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Old 12 May 2023, 08:40 PM   #1
robertengel
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Patek Salons - only selling inside their own country?

Hi everyone, after my trusted AD is losing their relationship with Patek I have tried contacting Salons, to gauge their attitudes. One of them said they now only serve people inside their country and that it's now globally true for all points of sale. Has anyone else been told this?
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Old 12 May 2023, 08:40 PM   #2
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Hi everyone, after my trusted AD is losing their relationship with Patek I have tried contacting Salons, to gauge their attitudes. One of them said they now only serve people inside their country and that it's now globally true for all points of sale. Has anyone else been told this?

True for the most part. There will always be exceptions to the rule.
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Old 12 May 2023, 08:54 PM   #3
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Hi everyone, after my trusted AD is losing their relationship with Patek I have tried contacting Salons, to gauge their attitudes. One of them said they now only serve people inside their country and that it's now globally true for all points of sale. Has anyone else been told this?
In 2019 Geneva said they have their hands full serving their local clientele and longstanding wealthy customers flying in from around the world.
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Old 12 May 2023, 09:41 PM   #4
robertengel
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Hilariously even if I were willing to play the game I couldn't because there isn't one in my current country of residence. Bye Bye Patek :D
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Old 12 May 2023, 10:44 PM   #5
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In 2019 Geneva said they have their hands full serving their local clientele and longstanding wealthy customers flying in from around the world.
A relative of mine who’d been client of the Geneva Salon for many years were also told that they cannot help them now. They reside in Asia and travel to Europe quite frequently until the pandemic.
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Old 12 May 2023, 11:21 PM   #6
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Unless you have the local address with proof, I was told.
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Old 12 May 2023, 11:49 PM   #7
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Hi everyone, after my trusted AD is losing their relationship with Patek I have tried contacting Salons, to gauge their attitudes. One of them said they now only serve people inside their country and that it's now globally true for all points of sale. Has anyone else been told this?
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True for the most part. There will always be exceptions to the rule.
Agree. If you are a whale, they will want your business.
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Old 13 May 2023, 01:01 AM   #8
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Consider renting a cheap apartment in geneva. I bet you'd pay less than the folks buying watches they don't want!
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Old 13 May 2023, 01:04 AM   #9
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Well, many countries don't have ADs, so those people have to buy somewhere. My guess is Patek doesn't want their salons overrun with folks who are struggling to get a watch from their local AD.
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Old 13 May 2023, 02:31 AM   #10
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In London they asked me for proof of address. I'm not sure if that has more to do with AML or for customer geographic restrictions.
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Old 15 May 2023, 12:44 PM   #11
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Hi everyone, after my trusted AD is losing their relationship with Patek I have tried contacting Salons, to gauge their attitudes. One of them said they now only serve people inside their country and that it's now globally true for all points of sale. Has anyone else been told this?
I posted a response to this in another thread... and the answer is Yes this happened to me.

My neighboring country dealer, whom I've had a history of purchases over the past many years stopped responding to my queries...

Our last conversation was regarding my local address in that country...
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Old 15 May 2023, 12:45 PM   #12
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In London they asked me for proof of address. I'm not sure if that has more to do with AML or for customer geographic restrictions.
They did this to me too...in SEA.
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Old 15 May 2023, 12:45 PM   #13
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Agree. If you are a whale, they will want your business.
Not true in the Paris PP boutique, they will not sell to you if you aren't a local...and they do not accept cash anymore.
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Old 15 May 2023, 01:39 PM   #14
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I am baffled by Patek’s strategy. It seems to me that they’re alienating a lot of their customers who’ve been loyal for years to the brand, as well as new clients.

I realize that the demand outstrips the supposed supply but if this ever flips they may not be in an ideal situation. I suppose they could revert back to their old ways of need be.


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Old 15 May 2023, 07:06 PM   #15
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I guess most people will forget their agitation when offered an aquanaut or nautilus, but it is very off-putting. In the case of Rolex, they sell over a million watches and not a lot of things are truly rare, and customers can easily find another point of sale. In the case of Patek I find it odd that they don't engage with the customers of ADs that they remove from their network. It's kinda like free money, free customers with history. Not saying they should bump you on any new Salon list, but at least somehow manage the relationship centrally to make them feel....less like a disposable money printer? AP did the boutique route but I feel like they care more and want to attract more customers for the long run.
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Old 15 May 2023, 07:13 PM   #16
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Salons should balance new customers and existing customers within their country, as a priority, and then cater for outsiders in certain specific circumstances - I perfectly understand this model and applaud it. I am pretty sure that some exceptions could be made, depending on the timing of the visit and others things.
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Old 15 May 2023, 09:18 PM   #17
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It seems like a fail to me however I guess there are plenty of other brands that are going the same direction although with less demand for their non-hype pieces.
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Old 15 May 2023, 10:43 PM   #18
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Not true in the Paris PP boutique, they will not sell to you if you aren't a local...and they do not accept cash anymore.
Maybe not Paris, but both London and Geneva have special areas where VIPs flying in on their private jets from around the world are led to a private room to view their special order watches. Paris is a bit of an anomaly as they are the only Patek AD in the country whereas both the UK and Switzerland have multiple Patek ADs.
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Old 15 May 2023, 11:53 PM   #19
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I am baffled by Patek’s strategy. It seems to me that they’re alienating a lot of their customers who’ve been loyal for years to the brand, as well as new clients.

