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Old 5 September 2019, 06:33 PM   #1
Moggo
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Pilot Chronograph recommendation

Hi all,

Looking to add a pilot watch to my collection, seem to gravitate towards divers so looking for something different.

My budget is about £2.5k and wondered what you recommendations would be, not too big, so around 40mm case and black dial I think?

Thanks all.


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Old 5 September 2019, 09:30 PM   #2
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Have you looked at Fortis or Sinn...

Hereís a Fortis B-42, but itís not that small itís 42mm plus thick.....






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Old 5 September 2019, 09:49 PM   #3
Moggo
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Looking at Sinn 356 with sapphire glass as I am clumsy!

Seems very little savings on it from new, not sure how good value it is? Would look at bracelet version I think.


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Old 5 September 2019, 11:02 PM   #4
Dan Pierce
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggo View Post
Looking at Sinn 356 with sapphire glass as I am clumsy!

Seems very little savings on it from new, not sure how good value it is? Would look at bracelet version I think.


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Just wanted to mention how much I love my Sinn 757 UTC. Sinn makes great pilot watches.

Good luck!
dP
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Old 5 September 2019, 11:38 PM   #5
PJ S
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggo View Post
...

My budget is about £2.5k and wondered what you recommendations would be, not too big, so around 40mm case and black dial I think?
Ö
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggo View Post
Looking at Sinn 356 with sapphire glass as I am clumsy!

Seems very little savings on it from new, not sure how good value it is? Would look at bracelet version I think.

...
Instead of asking for an endless stream of suggestions, why not spend time looking at those which meet your desired criteria on Chrono24/Google, then draw up a list of potential candidates.
A discussion about the pros & cons of each to see if it helps whittle them down to two or three for you to go see/try on/take a punt on.
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Old 5 September 2019, 11:59 PM   #6
Moggo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Pierce View Post
Just wanted to mention how much I love my Sinn 757 UTC. Sinn makes great pilot watches.



Good luck!

dP


Thanks Dan, that looks like a nice watch, used to seeing your Tudors.

Will take a closer look.


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Old 6 September 2019, 12:03 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PJ S View Post
Instead of asking for an endless stream of suggestions, why not spend time looking at those which meet your desired criteria on Chrono24/Google, then draw up a list of potential candidates.

A discussion about the pros & cons of each to see if it helps whittle them down to two or three for you to go see/try on/take a punt on.


Thanks PJ, I did narrow the criteria a fair bit but obviously not enough for you, sorry I rattled your cage.

The reason for asking was to get some direction regarding brands and value etc

Spend a large amount of time in the Rolex section, should have stayed there


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Old 6 September 2019, 01:53 AM   #8
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^
Yes, you may have narrowed the criteria…. but which watches have you looked at, meet it?
You’re free to move around this forum however you wish, but most of us conduct a modicum of research ourselves, before asking others to chip in with alternatives we may be aware of or had forgotten about.
Do you only want new or is pre-owned okay?
Do you only want to look at brands you’re familiar with or does lesser known ones appeal equally?

When you’re researching, use the word Flieger rather than rely on Pilot bringing all the results.
And, fwiw, I’d probably steer away from chronographs, since they’re all going to be fairly thick due to using the ETA 775x/Sellita SW500 movements, which have a fair degree of rotor wobble that some people don’t like the feel of.
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Old 6 September 2019, 02:55 AM   #9
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When youíre researching, use the word Flieger rather than rely on Pilot bringing all the results.
And, fwiw, Iíd probably steer away from chronographs, since theyíre all going to be fairly thick due to using the ETA 775x/Sellita SW500 movements, which have a fair degree of rotor wobble that some people donít like the feel of.
I second the above re thickness and rotor wobble on the more affordable automatic chronos. Had an IWC GST Chrono w a Valjoux 7750 based movement and it did not last due to rotor wobble and noise...

If I was the OP I'd look at the IWC Mark XV Fliegeruhr, Ref 3253, and, if it has to be a chrono, the corresponding IWC Flieger Chrono Ref 3706. Both are timeless classics from a brand well known for its Flieger pieces and within budget. I would stay clear of their more recent offerings though as the brand very much lost it after being bought by Richemont in the early 2000s...
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Old 6 September 2019, 03:03 AM   #10
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Right.....

Budget £2.5K
Black dial
40mm or thereabouts
Chronograph if possible
New as it will be a keeper
Bracelet

Looked into Sinn, lots of models but know little about them as a brand.

Doesnít have to be a big brand, quality more important and value.

Nothing ruled in or out, really just wondering if someone can point me in the direction of the brands and models to look at. Canít be anymore specific at this stage, apologies.

Really just started the hunt and hoped for some pointers.


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Old 6 September 2019, 03:06 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ts3 View Post
I second the above re thickness and rotor wobble on the more affordable automatic chronos. Had an IWC GST Chrono w a Valjoux 7750 based movement and it did not last due to rotor wobble and noise...



If I was the OP I'd look at the IWC Mark XV Fliegeruhr, Ref 3253, and, if it has to be a chrono, the corresponding IWC Flieger Chrono Ref 3706. Both are timeless classics from a brand well known for its Flieger pieces and within budget. I would stay clear of their more recent offerings though as the brand very much lost it after being bought by Richemont in the early 2000s...


Many thanks, will take a look.


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Old 6 September 2019, 03:44 AM   #12
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Sinn are good value....plenty of bang for buck.
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Old 6 September 2019, 05:55 AM   #13
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If mint condition becomes an option, I believe you can find pre-owned IWC pilot chronos within your budget. Good luck with the hunt!

