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mongrelnomoad · 12 November 2020, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ansharma

Czapek could be one to keep an eye on.

Agreed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoraTheExplorerII

Lange has been poised for a while to break out. If more people get on board with the Odysseus that will happen.

Yeah. Well. The issue with the Odysseus isn’t demand...

In the simply sports watch arena, I’d say that because of their quality, the general coherence of their designs, and the fact that they are suitably different to the establishment to carve their own identities, the Czapek Antarctique, Moser Streamliner Centre Seconds and the Bulgari Octo are all prime candidates to break out.

In general terms, I think there’s an outsized chance more casual, more versatile (water resistant case and strap) steel dress watches are the next big thing...

enjoythemusic · 12 November 2020, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

In general terms, I think there’s an outsized chance more casual, more versatile (water resistant case and strap) steel dress watches are the next big thing...

Imho 10000000% agree. 25 and 50 meter resistance are OK, yet 100 meter on up makes it more 'usable' day in and day out 24/7. Also nice to have a new movement properly FILL the case. Strap and bracelet choices with ease of changing is a must-have.

WatchEater666 · 12 November 2020, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

Agreed.
Yeah. Well. The issue with the Odysseus isn’t demand...

They are selling way over MSRP/retail right now. This is somewhat artificial as Lange made it an application piece but it's real enough that when I posted about having an SS en route I got 2 PMs from people about buying it from me if I don't like it.

mongrelnomoad · 12 November 2020, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WatchEater666

They are selling way over MSRP/retail right now. This is somewhat artificial as Lange made it an application piece but it's real enough that when I posted about having an SS en route I got 2 PMs from people about buying it from me if I don't like it.

Yeah, as a Lange owner, I tried to get one too. Didn’t pan out...

Bloomberg · 12 November 2020, 07:29 PM

Lange. It deserves as much as Journe.

Andad · 12 November 2020, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shkure

Czapek is flying under the radar but i think it will explode into the scene once the Antarctique starts shipping. That is one hell of a watch with a long waitlist already. I predict is the next Chronometre Bleu

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Does a “breakout” require availability?

mongrelnomoad · 12 November 2020, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andad

Does a “breakout” require availability?

Full disclosure: when Lange refused my application for an Odysseus, I ordered one of the original Czapek Antarctiques. From what I understand from the (very friendly and open) company, there will be a new version with a different dial design (numerals at 12) at the end of the year.

shkure · 15 November 2020, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

Full disclosure: when Lange refused my application for an Odysseus, I ordered one of the original Czapek Antarctiques. From what I understand from the (very friendly and open) company, there will be a new version with a different dial design (numerals at 12) at the end of the year.

Yep

And i hear it will not be limited by number but only by production capacity. So... very limited

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mongrelnomoad · 15 November 2020, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Imho 10000000% agree. 25 and 50 meter resistance are OK, yet 100 meter on up makes it more 'usable' day in and day out 24/7. Also nice to have a new movement properly FILL the case. Strap and bracelet choices with ease of changing is a must-have.

How cool would it be to have a steel Calatrava, 100m+ water-resistance, on a rubber strap?

So much of the resistance to dress watches is solely in how impractical they are... time for a shake-up for sure.

dchang81 · 15 November 2020, 10:27 AM

That sounds like an aquanaut

enjoythemusic · 15 November 2020, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dchang81

That sounds like an aquanaut

Sure does, had two of 'em (wife and I matching).

The Bvlgari Octo S is far better imho. Movement is more advanced, it properly fills the case, equally or moreso decorated, and much more modern style. Better bracelet and warranty too.

mongrelnomoad · 15 November 2020, 07:50 PM

I have an Aquanaut. It isn’t an Aquanaut.

mongrelnomoad · 15 November 2020, 11:28 PM

I mean something like this 5196 in 38-40mm, in steel, with 100m water resistance and a rubber or similarly robust, comfortable, and water-proof strap....

The reason I'm buying another sports watch is that I need the practicality. Give me an alternative that will function as well as a daily, and I'll take it!

Codik · 16 November 2020, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

I mean something like this 5196 in 38-40mm, in steel, with 100m water resistance and a rubber or similarly robust, comfortable, and water-proof strap....

The reason I'm buying another sports watch is that I need the practicality. Give me an alternative that will function as well as a daily, and I'll take it!

I would buy that watch immediately.

mongrelnomoad · 16 November 2020, 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Codik

I would buy that watch immediately.

See? They’ve already sold two! 😂

Pw92676 · 16 November 2020, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Strap and bracelet choices with ease of changing is a must-have.

