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10 May 2021, 02:38 AM | #1 |
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laser welding by LAWW- damage value?
Does having a watch laser welded and recut by LAWW damage the value, collectability and/ or turn away potential buyers?
Of course I would rather have a watch that was never laser welded and recut...but if the alternative is a poor example with rounded lugs, then I might prefer it. Can you tell if a watch has been laser welded? Is it normally disclosed by dealers? Can dealers tell? It is probably one of those instances where if the condition is too good to be true, it probably is. |
10 May 2021, 02:47 AM | #2 |
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I would buy a watch that has been lazer welded by LAWW , They are recognised as the best in the business and I don’t think you would even know if they didn’t declare it
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10 May 2021, 02:56 AM | #3 |
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I think it kind of ruins the watch’s originality. I think it’s never the same at that point.
Same with redoing lume plots with old dead lume. Once you understand this has been done, what else has been altered ? Hands? Movement? If the mid case has corrosion and you want to fill that in,I’m sympathetic to that repair. |
10 May 2021, 03:07 AM | #4 |
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Please show photos. It's impossible to answer this question without seeing the watch you are considering. It totally depends on the condition prior to refinishing.
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10 May 2021, 03:13 AM | #5 |
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This post is meant to be more of a hypothetical question about laser welding so there are no specific pictures.
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10 May 2021, 03:17 AM | #6 |
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I sincerely don't think it can be answered hypothetically since it depends so much on the condition of the case and the rest of the watch. Each watch needs to be evaluated individually IMO.
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10 May 2021, 03:36 AM | #7 |
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I agree! It depends on how the watch looked before. If it makes sense to that sort of operation due to damage to the case or other then it would probably be okay to most buyers but not the hardcore vintage collectors maybe...it also helps if it’s a well respected workshop like LAWW that has made the work (keep the receipt: ) )
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10 May 2021, 04:02 AM | #8 |
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If the case is toast, I’d have it rewelded. If it’s in good shape I think I’d prefer a normal amount of patina and minor wear.
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10 May 2021, 04:03 AM | #9 | |
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An overly re-made example might not be worth as much as a well worn example.
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10 May 2021, 08:31 AM | #10 |
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Originality, I would say yes...
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10 May 2021, 08:55 AM | #11 | |
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I think one aspect can be presumed. Methinks the final value wouldn’t be affected under these conditions: 1) A seller has a watch laser welded properly it wouldn’t be noticed by 99% of buyers. 2) Such a sale made without disclosing the work to an unwary buyer. Not cool but is likely done more than we know. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
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10 May 2021, 09:24 AM | #12 | |
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Has the refinish affected the value in a case like this? We can't know without seeing the case before the restoration. If the case showed honest wear but was still attractive, then the refinish probably did hurt the value. However, if the case was rounded smooth with cratered lug holes, then the watch was never going to appeal to a collector anyway, and refinishing the case will make it appealing to a larger group of potential buyers.
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10 May 2021, 09:29 AM | #13 |
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I agree Dan that a wise collector would not pay top $…
But the vast number of buyers have no clue and pay the currently high resale value. So that is how I gauge it. Over the 1000 sales that will be made nationwide next week, maybe 25 are expertly refinished. Another 100 poorly done. But for the 10 that are sold to wise collectors, all will get near their top $ asking price. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
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11 May 2021, 02:13 AM | #14 |
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Is laser welding synonymous with refinishing??
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11 May 2021, 02:18 AM | #15 |
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No.
Refinishing is simply restoring the original finish whether it be a brushed finish or a polished finish. Laser welding is a repair process and actually adds metal, or repairs and fills cracks and breaks. After the welding process the metal then needs to be properly refinished. There are only a few places that do welding repairs.
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11 May 2021, 02:58 AM | #16 |
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laser welding by LAWW- damage value?
This was a really worn, over polished, 1675. It had a dismal future to continue on, in its current state, in my opinion. So, I had the case corrected by LAWW.
This work was disclosed when I sold it. It was worth a little more than I paid when I sold it, but I put a ton of money into the project. I broke even. I had to find a correct service dial and color the hands. The existing dial was a horrible relume job. Also added a RedBack insert, which had a hefty cost. I wanted to put the watch back to correct. For me, on this piece, putting the GMT back to correct was the right call. It just needed to be done. Every watch is different. Welding is not always the right call. It depends. I see many examples for sale which have clearly been welded. Look at the crisp, flat edges of lug holes. Even a minimal polishing will soften and crater the edges of the lug hole a little. Almost every time the edges of of the lug hole (on a 30 year old watch) are crisp, flat, sharp, it’s been welded. https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=632286
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11 May 2021, 03:00 AM | #17 | |
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11 May 2021, 03:06 AM | #18 | |
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Your soft case was still fat at the right places but poorly polished in the past. These craters can be easily avoided by closing them prior polishing. I would have had sellers remorse letting that watch go. A restoration like this does have a lot of added value imho
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11 May 2021, 06:40 AM | #19 |
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To Bladeshot:
I read all of the original post. Did they add any metal at all in restoring the case? It looks like there is more "meat" around the lug holes and for $700 I assume it would be more than simply polishing the watch. Did they add any amount of metal through laser welding technique? Thanks for your post since it's right on topic- I always like to see before and after photos of LAWW. |
11 May 2021, 06:54 AM | #20 |
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If laser welding was done I would assume there was severe damage to the watch. Laser welding a watch otherwise is dumb if a light or normal polishing could do the job.
Therefore I would say Laser Welding would enhance the value. Being dumb and laser welding when none was needed then yes it will devalue the watch from what it would have been if just a light polish was done. Laser is great when used in the proper situations. |
11 May 2021, 09:33 AM | #21 |
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Patrick, that was a while back and my memory is fuzzy. Apologies. It was several hundred. Can’t recall. Depends on the reference and the amount of work needed. They are delighted to quote work if you reach out.
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11 May 2021, 09:34 AM | #22 | |
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I love projects and can’t keep them all, so I wad glad it had a new home!
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11 May 2021, 09:41 AM | #23 | |
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Yes. Absoutely. They added metal. Can’t make it look like this again without adding metal. Then they “re-cut” the case to provide the proper angles, chamfers, etc. Welding has it’s place and I would undertake it in a restoration of a badly polished or damaged watch. Example: If you have a huge “ding” in a watch there is no way to fix it by grinding off metal. One must add metal and re-profile the area. On a project like mine, disclosure is key. That’s the only fair way to alert a buyer that the watch has been aggressively restored. Caution is warranted when buying vintage. If it is 50 years old and looks like mine, odds are that the case had some restoration and was re-cut. Not always. But most times.
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15 May 2021, 11:58 AM | #24 |
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I wouldn't do it on any of my watches, no matter how many ding or damaged is the case.
I would rather not buy a watch or keep it as it is that restoring the case. That said it's just a matter of taste, there are a lot of people who love recut case (especially dealers). |
15 May 2021, 12:39 PM | #25 | |
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11 August 2021, 02:48 AM | #26 |
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Reviving this thread - I just chatted with LAWW and they said they do not do laser welding to build up worn lugs, only to repair badly damaged spots - said building up can otherwise cause porosity.
Rolliworks is on like 6 months wait for laser welding. Curious for others' thoughts on this, and if there are any other reputable restoration shops (tho it seems like a pretty small world). I've recently acquired an older sea dweller, it's in good shape (2019 service performed by RSC) but lugs are slightly overpolished / nearing the spring bar holes. |
11 August 2021, 03:25 AM | #27 |
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Almost every vintage watch has been polished at some point.
Undoing some of that polishing with expert welding will add value every single time. As long as the seller is upfront I don't see any issue here. |
11 August 2021, 06:47 AM | #28 |
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Do classic cars benefit from body work? Some do. Laser welding would not put me off a watch I plan to not sell.
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11 August 2021, 10:04 AM | #29 |
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My understanding from previous posts, was that the metal is added to fill in scratches and gouges.
That they cannot rebuild lugs, so when they are recutting, It is starting with a thinner polished lug. I think think a knowledgeable buyer would deduct for that. |
11 August 2021, 11:14 AM | #30 |
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LAWW can definitely build up lugs and make them thicker before rechamfering.
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