Mar 1 Price Increase

[psm11]

Originally Posted by In-N-Out

Which current ROOs are trading at 50% off msrp? Even divers are trading barely below msrp these days

There have been a bunch of 43 ROOs (mainly the stainless version) in mint condition listed on Moda for mid 30ks. When you factor in taxes that is close to 50% off. I saw one sold yesterday for $34k on MODA (used but mint).

[macrowatch]

Originally Posted by messikens

I don't get it frankly - my RO is now literally $4k more expensive and I bought it at the beginning of 2022...?!? Why the need to increase prices 3x a yer by a few percentage points? Stick to 1 adjustment per year (or 18 months) and be done with it.
Starting to become a bit gougy, especially since by the time you blink it's gone up yet again...

Dont come with the inflation argument either, I get it from a retail or food perspective, but we're talking luxury trinkets with relatively minimal raw material costs.

Watch elves in Switzerland eat a lot of food...plus all the logistics of getting the food to Le Brassus...

@edwardc, I may not like paying for the prices, but I can understand for example why Chanel has hiked prices so much to distance the 'elite' perspective from LVMH, and I'm sure something similar is happening strategy wise to cloose the gap vs Natalus SS prices, etc while also distancing further away from Rolex prices.

[Watchandhoop]

Originally Posted by psm11

There have been a bunch of 43 ROOs (mainly the stainless version) in mint condition listed on Moda for mid 30ks. When you factor in taxes that is close to 50% off. I saw one sold yesterday for $34k on MODA (used but mint).

Its nowhere near 50%. 50% of the final taxed price would be around 22-23k.

[psm11]

Originally Posted by Watchandhoop

Its nowhere near 50%. 50% of the final taxed price would be around 22-23k.

Isn’t MSRP after taxes like $50k? So maybe not close to half off but it’s huge delta and getting even bigger.

[messikens]

Originally Posted by psm11

Isn’t MSRP after taxes like $50k? So maybe not close to half off but it’s huge delta and getting even bigger.

Depends on how you define "close to 50%" :-)

After tax depending on location you're talking around $48k for a ROO. So if some of the sales prices are around 35-37k on MODA, that's still around a healthy 25-28% off...

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by psm11

Yeah, I am shocked they raised the price of these given they are going for nearly 50% off on the secondary market.

Do you have links to the current ROOs (new/mint, full set hopefully) going for "nearly 50% off" - there are several I'd be happy to buy on the spot at that price (taupe/grey/Music edition 43mm, baby blue 42mm, green diver and a bunch of others).

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by psm11

Isn’t MSRP after taxes like $50k?

Average sales tax in the US is ~5%. Highest state sales tax is 7.25%. $42k * 1.0725 is 45k, which is not "like $50k". Not to mention that sales tax is irrelevant, as the used watches are subject to sales or use tax as well.

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by EdwardC

In contrast this makes me feel brands like Omega are more responsible and sensitive to the economy. They increased prices too, but way less frequent than the true luxury brands.

LOL. Two years ago, the current Speedy Pro was introduced at €6,100 for the Hesalite version. In early 2022, that went to €6,700, then to €7,100 in Sep 22 and now to €7,500 in Feb 23.

[thecrownprince]

Originally Posted by VogelPhoenix

Average sales tax in the US is ~5%. Highest state sales tax is 7.25%. $42k * 1.0725 is 45k, which is not "like $50k". Not to mention that sales tax is irrelevant, as the used watches are subject to sales or use tax as well.

Not true it’s 10.25% for Los Angeles

[NYG1121]

Panerai 2.0

[EdwardC]

Originally Posted by VogelPhoenix

LOL. Two years ago, the current Speedy Pro was introduced at €6,100 for the Hesalite version. In early 2022, that went to €6,700, then to €7,100 in Sep 22 and now to €7,500 in Feb 23.

at least it's a new reference, right?

[psm11]

Originally Posted by thecrownprince

Not true it’s 10.25% for Los Angeles

Yeah in LA it’s north of 10 percent. Also, I have never paid sales tax on a grey market watch.

[Armis]

Originally Posted by psm11

Yeah in LA it’s north of 10 percent. Also, I have never paid sales tax on a grey market watch.

Are taxes paid on Moda purchases?
I believe that’s the case with Chrono24, but that wasn’t the case in its earlier days. But I wouldn’t expect that from Moda since it’s a community marketplace, unless I’m mistaken.

[psm11]

Originally Posted by Armis

Are taxes paid on Moda purchases?
I believe that’s the case with Chrono24, but that wasn’t the case in its earlier days. But I wouldn’t expect that from Moda since it’s a community marketplace, unless I’m mistaken.

As far as I can tell unless the post mentions buyer has to pay tax then you don’t have to. I didn’t on the watch I bought off there

[GB-man]

Might want to keep that to yourself. Whether the seller collects tax or not the burden remains on you to self report on your tax form.

[wb55]

Originally Posted by Vivalas

In that case at 600 sheets cheaper, I’m buying

On the train to Londinium right now

A £300 reduction for my ROO 43. Was hoping for an increase as partial insulation!

Good to see you posting and hope you’re getting the steps in for the walking group!

[Vince_76]

Originally Posted by VogelPhoenix

Average sales tax in the US is ~5%. Highest state sales tax is 7.25%. $42k * 1.0725 is 45k, which is not "like $50k". Not to mention that sales tax is irrelevant, as the used watches are subject to sales or use tax as well.