I wholeheartedly agree. I think this was the wave of the future that already began but was diminished by the sport watch/steel phenomenon. But I think it will re-emerge and be essential.

I really admire the VC Overseas that does this, even though I do not have one. Could you imagine if Rolex did this? I would LOVE a yellow gold skydweller with an easily interchangeable oysterflex band, leather strap and president bracelet. One can dream lol.

pierson · 19 November 2020, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Etschell

need i say more??

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mongrelnomoad · 19 November 2020, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pierson

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That last one is amazing - reminds me of the Japanese bowls made expressly to resemble turtles' shells. Moser?

pierson · 20 November 2020, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mongrelnomoad

That last one is amazing - reminds me of the Japanese bowls made expressly to resemble turtles' shells. Moser?

Yes! Just bought her.

Limited Moser Endeavour mosaic

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ddaneh · 20 November 2020, 03:54 AM

Probably Gronefeld or Journe

mongrelnomoad · 20 November 2020, 04:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pierson

Yes! Just bought her.

Limited Moser Endeavour mosaic

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Congratulations! What a gorgeous watch! Enjoy her in good health...

raclaims · 20 November 2020, 04:55 AM

Interesting info on Laurent Ferrier...I really like their stuff...yet I tried to buy the new SS sport model tourbillon...I've never worked harder to try to spend a ton of money on a watch and in the end they totally disappeared on me...so poorly handled. I was like how the heck could they not want to sell this thing?? Explains why they have $$ issues.

DoraTheExplorerII · 20 November 2020, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raclaims

Interesting info on Laurent Ferrier...I really like their stuff...yet I tried to buy the new SS sport model tourbillon...I've never worked harder to try to spend a ton of money on a watch and in the end they totally disappeared on me...so poorly handled. I was like how the heck could they not want to sell this thing?? Explains why they have $$ issues.

That would’ve been a super cool acquisition....what is wrong with them???

snarkq · 20 November 2020, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raclaims

Interesting info on Laurent Ferrier...I really like their stuff...yet I tried to buy the new SS sport model tourbillon...I've never worked harder to try to spend a ton of money on a watch and in the end they totally disappeared on me...so poorly handled. I was like how the heck could they not want to sell this thing?? Explains why they have $$ issues.

Get it used for 50% off

unknown · 20 November 2020, 06:11 PM

Look for independents that just started and do deliver exceptional work. Could be in finishing or something with complications. Most of the times they do offer their watches at a VERY reasonable price when they just started. They have no name yet and want to test the market.
And if their watches are real horlogerie the demand is always there. So not a kickstarter that launched something new but in fact did nothing special. I mean 99.9% just put some things together and put their name on the dial. Can be beautiful but imo worthless.
On the other hand ... like said ... a REAL watchmaker that just started to make his own watches ... that's what you need to look for.

5 years ago we had Pascal Coyon. He made a simple dress watch and started from a Unitas. But he completely modified the movement and gave it a fantastic finishing. He made 60 watches and they were sold out pretty fast. The price was 5000 euro which was a bargain for such a beautiful finished watch / movement. If you know enough about finishing you do recognize these exceptional pieces and you know you just have to buy this for 5K. This is too cheap not to buy.
If these 'new' independents get more followers after their first watch your watch will rise substantially in value on the market. If he does not get the expected recognition you still have a fantastic watch which you got for a very low price.

Another example is the Lecomte I just bought. Absolutely gorgeous watch with a sublime finishing. He only made 10 pieces and ofcourse these sold out in a heartbeat.

Mr Pascal Coyon is now making his second series of watches. The finishing is even a bit better and the steel case is now a gold case. But the price went from 5000 tot 33000 euro ... Why ? Because people know him and the demand was there.

And before some start complaining it should have been a 100% in-house movement and not a ETA/Unitas base ...
When you look at the 2 examples I gave, I hope you see this is no longer a simple Unitas :-) Besides ... Mr Kari Voutilainen used a Peseux 260 for his observatoire and even the master Philippe Dufour used a Valjoux VZSS for his simplicity.

So My answer would be:
Forget about the already well known names like Moser, Lange, Ferrier, ... they are all great and would love to have some of them. But I think you should look at the kind of watchmakers I just spoke about.
If they would become the next big thing and you own one of the very first ... fantastic, right ?
If they don't get the recognition they deserve, you still own a fantastic watch that would have cost 3-4 times more if it had a more known brandname on the dial

jenniferjanef · 21 November 2020, 05:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eiesh

MB&F....

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IMHO .. MB&F and URWERK is already out there with the big boys such as Richard Mille.

Rexplorer214270 · 21 November 2020, 09:17 AM

Merci

edhahn44 · 24 November 2020, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raclaims

Interesting info on Laurent Ferrier...I really like their stuff...yet I tried to buy the new SS sport model tourbillon...I've never worked harder to try to spend a ton of money on a watch and in the end they totally disappeared on me...so poorly handled. I was like how the heck could they not want to sell this thing?? Explains why they have $$ issues.

That’s interesting. I also like the piece very much. Is it actually 41 or 44mm, since I’m finding different sizes, depending the source.

There is one on Chrono24 with the rubber bracelet.

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shkure · 25 November 2020, 11:58 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yT_Uxw2La6o&t=521s

Good video to complement our discussion.

RollinMoses · 27 November 2020, 04:48 AM

Travel clocks

20 November 2020, 06:11 PM	#55
unknown "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Europe Posts: 2,799	easy, I think Look for independents that just started and do deliver exceptional work. Could be in finishing or something with complications. Most of the times they do offer their watches at a VERY reasonable price when they just started. They have no name yet and want to test the market. And if their watches are real horlogerie the demand is always there. So not a kickstarter that launched something new but in fact did nothing special. I mean 99.9% just put some things together and put their name on the dial. Can be beautiful but imo worthless. On the other hand ... like said ... a REAL watchmaker that just started to make his own watches ... that's what you need to look for. 5 years ago we had Pascal Coyon. He made a simple dress watch and started from a Unitas. But he completely modified the movement and gave it a fantastic finishing. He made 60 watches and they were sold out pretty fast. The price was 5000 euro which was a bargain for such a beautiful finished watch / movement. If you know enough about finishing you do recognize these exceptional pieces and you know you just have to buy this for 5K. This is too cheap not to buy. If these 'new' independents get more followers after their first watch your watch will rise substantially in value on the market. If he does not get the expected recognition you still have a fantastic watch which you got for a very low price. Another example is the Lecomte I just bought. Absolutely gorgeous watch with a sublime finishing. He only made 10 pieces and ofcourse these sold out in a heartbeat. Mr Pascal Coyon is now making his second series of watches. The finishing is even a bit better and the steel case is now a gold case. But the price went from 5000 tot 33000 euro ... Why ? Because people know him and the demand was there. And before some start complaining it should have been a 100% in-house movement and not a ETA/Unitas base ... When you look at the 2 examples I gave, I hope you see this is no longer a simple Unitas :-) Besides ... Mr Kari Voutilainen used a Peseux 260 for his observatoire and even the master Philippe Dufour used a Valjoux VZSS for his simplicity. So My answer would be: Forget about the already well known names like Moser, Lange, Ferrier, ... they are all great and would love to have some of them. But I think you should look at the kind of watchmakers I just spoke about. If they would become the next big thing and you own one of the very first ... fantastic, right ? If they don't get the recognition they deserve, you still own a fantastic watch that would have cost 3-4 times more if it had a more known brandname on the dial __________________ Instagram : @collectible_watches

12 November 2020, 07:29 PM	#35
Bloomberg "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Paris Posts: 85	Lange. It deserves as much as Journe.

15 November 2020, 10:27 AM	#40
dchang81 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,041	That sounds like an aquanaut

15 November 2020, 07:50 PM	#42
mongrelnomoad "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: Here and there... Posts: 1,843	I have an Aquanaut. It isn’t an Aquanaut.

15 November 2020, 11:28 PM	#43
mongrelnomoad "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: Here and there... Posts: 1,843	I mean something like this 5196 in 38-40mm, in steel, with 100m water resistance and a rubber or similarly robust, comfortable, and water-proof strap.... The reason I'm buying another sports watch is that I need the practicality. Give me an alternative that will function as well as a daily, and I'll take it!

20 November 2020, 03:54 AM	#50
ddaneh "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: us Posts: 22	Probably Gronefeld or Journe

20 November 2020, 04:55 AM	#52
raclaims "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: NJ Posts: 2,584	Interesting info on Laurent Ferrier...I really like their stuff...yet I tried to buy the new SS sport model tourbillon...I've never worked harder to try to spend a ton of money on a watch and in the end they totally disappeared on me...so poorly handled. I was like how the heck could they not want to sell this thing?? Explains why they have $$ issues.

21 November 2020, 09:17 AM	#57
Rexplorer214270 "TRF" Member Join Date: Jun 2019 Location: New England Watch: BLRO;PP5230G Posts: 544	Merci

25 November 2020, 11:58 PM	#59
shkure Banned Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Europe Posts: 371	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yT_Uxw2La6o&t=521s Good video to complement our discussion.

27 November 2020, 04:48 AM	#60
RollinMoses "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Europe Posts: 322	Travel clocks

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