End of Crypto?

[huncho]

Originally Posted by dmash

yup, I agree with practically everything here.

I also think the sell off has not ended. this is going to permanently scar the guys new to crypto. 1000000%. as said I've been around it for near 7 years now, in and out, but never saw it as anything more than a digital gold. and I think that's it's best use case. this event (as you said) isn't really like some of the other pump and dumps and odd occurrences, this was supposed to be a safe haven that wasn't just involved in something minor, this is some unreal stuff. a total manipulation. It really does make one ask 'what is even real in this space?'

also really agree with you about showcasing that nothing really has ben innovated and it was ALL smoke and mirrors about all these amazing use cases. this could be a major turning point for crypto, for the worst.

yeah it will get worse for sure, a lot of alts will go to 0 and the space will be abandoned. there's now almost no reason for "normies" to get into crypto but at the same time almost none of retail was buying btc/eth since december of last year. the way i see it, the vision and what btc is meant to be remains unchanged and i think the smart money will eventually end up in it given that it's more of a commodity. who knows where that will be price wise but this just proves that it's the one part of crypto that has yet to be exposed functionally, has a very specific distinction from the rest and i think it gives it more of a bull case because of that. it feels like btc is always collateral damage and not at the center of sell offs at this point lol

i used to think eth will be up there with btc long term but it feels like that's gonna be a giant question mark now given that it's a essentially a security and always at the center of all these defi borrowing scandals. it feels like almost everything it was meant to be used for is gonna be heavily pushed back on now

[BLACKHORSE 6]

Originally Posted by scarlet knight

One of my employees told me her son was into crypto. I told her it had no store of value. The Treasury can print money, corporations have profits, bonds are backed by revenues, bridge tolls, sewer, water, etc.Even gold can be sold for a price. Crypto is based on nothing.

Going to nuthin’ fast.

The only store of value is that someone tomorrow may want to buy it from you. Don’t know if that qualifies to meet the strict definition or not, but this is why I’ll never buy any crypto. I agree with Buffet and Munger’s assessment of crypto.

I have to admit that the libertarian in me sympathies with the possibilities that crypto offers in breaking free of a fiat currency… but I think that if anyone implements that pipe dream it would be better to just go back to the gold standard.

[pickettt]

Originally Posted by Mifune

getting rid of shady players and adding the overlay of Governmental regulation is going to be positives that were really needed for the space to be even more legitimate.

I believe this was always the plan...once governments realized that legitimate utility crypto wasn't going anywhere.

[Moondoggy]

Wow........that's surprising.

Crap-to

[jingerman]

Not your keys, not your coin


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[pickettt]

Originally Posted by jingerman

Not your keys, not your coin


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Don't learn the hard way.

[77T]

Ironic timing for this. So much to unpack. Wonder how the ETH fork forces will react?

That overhaul of their blockchain to shift from proof-of-work to proof-of-stake could have been also a motivator as fauxcoins, fauxNFTs, and a host of ETH-based products face government scrutiny.

Big players poised to take big stakes, then poof, Tuesday’s fail when FTX said “unable to meet withdrawal requests” - sought a Binance deal as a lifeline - then a bailout became a pullout.

There were likely abuses by white collar criminals running exchanges. It was fairly easy without regulation. That contagion has dampened every class of crypto. The pawns have to use the wallets and they got fleeced; miners, too…and the headline criminals are being chased down: https://www.theblock.co/post/183702/...utm_medium=rss

For anyone wanting a nice easy historical perspective of the original intent in placing value on a blockchain, I saw a decent one tonight on PBS’ Nova: Crypto Decoded - look it up on your local PBS station.

My philosophy is the crypto exchanges acted like the stock exchanges of the late 19th and early 20th Centuries. The bigs smiled as they cheated - now may have some shorts putting it to them in the leveraged derivative pools. But the plain Jane users are taking a beating.

How else could FTX have a liquidity problem except by some dirty deeds?

I don’t think any honest crypto buyer deserved this anymore than someone stealing you car.


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[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by tudk

Look out if the Russian mafia have any assets tied up in FTX . These boys and girls will not be happy.

Or Ukrainians or other such countries. They all take free currency, scams, and grifting pretty seriously. Nigeria too of course, yet their scams are a bit different-ish and lower-level.

[1st amg]

Originally Posted by superdog

did not put in any.

Same, I am glad I was too dumb to understand it so I stayed away.

[Wahlberg]

Crypto did nothing good to this world. Add in covid the past three years and the world even got worse. One of the biggest factors that ruined this watch hobby.

It brought out a lot of shady people and transactions. All based on a get-filthy-rich-scheme. One person duping the other or multiple people duping others with pump and dump schemes. How can you be proud of that? Then again, beats being poor or having nothing. Who is the stupid one in the end? That's a good question.

There is a crypto guy on Reddit who has his own coin and he was posting his rainbow Daytona's etc. How many gullible people got caught into that, blinded by the light and diamonds. If anyone know who I'm talking about please post his name because I can't find it anymore.

And then you have the dozens of people who schemed and stolen money, gotten out before it hit the fan and they are now living lavishly as well.

[mountainjogger]

Unregulated means unregulated.

Says it all.

[Star Ferry]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

Crypto did nothing good to this world. Add in covid the past three years and the world even got worse. One of the biggest factors that ruined this watch hobby.

It brought out a lot of shady people and transactions. All based on a get-filthy-rich-scheme. One person duping the other or multiple people duping others with pump and dump schemes. How can you be proud of that? Then again, beats being poor or having nothing. Who is the stupid one in the end? That's a good question.

There is a crypto guy on Reddit who has his own coin and he was posting his rainbow Daytona's etc. How many gullible people got caught into that, blinded by the light and diamonds. If anyone know who I'm talking about please post his name because I can't find it anymore.

And then you have the dozens of people who schemed and stolen money, gotten out before it hit the fan and they are now living lavishly as well.

Exactly correct. You basically could not be a bona fide crypto genius without a collection of RM, Patek, AP, and Rolex sports watches. They bought these watches at an unbelievably high rate. Whereas a successful surgeon with 10 million in the bank might have a 5 or 10 percent chance of buying a pricey watch, a young crypto bro with the same cash is about 90% likely to buy.

[330ci]

Personally, I've known all this was going on. Anyone with half a brain knows that this is widespread. If Do Kwon didn't wake anyone up, I don't see why this would.

Realistically people have a hard time wrapping their minds around Token economies. Nobody wanted to invest in Apple in the beginning, nobody wanted to invest in Microsoft. Etc. They were crazy ideas. I think people need to stop looking at crypto as currency, and realize these are shares necessary to utilize a systems function and alot of these networks are legitimate businesses that people want to see succeed as thats where true wealth is created.

Alot will fail, but I see the utility value in alot of these systems; with the amount invested into some of these projects through token sales, theres definitely alot of potential for these projects to succeed if they're managed properly.the tokens to me are irrelevant if the project they support doesn't show future utility value.

Personally I wanted to write off crypto. I just can't imagine a world where it isn't the future at this point. Blockchain technology is incredible.


While stocks might be backed by physical businesses, how many of those businesses deal in intellectual assets? Plenty of peoples money is already backed by ideas. The utility value of crypto is definitely minimal at this point. it is a system that with proper regulation will be integral to daily life in 20 years though. If you think otherwise, just look at how much banking/credit card companies specifically are investing into blockchain tokens

People are alluding to the lack of regulation that caused the great crash of 29, people didn't stop investing in the stock market though. They just modified it so it couldn't be as easily manipulated. There are some things that definitely need to be addressed in the crypto space from a regulatory perspective, but I would hardly say any of the Greed found in crypto isn't found in most every other business sector out there, most industries just have regulations and agency's in place to minimize the severity/frequency of offenses

Every asset price is rocky at the moment. USDs are going to be Supreme for another year or 2. But I see this as a positive for Crypto. These bad seeds need to be sorted so that honest business can reign Supreme

Took a 30% hit to my crypto wallets this week myself. This definitely was painful, but its in the past now. Time to move on

[enjoythemusic]

Largely agree 330ci... except a few crazies who got msft early and btc was 20 cents to a buck. Missed AAPL early; I remember when Bill bailed out the company(!) while MicroSoft bundling just a browser brought regulatory action. Look at AAPL bundling today.

[dmash]

Did El Salvador store their bitcoin with FTX?!

[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by 330ci

Every asset price is rocky at the moment. USDs are going to be Supreme for another year or 2. But I see this as a positive for Crypto. These bad seeds need to be sorted so that honest business can reign Supreme

Took a 30% hit to my crypto wallets this week myself. This definitely was painful, but its in the past now. Time to move on

I don't get this mindset ''everyone and everything is taking huge hits, that's why crypto is doing bad (as well)''.

And for all the rotten people that are now being ousted, another million are waiting for their chance. It's pure greed.

[Zack21]

My knowledge base for crypto (as well as NFTs and the Metaverse for that matter) is extremely limited but it seems like all types of assets are part of the current value meltdown. I know some of my stock holdings have taken a beating similar percentage wise to the BTC to USD value drop. It is interesting to me (not in a good way) that everything seems to be dropping in value at the same time as opposed to a situation where one asset class drops because money shifts to a different asset class.

[brandrea]

So how do you conduct business in a currency that fluctuates 13% in one day?

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by brandrea

So how do you conduct business in a currency that fluctuates 13% in one day?

You cannot.

The basis for a transaction that is crypto based is that the business accepting crypto is expecting they will be able to exchange it in the future for more.

That is not a viable business model.

[330ci]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

I don't get this mindset ''everyone and everything is taking huge hits, that's why crypto is doing bad (as well)''.

And for all the rotten people that are now being ousted, another million are waiting for their chance. It's pure greed.

I did not say that.

Everything is doing poorly, I am DCAing in all my portfolios. The only thing I haven't lost my ass on this year is art and Biotechs.

My point is, every market suffers from people being taken advantage of, stock market included, the stock market has worked through similar problems in the past and survived. Crypto will too. With both markets being in turmoil and the stock market working itself into this problem since we went off the gold standard, I have far more faith in a new system. plenty of institutions seem to have bet their money as well. with a bit of patience and proper money management, some of these projects are bound to succeed.

How many stocks are down 90% YTD? Tons, and most of those were invested in by "smart investors".

If I were risk averse I'd put my money in bonds. But no shame in watching my savings dwindle a bit at the moment, just makes me hustle harder to invest more. What goes up must come down, but life is cyclical and new highs will be back again.

Personally I'm not a fan of holding USDs.

[Mac-Apple]

Imaginary money , and imaginary Items (NFT) all will be worthless very soon . Ever hear of One in the hand ? I’ll stick with physical items . Can’t help but think how many billions people will be out . Baseball cards are the next thing to tank unfortunately.

[JoeJoeBobo]

As this thread progresses BTC is soaring.

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by JoeJoeBobo

As this thread progresses BTC is soaring.

[JoeJoeBobo]

I believe this thread is less then 24hrs old and in that time BTC is soaring…facts.

[TNT009]

Originally Posted by kinnakeet

i’ll be just fine never buying crypto.

exactly

[HHIslander]

Originally Posted by JoeJoeBobo

I believe this thread is less then 24hrs old and in that time BTC is soaring…facts.

The gain in BTC today is fully correlated with the CPI print. Up 6% today, down >15% from Monday. Soaring isn’t quite the word I would use. Ymmv.

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by JoeJoeBobo

I believe this thread is less then 24hrs old and in that time BTC is soaring…facts.

Then you should take your 24 hour gains and run far and run fast

Bitcoin Bombshell: FTX, $32 Billion Exchange On The Brink Of Collapse


https://seekingalpha.com/article/455...nk-of-collapse

[JoeJoeBobo]

Thanks anyway but I don’t give or take investment advise on an open watch forum where people thought watches were investments.

I was merely pointing out the coincidence of it!

Have a nice day.

[enjoythemusic]

Two Mr. Robot videos, one i can't embed so see link below first before the embedded YT.

[Mifune]

Originally Posted by SDGT3

can i ask you please... Are your home or rentals any more secure than a piece of paper at the county recorders office with the full faith of the laws upholding those as yours?

you just made my point... faith in value is all we have regardless of the asset class. not gold, not art, not real estate... nothing physical is truly immutable, physical assets being the basis of your personal idea of value.

what is immutable, is rarity. gold isn't rare, real estate isn't rare art can be rare but is still being generated to this day and into the future and that makes it dilutive.

Bitcoin is rare. there are 47 million millionaires in the world, that means there are not even enough bitcoin for each millionaire to own one full coin.

Originally Posted by SDGT3

The real question is do I trust some guy in his basement working math equations for my medium of payment?

that is a mischarictarization of the reality of what is happening on a proof of work blockchain because the mining community is not made up of some guy in his basement working math equations.

lets just take your idea of the functionality of bitcoin as being some guy in his basement, this is actually... a good thing.

that is called 'decentralization' and is the first order idea of what Bitcoin represents.

Some guy in his basement, can not generate coins, alter code or corrupt data. the data is immutable, the code is protected against 51% attack and the coins are limited to 21 million.

The bitcoin chain is the strongest most secure network ever designed.