I realize that the demand outstrips the supposed supply but if this ever flips they may not be in an ideal situation. I suppose they could revert back to their old ways of need be.


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AP is worse, there are no AD's with their boutique only model which are not in every market. At least PP has dealers that cover more local markets.
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Old 16 May 2023, 05:47 AM   #20
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AP is worse, there are no AD's with their boutique only model which are not in every market. At least PP has dealers that cover more local markets.
I can't comment on AP.

Yes, PP still has ADs to cover local markets but many of those have been getting shut down in droves in recent years. My family regularly purchased from our local PP AD prior to their license being pulled in 2020. We were thrown out with the bath water.

If we take my personal experience and extrapolate it across all the ADs PP has closed in recent years, it's not unreasonable to presume there are a multitude of long-standing clients in a similar situation. Probably only a portion of them will actively seek out a relationship with a new PP AD/salon. I can tell you first-hand, no one from my family (other than myself), has tried to start a new relationship. I tried one last time earlier this year with an AD near where I have a vacation home. He inquired how much time I spend there annually, I said 1-2 months, to which he replied "Until now the guidelines have been to prioritize full-time XXX residents."


After three years, and not much headway, I've given up. Love the brand but will not be jumping through hoops for ADs. It was too much of a headache and timesuck to deal with. Hence why their strategy, or lack thereof, baffles me.
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Old 16 May 2023, 06:54 AM   #21
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I can't comment on AP.

Yes, PP still has ADs to cover local markets but many of those have been getting shut down in droves in recent years. My family regularly purchased from our local PP AD prior to their license being pulled in 2020. We were thrown out with the bath water.

If we take my personal experience and extrapolate it across all the ADs PP has closed in recent years, it's not unreasonable to presume there are a multitude of long-standing clients in a similar situation. Probably only a portion of them will actively seek out a relationship with a new PP AD/salon. I can tell you first-hand, no one from my family (other than myself), has tried to start a new relationship. I tried one last time earlier this year with an AD near where I have a vacation home. He inquired how much time I spend there annually, I said 1-2 months, to which he replied "Until now the guidelines have been to prioritize full-time XXX residents."


After three years, and not much headway, I've given up. Love the brand but will not be jumping through hoops for ADs. It was too much of a headache and timesuck to deal with. Hence why their strategy, or lack thereof, baffles me.
I am in your shoes, local AD shut down as well, two actually that I dealt with. Now there are still two others we have but neither do I have a relationship with nor do they seem keen on starting one. I tried to get my 5226 from either and nope, ended up going gray for a Calatrava. Unreal.

So I get what you are saying but at least we have them. AP doesn't even offer that, my closest AP boutique is 300 miles away. Now that's a joke since I had a good relationship with two AP dealers prior to their pivot and now do not even have a boutique anywhere near me.

I am somewhat over it all myself. I have acquired some really nice pieces over the years and just enjoy what I have. If things settle down and I can get back in easily, great. If not, whatever. First world problems.
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Old 16 May 2023, 07:26 AM   #22
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I am somewhat over it all myself. I have acquired some really nice pieces over the years and just enjoy what I have. If things settle down and I can get back in easily, great. If not, whatever. First world problems.
My thoughts exactly as well


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Old 16 May 2023, 07:59 AM   #23
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I guess most people will forget their agitation when offered an aquanaut or nautilus, but it is very off-putting. In the case of Rolex, they sell over a million watches and not a lot of things are truly rare, and customers can easily find another point of sale. In the case of Patek I find it odd that they don't engage with the customers of ADs that they remove from their network. It's kinda like free money, free customers with history. Not saying they should bump you on any new Salon list, but at least somehow manage the relationship centrally to make them feel....less like a disposable money printer? AP did the boutique route but I feel like they care more and want to attract more customers for the long run.
I agree with you but you also have to understand how much the demand outstrips the supply.

maybe exaggerated but a seemingly knowledgable SA in the Geneva salon told me that they could sell all 60-65k watches in their one Geneval salon - if not that for sure in all of their own three salons + NYC + maybe the Chinese "maisons".
TS said many times that he wants to run a watch company and not a retail company hence the AD network, which is independent and as such the customers are really only linked to the ADs. Unfortunate, yes but I doubt that they really can do something about it.
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Old 16 May 2023, 10:43 AM   #24
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My (former) Patek AD asked me what, if anything, I was doing for Patek and the answer was if I’m going to buy more I’m going gray. Unfortunately with everything trending boutique it’s going to be hard to get anything from them other than Rolex/Tudor in the future, but you never know I guess.
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Old 16 May 2023, 05:16 PM   #25
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Patek experience in Geneva is two sided. You either get flagged as poor (not owning a villa in Geneva outskirts) or good client (friendly with managers with hundred of k of spend history).

Since 99.99% of people fall in the first category, going to the salon is a nice experience, if you want to gaze at non working watches. Sometime they will get out a real one, and explain to you the history of the brand and so on, and even give you invites to the museum.

But other than that, visit the salon knowing nothing is going to be exchanged.
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Old 17 May 2023, 10:15 AM   #26
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Those pesky poors!
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Old 17 May 2023, 11:46 AM   #27
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I can't comment on AP.

Yes, PP still has ADs to cover local markets but many of those have been getting shut down in droves in recent years. My family regularly purchased from our local PP AD prior to their license being pulled in 2020. We were thrown out with the bath water.

If we take my personal experience and extrapolate it across all the ADs PP has closed in recent years, it's not unreasonable to presume there are a multitude of long-standing clients in a similar situation. Probably only a portion of them will actively seek out a relationship with a new PP AD/salon. I can tell you first-hand, no one from my family (other than myself), has tried to start a new relationship. I tried one last time earlier this year with an AD near where I have a vacation home. He inquired how much time I spend there annually, I said 1-2 months, to which he replied "Until now the guidelines have been to prioritize full-time XXX residents."


After three years, and not much headway, I've given up. Love the brand but will not be jumping through hoops for ADs. It was too much of a headache and timesuck to deal with. Hence why their strategy, or lack thereof, baffles me.
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I agree with you but you also have to understand how much the demand outstrips the supply.

maybe exaggerated but a seemingly knowledgable SA in the Geneva salon told me that they could sell all 60-65k watches in their one Geneval salon - if not that for sure in all of their own three salons + NYC + maybe the Chinese "maisons".
TS said many times that he wants to run a watch company and not a retail company hence the AD network, which is independent and as such the customers are really only linked to the ADs. Unfortunate, yes but I doubt that they really can do something about it.
Based on the current market, I don’t doubt that Patek could sell 90% of their watches produced with a handful of ADs and their 3 salons. Given that, I can see why they’re only focusing on major geographical markets. It’s the unfortunate reality and there just isn’t value for them to have so many ADs.

It’s a big brand and they’re quite sophisticated; seeing and reading a number of interviews of TS, he’s clearly thinking deeply and long term. That tells me that Patek must has modeled what the growth (and even predicted contraction) would be like over the next 10+ years and Patek sees no value (and maybe even detrimental for them operationally) to have small market ADs. If you were a manufacturer and you could deal with 100 ADs that sells 98% of your watches or 500 ADs that sells 99% of your watches, what would you pick? Patek also has to deal with “not allocating enough” to their ADs and complaints from them.
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Old 17 May 2023, 09:37 PM   #28
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I agree with you but you also have to understand how much the demand outstrips the supply.

maybe exaggerated but a seemingly knowledgable SA in the Geneva salon told me that they could sell all 60-65k watches in their one Geneval salon - if not that for sure in all of their own three salons + NYC + maybe the Chinese "maisons".
TS said many times that he wants to run a watch company and not a retail company hence the AD network, which is independent and as such the customers are really only linked to the ADs. Unfortunate, yes but I doubt that they really can do something about it.
Yea that's a fair point but was probably also said during the unprecedented demand surge, I am sure it will come down SOMEWHAT even if it won't be simple in the near future.
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Old 18 May 2023, 11:45 AM   #29
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Demand far exceeds supply. As such, they have all the power to do as they please. Perhaps at some point the tables will turn.
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Old 18 May 2023, 07:16 PM   #30
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Officially, at the Salons, they know that people are getting upset with this situation and they have to explain better why they can't supply while making them to wait. They are aware that there will be downturns and that they must be careful not to put clients off.

However, how an AD (not a Salon) decides to award a piece is still depending on the AD itself, i.e. its will to make money while the market is hot versus pleasing a new/young client they can't know what potential is.
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