False information.

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by thecrownprince

Not true it’s 10.25% for Los Angeles

Post said State sales tax. Total sales tax for every boutique (further corrections welcome):
Boston: 6.25%
Bal Harbour: 7%
South Coast Plaza: 7.75%
Dallas: 8.25%
Las Vegas: 8.38%
East Hampton: 8.63%
Manhasset: 8.63%
NYC: 8.875%
Atlanta: 8.9%
Aspen: 9.3%
Beverly Hills: 10.25%
Chicago: 10.25%

So, 43mm CE bezel steel ROO with median sales tax of ~8.4% is $45750, give or take. Still not $50k.

Taxachusetts for the win, btw.

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by psm11

Yeah in LA it’s north of 10 percent. Also, I have never paid sales tax on a grey market watch.

Sure, taxes on grey market purchases are easier to evade, although people also used to have new watches shipped out of state.

[Vince_76]

Originally Posted by VogelPhoenix

Post said State sales tax. Total sales tax for every boutique (further corrections welcome):
Boston: 6.25%
Bal Harbour: 7%
South Coast Plaza: 7.75%
Dallas: 8.25%
Las Vegas: 8.38%
East Hampton: 8.63%
Manhasset: 8.63%
NYC: 8.875%
Atlanta: 8.9%
Aspen: 9.3%
Beverly Hills: 10.25%
Chicago: 10.25%

So, 43mm CE bezel steel ROO with median sales tax of ~8.4% is $45750, give or take. Still not $50k.

Taxachusetts for the win, btw.

I’m not verifying all of those, but I think SCP is higher based on personal experience.

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by EdwardC

at least it's a new reference, right?

No, 6100 Euro was the introductory price for the 3861 Speedy with hesalite/bracelet in 2021: https://www.fratellowatches.com/new-...nal-moonwatch/

Now it's 7500 Euro (w/ 20% VAT) ~ 23% in 2 years. Some of the Euro increase was to compensate for exchange rate fluctuations, but that's not much of a consolation for those paying that price. Price in CHF has gone up from 5800 to 6600 CHF, ~14% in two years.

[VogelPhoenix]

Originally Posted by Vince_76

I’m not verifying all of those, but I think SCP is higher based on personal experience.

I looked up Costa Mesa, which I thought is where SCP is located. May be missing the 1.5% "special district tax". Including that changes the median by 0.3% or so, $125 on the ROO.

[noobs]

Originally Posted by thecrownprince

Not true it’s 10.25% for Los Angeles

side question: bought a watch at gearys back in december and "only" paid 9.5%. do stores in the same area apply different sales tax?

[psm11]

Regardless of what the tax is, ROO are significantly under MSRP on the secondary market (to the tune of 5 figures).

[grahammackay86]

Originally Posted by psm11

Regardless of what the tax is, ROO are significantly under MSRP on the secondary market (to the tune of 5 figures).

So you’ve gone from “50% off” RRP to 5 figures. Why is the first new condition current model offshore advertised on moda asking for $40,000 then? Stop posting false information.

And if they’re so cheap go buy them all then, lucky you.

[NTCP8]

ROO divers go below retail, at least here in Hong Kong. The blue and grey divers are going for for 188HKD (retail is 234k HKD), the green version goes for 220k HKD. You probably can negotiate 1 - 3k HKD off the asking price.

[mickyd329]

Originally Posted by VogelPhoenix

I looked up Costa Mesa, which I thought is where SCP is located. May be missing the 1.5% "special district tax". Including that changes the median by 0.3% or so, $125 on the ROO.

The sales tax here in Orange County is 7.75%, but it looks like Costa Mesa (where SCP is) has a 1.5% special tax for a total of 9.25%.

[thecrownprince]

Originally Posted by VogelPhoenix

Post said State sales tax. Total sales tax for every boutique (further corrections welcome):
Boston: 6.25%
Bal Harbour: 7%
South Coast Plaza: 7.75%
Dallas: 8.25%
Las Vegas: 8.38%
East Hampton: 8.63%
Manhasset: 8.63%
NYC: 8.875%
Atlanta: 8.9%
Aspen: 9.3%
Beverly Hills: 10.25%
Chicago: 10.25%

So, 43mm CE bezel steel ROO with median sales tax of ~8.4% is $45750, give or take. Still not $50k.

Taxachusetts for the win, btw.

The state sales tax is not the full sales tax so it’s irrelevant. I’m just correcting you so that people don’t think major US cities are paying less.

I’m not going to a store and expect to pay 7.25% sales tax at the Beverly Hills boutique although that’d be cool to save close to $3k when buying a QP or equivalent piece.

That being said I never cared as I’m just happy to get the watch. But I’ve had a lot of friends say oh US price is cheaper - if you calculate taxes then most of the time EU prices is better across most luxury brands.

[psm11]

Originally Posted by grahammackay86

So you’ve gone from “50% off” RRP to 5 figures. Why is the first new condition current model offshore advertised on moda asking for $40,000 then? Stop posting false information.

And if they’re so cheap go buy them all then, lucky you.

Why so angry? So I exaggerated a bit. But why in the world is AP raising prices on things that are selling for 5 figures under MSRP? What listing in Moda? There have been numerous in the last two weeks listing the steel version for around $35k.

[Palex]

Originally Posted by psm11

Yeah, I am shocked they raised the price of these given they are going for nearly 50% off on the secondary market.

This has to be a picture of you, writing this post: