The Rolex Forums   The Rolex Watch

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX

Old 21 November 2020, 05:47 PM   #61
Sandpit
"TRF" Member
 
Sandpit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Middle East
Posts: 1,807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onikage View Post
More whining. I'm lucky. I have a 16710. All this scrambling about over the new ones is most humorous to me.
As things stand it’s 16610 and out for me for the foreseeable (as far as Rolex goes). I have zero interest in playing the waiting game or paying massive premiums. It’s just time and energy wasted that could be more productive.

So, much like yourself, I sit here thoroughly enjoying my 5 digit whilst catching up with the latest rants on TRF.

Best of luck to those “playing the game” or whatever it is you call it.
Sandpit is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 06:04 PM   #62
Ensign
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: America
Posts: 712
I don’t sweat it any. It’s jewelry afterall.
Ensign is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 06:26 PM   #63
Binky1
"TRF" Member
 
Binky1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: UK
Watch: Sub 16610LN
Posts: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by C0d View Post
1. I am not offended by any of this. I can't afford most of these watches even they were available at MSRP.

2. The fact that some here think this is how a free market should operate is exactly why we have two faction in all faucets of life. I will leave it at that.

3. The post had more to do with AD stickers and the fact that Rolex insists that everyone is abiding by their protocols which obviously isn't the case.

Anyways, those who think this is fair game and they want to play, hey more power to you.

Those who think this isn't they are already refusing to go the Rolex way so good for them.

The fact that everyone talks about it proves that there is more to it than the simple "supply and demand" drum.
If I owned “faucets of life” I would patent them firstly. Then set up an exclusive clinic in Switzerland and charge a fortune. I would then buy an AD from petty cash and have everything I ever wanted...problems solved!
__________________
16610LN | 126710 BLRO | 228235 RG Olive | 126300 Slate | 326934 Blue | G Shock GA2100 | 116500LN White
Binky1 is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 06:55 PM   #64
edingotham
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: I am here
Posts: 127
luckily my AD gets me (eventually) whatever i ask politely ask for at MSRP of course :)
edingotham is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 07:31 PM   #65
horseShu
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Dense Rainforest
Watch: Aqua Terra
Posts: 514
There are basically two groups:
a. those who choose not to ‘play the game’ and have stopped buying or moved on to other brands,
b. those who are still playing the game


I suppose the ones moaning and groaning here are from group b.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
horseShu is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 07:56 PM   #66
Combine man
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Hertfordshire
Posts: 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by teck21 View Post
You make the mistake of assuming most or all new Rolex buyers are in the ‘i deserve a sub at MSRP when I walk into an AD’ club.

For every one such potential customer, there is at least one other one who is happy to buy grey or ‘play the AD game’.

As long as Rolex does not increase production to match demand while keeping MSRP down, the phenomenon you describe in fact strengthens the brand rather than diminish it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Fair comment I take your point,just my view on it all,and I wouldn,t pay over the mrrp.
The brand certainly seems strong whatever.If they met demand do you think the brand would flourish also,I,m not sure?
Combine man is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 08:02 PM   #67
MrJKLFoams
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Australia
Watch: RolexOmegaJLC
Posts: 466
Unfortunately you cant do anything about it. Time will come that rolex watches will be worthless and will be readily available. The more people crave and pay the grey prices its not gonna stop.
MrJKLFoams is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 08:46 PM   #68
subtona
"TRF" Member
 
subtona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Real Name: gus
Location: East Coast
Watch: APK & sometimes Y
Posts: 25,958
Quote:
Originally Posted by C0d View Post
And perhaps offer a different hour hand, the current one is
I noticed when the two hands line up, they form what looks like a sword to me. That made me like it.


Like many of you, I’m also frustrated with the long time experience of lack of availability and remember going to our trusted sellers when they leveraged their volume for a discount on msrp ... they shared that discount with the customers and provided instant gratification. Then as many have pointed out, supply and demand changed all that.


After briefly owning a few of the modern references, I find the 5 digit more to my liking.

interest in other brands has resulted in variety in my collection and more enjoyment than ever.

__________________
subtona is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 08:50 PM   #69
Atlanta
"TRF" Member
 
Atlanta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Real Name: Jack
Location: Atlanta, GA
Watch: 126619LB & 114270
Posts: 767
Quote:
Originally Posted by willywatch View Post
Supply and demand do not blame Rolex for it.
Exactly. Capitalism is a beautiful thing. The free market is at work.
__________________
Member# 14554
Atlanta is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 09:03 PM   #70
Harry-57
2024 Pledge Member
 
Harry-57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Real Name: Harry
Location: England
Posts: 9,541
Quote:
Originally Posted by nucleon View Post
They sell their watches exclusively to the AD's, yes? So they make what they make when the AD sells one.
No. They make what they make when the AD buys one. Once the AD has bought the consignment it belongs to the AD.
Harry-57 is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 09:08 PM   #71
Oxfordian
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Real Name: Martin
Location: England
Watch: 124060 Submariner
Posts: 2,871
Quote:
Originally Posted by C0d View Post
ADs make a fool out of all of us. They feed us lies and some of us actually believe them. Perhaps some of them are still genuine and run honest businesses but most of them are just milking the cash cow the best they can.
If you know the right people and can bring them the cash you can have anything.... They are required toremove stickers right?!?

Attachment 1185164
Please, this may be true for you and your dealings but not for all of us.

My AD is great, I have bought only what I want from the store, the longest wait was 3 weeks.

But you should remember that your AD is a business, they have overheads to pay, if they don't get customers to spend then they go out of business.

If you don't like the business model that your AD uses go and find one that meets your requirements.
__________________
Martin

Small Rolex, Omega, Seiko and Oris Collection
Oxfordian is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 09:12 PM   #72
padi56
"TRF" Life Patron
 
padi56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Real Name: Peter
Location: Llanfairpwllgwyng
Watch: ing you.
Posts: 52,113
Quote:
Originally Posted by C0d View Post
ADs make a fool out of all of us. They feed us lies and some of us actually believe them. Perhaps some of them are still genuine and run honest businesses but most of them are just milking the cash cow the best they can.
If you know the right people and can bring them the cash you can have anything.... They are required toremove stickers right?!?

Attachment 1185164
The more you guys advertise these supposed AD dealings instead of being polite to any AD doing these reported things.After stating these things at AD just walk out of the ADs door with a polite second word is off. Then perhaps we could get back to normal without all this kiss ars# AD relationship stuff .And will add IMHO there are more good ADs in this world than bad,but sadly if you believe every AD post on forum its heading for more bad I sometimes wonder how Rolex sells every watch they make each year..
__________________

ICom Pro3

All posts are my own opinion and my opinion only.

"The clock of life is wound but once, and no man has the power to tell just when the hands will stop. Now is the only time you actually own the time, Place no faith in time, for the clock may soon be still for ever."
Good Judgement comes from experience,experience comes from Bad Judgement,.Buy quality, cry once; buy cheap, cry again and again.

www.mc0yad.club

Second in command CEO and left handed watch winder
padi56 is online now  
Old 21 November 2020, 10:04 PM   #73
zengineer
"TRF" Member
 
zengineer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Michigan
Posts: 4,527
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calatrava r View Post
Rolex cannot meet the current demand, so the after market premium reflects that. Buy or do not buy is all you can do. But never worry about it. Not worth it.
No, Rolex CHOOSES not to meet current demand.

Sent from my SM-T830 using Tapatalk
zengineer is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 10:36 PM   #74
PJitz
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: North
Posts: 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masteryacht View Post
Just adjust your behavior. I have. I’m put off by it and therefore not looking to buy, not calling my AD anymore, not going by my AD, etc. Its just too much of a headache. Things will change and I will be interested in buying again or they won’t. I’m fine either way. Worst case scenario is I keep my money in my pocket instead of giving it to Rolex. I just don’t view that as a bad thing.
Spot on.

The only solution is to stop stressing and moaning about the situation.
PJitz is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 10:36 PM   #75
PJitz
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: North
Posts: 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by zengineer View Post
No, Rolex CHOOSES not to meet current demand.

Sent from my SM-T830 using Tapatalk
Are you making the decisions at Rolex?
PJitz is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 10:47 PM   #76
1William
2024 Pledge Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: North Carolina
Watch: Rolex/Others
Posts: 44,325
I am late to the discussion but think we have another post that is really about money and what things cost. There is no shortage of Rolex watches, only Rolex watches at msrp. If money was not an issue and you bought what you wanted from the market then we would not be having this discussion or the many others. Don't get mad or emotional at something you can not control and have minimal impact on should you buy or sell in any market. I do not feel one way or another about AD's or Grey Market players as a whole and know some are great and so are not so much. I just focus on my watches and the watches that I want and enjoy my ownership experience.
1William is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 11:00 PM   #77
fsprow
"TRF" Member
 
fsprow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Real Name: Frank
Location: Dallas,NY,Colo.
Watch: Patek 5168, 5170P
Posts: 2,364
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1william View Post
i am late to the discussion but think we have another post that is really about money and what things cost. There is no shortage of rolex watches, only rolex watches at msrp. If money was not an issue and you bought what you wanted from the market then we would not be having this discussion or the many others. Don't get mad or emotional at something you can not control and have minimal impact on should you buy or sell in any market. I do not feel one way or another about ad's or grey market players as a whole and know some are great and so are not so much. I just focus on my watches and the watches that i want and enjoy my ownership experience.
100%
fsprow is offline  
Old 21 November 2020, 11:01 PM   #78
Harry-57
2024 Pledge Member
 
Harry-57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Real Name: Harry
Location: England
Posts: 9,541
Quote:
Originally Posted by zengineer View Post
No, Rolex CHOOSES not to meet current demand.
Please do some research.

Rolex can modulate production. I have heard, but I cannot know for certain, that in 2020 they have cut back a bit on SS model production and increased, PM watch output. I am told (again, second hand) that pumping the PM end of the ranges will yield a particularly good profit margin at the moment.

What they don't do is hire, train and fire watchmakers, open and close factories, start/stop production lines, to chase trends. Look at all the watch brands who are now locked into a model of essentially cannibalising themselves. It's about selling at any cost short of bankruptcy. And when that cliff edge finally arrives, merge with someone, get taken over or sell your heritage to a VC consortium.

You can't get what you want. Rolex have taken a board level decision to piss you off and it's worked. Rolex need to do something about this. Killing their successful business model so you can get your watch probably ain't going to happen. In fact, I would go so far as to say that it will never happen. Just a guess.
Harry-57 is offline  
Old 22 November 2020, 12:01 AM   #79
Kevin of Larchmont
2024 Pledge Member
 
Kevin of Larchmont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: The Doghouse
Watch: Ingersoll Mickey
Posts: 2,701
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendota View Post
Literally from day 1 up until only 3 years ago we could do exactly that. We could walk into any AD, at any time, and try on any watch we wanted. The Rolex cases were full of every model. It was no big deal and there was no sense of urgency. If you wanted a sub or a GMT, you could think about it and buy it whenever you wanted. Usually at a discount. The sales people were just normal people and you could chat about watches whenever you wanted to stop in. Now, only 3 years later, it's a complete circus.

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk
You do know what literally means right because this is not true, three years ago it was exactly the same and the posts on the TRF complaining about it were the same. This sense of urgency has been carefully curated by Rolex for a very long time; the list of models that I have never seen new in a case at my preferred AD is vastly longer than the list of those I have. Nonetheless I have managed to buy a few SS models at retail or better over the last few years through kind persistence. The Rolex salespeople I have encountered have also been quite “normal,” whatever that means. They are people and the secret is to simply build a relationship and be kind to people. This tends not happen when you can walk into an AD and pick a watch out of the case like you pick a steak at the butcher.

This example probably belongs on another thread but I asked my AD sales representative in September to please notify me the next time they received a polar Explorer II. We had a frank discussion at the time about limited supply and that they wouldn’t see one until 2021 and that ultimately the AD owner determines who gets what based on past and potential purchase history. I understood all of this already. I’m no whale and they know it so I knew it was a long shot which is fine because I don’t need it - that’s the key. Yesterday I get the call. I’ve still never seen one in the case or in the wild, not in one or three or five or more years but they and other models can be had with patience and kindness. There is no urgency if you can remember that you don’t need it.
Kevin of Larchmont is offline  
Old 22 November 2020, 12:29 AM   #80
fsprow
"TRF" Member
 
fsprow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Real Name: Frank
Location: Dallas,NY,Colo.
Watch: Patek 5168, 5170P
Posts: 2,364
Although an extreme example, Ferrari sales may illustrate where Rolex sees themselves ultimately wanting to go.

1. Extremely difficult to purchase one from a dealer without several previous new vehicle purchases, particularly of less desirable models.
2. A background check on prospective purchasers is run.
3. Average annual income of purchasers is US$1,000,000.
4. At times, for highly desirable models, the purchaser must sign an agreement not to resell the vehicle for one year except back to the dealer for purchase price.
5. Clear preference to sell to those with high public visibility - entertainment, sports, etc.
6. A sparse dealer network.

I hope we don't see this for Rolex, but its not very far from where Richard Mille, Patek and AP stand. And I'd certainly rather purchase from a reseller than deal with the Ferrari model. I imagine Rolex is quite pleased with where things stand.
fsprow is offline  
Old 22 November 2020, 12:46 AM   #81
Sebastian5
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin of Larchmont View Post
Why would Rolex stop this, they’ve spent a century creating it. Why wouldn’t AD’s leverage a very limited resource? What would happen if every Joe who had a whim to buy a Rolex could walk in and pick from full cases? I’ll tell you what, people would start gravitating towards the watches that they couldn’t have. Rolex is a wonderful watch but it’s not the quality or the style that drives the demand that drives the price, it’s the scarcity. For every post here talking about the robust and reliable nature of the movement there are fifty complaining that buyers can’t get what they want. Rolex will never put a stop to it, they’ve engineered the marketplace to be exactly like they want it.
Up to 5-7 years ago you could get any* model immediately at the AD. This is quite an unprecedented situation actually.

*SS Daytona's were a bit difficult but not near unobtainable like now

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry-57 View Post
Please do some research.

What they don't do is hire, train and fire watchmakers, open and close factories, start/stop production lines, to chase trends. Look at all the watch brands who are now locked into a model of essentially cannibalising themselves. It's about selling at any cost short of bankruptcy. And when that cliff edge finally arrives, merge with someone, get taken over or sell your heritage to a VC consortium.

I think this is the gist of it. Rolex is a very long term focused company. They don't jump in a frenzy which could cost them in 10 years. Sure they leave money on the table now but I doubt the really care (still very profitable). That's the value of not having shareholders breathing down your neck.
Sebastian5 is offline  
Old 22 November 2020, 01:00 AM   #82
Kevin of Larchmont
2024 Pledge Member
 
Kevin of Larchmont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: The Doghouse
Watch: Ingersoll Mickey
Posts: 2,701
[QUOTE=Sebastian5;11077387]Up to 5-7 years ago you could get any* model immediately at the AD. This is quite an unprecedented situation actually.

One guy says 1-3 years and another says 5-7 years. Well if it’s 5-7 years then the precedent has been set. Clearly it’s growing ever more difficult but this magical time when cases were full and unicorns wandered the streets is long gone.

*In twelve years of paying attention I’ve NEVER seen an SS Daytona in an AD’s display case.
Kevin of Larchmont is offline  
Old 22 November 2020, 01:03 AM   #83
Sebastian5
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by fsprow View Post
Although an extreme example, Ferrari sales may illustrate where Rolex sees themselves ultimately wanting to go.

1. Extremely difficult to purchase one from a dealer without several previous new vehicle purchases, particularly of less desirable models.
2. A background check on prospective purchasers is run.
3. Average annual income of purchasers is US$1,000,000.
4. At times, for highly desirable models, the purchaser must sign an agreement not to resell the vehicle for one year except back to the dealer for purchase price.
5. Clear preference to sell to those with high public visibility - entertainment, sports, etc.
6. A sparse dealer network.

I hope we don't see this for Rolex, but its not very far from where Richard Mille, Patek and AP stand. And I'd certainly rather purchase from a reseller than deal with the Ferrari model. I imagine Rolex is quite pleased with where things stand.
That's only for the halo models (LaFerrari, TDF etc). Any regular model isn't that hard to get. Maybe a bit more difficult at launch, but that's not any different than say a PS5 right now.
Sebastian5 is offline  
Old 22 November 2020, 01:11 AM   #84
spikep
"TRF" Member
 
spikep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: 🇺🇸
Posts: 535
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian5 View Post
That's only for the halo models (LaFerrari, TDF etc). Any regular model isn't that hard to get. Maybe a bit more difficult at launch, but that's not any different than say a PS5 right now.
Ferrari up until a few years ago was as mentioned by fspro. Now since becoming a public company and ramping up production its a lot easier to get a current model. When I went to buy a 458 in 2013 I was told “NO” unless I purchased a used 458 with less than 1000miles at a $50k above msrp in a non red color. If I did so I would be able to spec a new 458 which would arrive in 2 years! I now have a Rossa Corsa 458
Attached Images
File Type: jpeg FB4847E9-08F0-4F15-8A6E-A89A0BC52548.jpeg (129.4 KB, 71 views)
__________________
16610 LN, 16610 LV, 126610 LV, 126622 Rhodium, 126710 BLRO jubilee, 126710 BLRO oyster, 126719 Meteorite, 116710 BLNR, 126711 CHNR, 126715 CHNR, 326934 BLACK, 326934 GREEN, 216570 BLACK, 116500LN WHITE, 116500LN BLACK, 126710 VTNR jubilee
spikep is offline  
Old 22 November 2020, 01:11 AM   #85
Greglaw
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Rhode Island
Posts: 667
It’s easy find another brand and stop complaining. This has been done to death. Instead of pounding keys go out and do something. If you can’t then move on.

I’m ready to leave this forum it’s the same nonsense day after day because instead of talking watches it’s the same drivel about AD and value and investment.
Greglaw is offline  
Closed Thread

Tags
authorized dealers , rolex , submariner date


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Takuya Watches

Bobs Watches

Asset Appeal

My Watch LLC

OCWatches

DavidSW Watches

Coronet


*Banners Of The Month*
This space is provided to horological resources.





Copyright ©2004-2024, The Rolex Forums. All Rights Reserved.

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX

Rolex is a registered trademark of ROLEX USA. The Rolex Forums is not affiliated with ROLEX USA in any way.