would not change the certificate after a dial swap, do you believe this would impact the value of the watch in any way? As the dial swap would be performed by Patek itself, I believe the value of the watch should not be affected, but I wonder what your views are.

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by JJ WA

In a recent thread, a fellow TRF member said he had a dial color swap on his 5205. I might be interested in doing the same for a 5205 that I plan to purchase. Since Patek would not change the certificate after a dial swap, do you believe this would impact the value of the watch in any way? As the dial swap would be performed by Patek itself, I believe the value of the watch should not be affected, but I wonder what your views are.

It would bother me as a buyer. If both were the same price, I'm buying the one without the dial swap. Unless you can keep the other dial, which I presume you cannot.

[thomaspp]

I think it will marginally affect the re-sale value. Why not buy the one with the dial you like?

[JJ WA]

Originally Posted by thomaspp

I think it will marginally affect the re-sale value. Why not buy the one with the dial you like?

'Very' difficult to decide. Love both the G models. I could easily regret my choice right after picking one.

[thomaspp]

Originally Posted by JJ WA

'Very' difficult to decide. Love both the G models. I could easily regret my choice right after picking one.

I hear you. I like the black dial more but the legibility on the gray is so much better....

My solution = buy the 5205r black dial


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[s14roller]

Originally Posted by thomaspp

I hear you. I like the black dial more but the legibility on the gray is so much better....

My solution = buy the 5205r black dial


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This

[subtona]

Hmmm.... interesting topic


If the cost a new dial is 2K (a recent quote) and that is the difference in the resale then it is what it is and in the scheme of the price of the watch it may not be that big of a deal.

ps in some cases it will also require a hands swap.

[travisb]

I prefer to keep everything all original.
AP offers the same option and I considered it years ago but ended up selling what I had for an all original dial variation that I wanted more.

[el1125]

Once changes are made from original factory future value usually decreases

[el1125]

Originally Posted by s14roller

This

Agree

[slashd0t]

It'll make it a franken watch.. Don't do it. Significant value hit...

[jon_jon]

With Rolex watches, a lot of people swap the dial and it is not a big deal.

However Patek watches are in a different category. Patek watch owners/collectors are more particular about their watches and most want original condition. If a dial was damaged and needed to be replaced, that is one thing. If I knew a Patek watch dial was swapped, I would not buy it knowing that in advance. I would question what else was swapped inside. For vintage Patek watches, a watch with parts that are not in original condition takes a huge hit on the market price. As for modern watches like the 5205, who knows how they will be looked at 20-30 years from now.

[topcat30093]

I was the owner that the OP is referring to.

I purchased a 5205G with the darker dial when it was 1st released back in 2010.

The darker was great and I loved it, but after a couple of years, I noticed that I struggled with the legibility of the dial & hands.

Unfortunately, somehow I caught one of the pushers which elongated it, causing the pusher to get stuck when depressed.

So, I sent the watch back to the UK service centre and after discussion with then via my AD, they agreed to replace the dial & hands. The cost if memory serves me correctly was in the region of £1,000 and naturally they held onto the old bits!!

I have to say that reading the time was hugely improved.

Eventually, I sold the watch to a grey dealer who I don't think devalued if any. Though of course the certificate showed it as having the darker dial.

I would guess, that from experience & knowledge, that if the Patek is not 100% than you can expect to sell it at a slightly slow price.

That said, you should get a detailed report from Patek via your AD. And hopefully they would have amended their records!

[jon_jon]

Originally Posted by topcat30093

I was the owner that the OP is referring to.

I purchased a 5205G with the darker dial when it was 1st released back in 2010.

The darker was great and I loved it, but after a couple of years, I noticed that I struggled with the legibility of the dial & hands.

Unfortunately, somehow I caught one of the pushers which elongated it, causing the pusher to get stuck when depressed.

So, I sent the watch back to the UK service centre and after discussion with then via my AD, they agreed to replace the dial & hands. The cost if memory serves me correctly was in the region of £1,000 and naturally they held onto the old bits!!

I have to say that reading the time was hugely improved.

Eventually, I sold the watch to a grey dealer who I don't think devalued if any. Though of course the certificate showed it as having the darker dial.

I would guess, that from experience & knowledge, that if the Patek is not 100% than you can expect to sell it at a slightly slow price.

That said, you should get a detailed report from Patek via your AD. And hopefully they would have amended their records!

I am curious if there would be any notation of a dial swap by Patek if you requested a copy of the Extract from the Archives after the 5 year period. It would probably be a good idea to keep the original receipt of Patek having performed the dial swap for resale purposes, unless you don't want to mention it at all during resale.

For a modern watch like the 5205, I don't think a dial swap is a big deal. However for vintage watches, it is a different matter. Some of you may have read about a big lawsuit between well-known musician, John Meyer, and his watch dealer for failure to disclose pertinent information about non-original parts inside vintage watches that he purchased from them.

[JJ WA]

Sorry to revive this old thread. I would still love to hear from more folks on this topic…

Do you really think that swapping a dial color would make the watch less desirable, devaluated or even a ‘Frankenstein’ (as a fellow member seems to suggest above)?

Is that so even if the dial switch were carried out by Patek Philippe itself - not an AD, nor anyone else - and documented by the service order?

[Socal to az]

There are so many watches out there. Especially 5205s. If I'm buying one and debating between two watches, I buy the one without the dial swap.

[Erod24]

Talking about dial swaps can you buy a 5130R and request a 5131R dials to Patek? Would it be the same scenario as this?
Just thinking out load guys.

[goog53]

Being a purist I want it to look exactly how the watch was from
Day one. I have seen some cool 3970s with 5004 dials and my first question is always was the watch born with this dial and do the papers reflect that. If not, I would not be interested. Just my 2cents

[lapince]

some buyers will be put off for sure

[kaiserphoenix]

i would not purchase a watch that has a different dial to the papers.


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[Russell996]

Originally Posted by Erod24

Talking about dial swaps can you buy a 5130R and request a 5131R dials to Patek? Would it be the same scenario as this?
Just thinking out load guys.

Well of course even assuming Patek would change the dial (which they wouldn't) you would also have to change the case since it is unique to the cloisonné enamel dial versions - 1mm deeper profile at 10.6 mm on 5131's compared to 9.6 mm of 5130's. (plus the engraving on the case).

[Erod24]

Originally Posted by Russell996

Well of course even assuming Patek would change the dial (which they wouldn't) you would also have to change the case since it is unique to the cloisonné enamel dial versions - 1mm deeper profile at 10.6 mm on 5131's compared to 9.6 mm of 5130's. (plus the engraving on the case).

Thanks for the info I was thinking the case was the same just with the added engraving.