Edit. Chrono or not, some Pilot Watch eye candy here:

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthre...t+watch+thread

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Old 6 September 2019, 06:04 AM   #14
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Lots to choose from in this space. Iím a fan of the new IWC Spitfire chrono. My choice was the Zenith CP-2.



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Old 6 September 2019, 08:17 AM   #15
PJ S
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggo View Post
Right.....

Budget £2.5K
Black dial
40mm or thereabouts
Chronograph if possible
New as it will be a keeper
Bracelet

Looked into Sinn, lots of models but know little about them as a brand.

Doesn’t have to be a big brand, quality more important and value.

Nothing ruled in or out, really just wondering if someone can point me in the direction of the brands and models to look at. Can’t be anymore specific at this stage, apologies.

Really just started the hunt and hoped for some pointers.
Stowa
Tourby
Guinand
Biatec
Tutima
JS Watch

You won’t see them listed by name on Chrono24, but may find some listed through searching.

I really wouldn’t worry about it having to be new, since it’s yours once you’ve paid for it.
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Old 8 September 2019, 03:35 AM   #16
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Save a little more and get this...
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Old 8 September 2019, 07:00 AM   #17
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IWC or Breitling
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Old 8 September 2019, 12:28 PM   #18
jenniferjanef
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Breitling re-edition 806 .. slightly over budget but a worthy contender IMHO.

Happy shopping!
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Old 8 September 2019, 12:57 PM   #19
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Laco or Archimede make nice ones in your budget
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Old 9 September 2019, 05:08 PM   #20
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I’ve been looking at getting a Pilot-style chrono myself lately! I had a ETA 7750 equipped Sinn U1000 which I sold to put towards an 114060; a choice I am happy with as the watch, while well made and unique, was far too large and heavy for me. However, I found myself missing my chronograph, so I went looking for another, starting in your price bracket.

As some have said, most auto-chronos in that price range are going to have an ETA7750 or derivative fitted in them, such as a SW500 or indeed IWCs new chrono movement. These movements are wide and tall, so you won’t find auto chronos fitted with them at much below 38mm wide and 13mm thick. The ETA7750 is also a bit loud and has a characteristic ‘wobble’ which I (personally) find endearing. Movement preferences are a bit like dog breeds, what one person will love another will find unbearable :)

The good news is there are some excellent choices around, especially regarding German Pilot watches. I would personally point you towards:

Sinn - these people have been making high tech high value watches for a long time, and are very, very worth a look.
Damasko - Sinn’s competiton, really. Younger, keener, and have a similar number of good tech and patents, although different to Sinns. I especially like their crown system and Si balance.
Stowa - high quality traditional german watches.
Laco - lower cost than those above, but still expect German build quality. They have some nifty ‘aging’ / patination tech.

For my personal perspective I ultimately decided to save for the new IWC bronze spitfire chrono, which someone highlighted above, based purely on aesthetics; I would struggle to wear any other sober, black-faced and steel watch over my 114060, but am genuinely excited to try on that green and bronze beauty. Tech-wise it houses a Richemont movement that is basically 7750 inspired with a column wheel, and a few extra jewels; any of the above are as cool and robust, really, I think. One could probably even make the case that the Sinn and Damasko are more robust watches than the IWC.
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Old 10 September 2019, 09:33 AM   #21
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in addition to those mentioned above, I'd throw in the Breguet XX. It's a bit above your current budget but comparable to IWC price wise , but size wise it's about right. Respected brand, not a bad looking watch + extra points for being unusual out in the wild...
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Old 12 September 2019, 05:06 AM   #22
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You might be able find one of these still - Sinn 103 SA BE.

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Old 16 September 2019, 04:40 AM   #23
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Pilot Chronograph recommendation

I would keep on saving a bit more for an IWC Pilot chrono - they are great watches and can be had for a good price pre-owned.

My advice would be not to worry about rotor wobble, when I used to have my LPP chrono before giving to my brother, the feeling of it moving as one wears it was actually most enjoyable (and something I sometimes miss with my diver) although itís obviously different for other wearers.

Itís also a very widely used and reliable movement.

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Old 25 September 2019, 11:54 AM   #24
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Consider a pre-owned Zenith 'El Primero' Pilot Chronograph (Ref. 03.2117.4002). Won't find a more revered column wheel chrono movement, one that was legend enough to make its way into the Rolex Daytona for the 12 years between 1988 and 2000, albeit with extensive modifications including the downgrading of the hallmark 36,000 beat rate. 42mm but wears more like a 40mm due to its moderately-sized bezel/in-board telemeter scale combo, and boasts a relatively thin profile at only 12.3mm floor-to-ceiling. Pictured is mine on wrist. Have yet to see one on a steel bracelet, but the OEM rubber-lined supple alligator side-stitched strap that it comes on, coupled with Zenith "star" deployment, makes for a sharp-dressed man (or woman who likes a larger-diameter case). I don't think Zenith coupled a bracelet with this particular pilot reference, but I'm not sure. A pre-owned one can possibly be found in your price range or is worth saving for, however they don't come up terribly often and sell fairly quickly when they do.
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Old 25 September 2019, 12:12 PM   #25
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An old Friend is a former SR-71 Blackbird Pilot and Retired NASA research Pilot. Those boys like Breitling a lot.
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Old 26 September 2019, 02:39 AM   #26
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Tutima Pioneer Mk I (or Mk II, or TachyTele).
Tutima and Hanhart were the two original suppliers of pilot chronographs to Luftwaffe.
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Old 26 September 2019, 07:38 PM   #27
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How about any of these automatic chronographs -




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