Rolex U.S. trademark restrictions vs. U.S. customs rules for returning expats?

[tyler1980]

Long time lurker, but I recently decided to finally register and contribute. In this case however, I have a question.

I have read a lot of posts here on Rolex’s trademark restrictions and how it pertains to “importing” more than one Rolex watch into the US and that multiple Rolexes can be seized by customs as a trademark violation. Although this topic on trademark restrictions has been discussed a few times here I have not found a discussion on how this relates to U.S. expats when they decide to move back home.

My question does not concern getting around this rule but more about how to reconcile Rolex’s trademark protection rules on importing with U.S. customs rules for returning expats which says that all personal effects and household goods may be imported when you return to the U.S. from living abroad duty free provided you have owned them more than one year. If items are newer than 1 year old a duty rate may apply. U.S. customs defines personal effects as “items that belong to and are used by one person, such as wearing apparel, jewelry, photographic equipment, and tape recorders.” This clearly includes a watch collection, as a watch is considered jewelry.

So my question, if anyone actually knows the answer, is which rule/regulation supersedes the other as they are clearly contradicting rules. On one hand, according to U.S. customs rules I am entitled to bring all my Rolex watches purchased abroad (regardless of how many I own) back home with me when I return to the US and can even do it duty free as they are part of my personal and household effects, but on the other hand Rolex’s trademark protection says I can only bring 1. So which is it?

I really don’t want to have to make multiple trips back into the U.S. bringing 1 Rolex at a time in order to get my collection back into the U.S. when I repatriate, but I guess if I have to I will. Does anyone have any experience with this situation?

[Gaijin]

I don't know and I would love to. Ex pay American living in Japan with a collection.

[petereoin]

Why not pose your query to the U.S. Customs Authority, I am sure they would be able to clarify their position.

[kilyung]

I contacted CBP about this very question last year and was told that importation restrictions apply to returning expats. Now is this correct? Who knows but the fact that the CBP agent that responded to my inquiry thought so would at least indicate poor training and possible issues in trying to do so.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by petereoin

Why not pose your query to the U.S. Customs Authority, I am sure they would be able to clarify their position.

Ive tried. Ive gotten the "it should be fine" comment (the word should doesn't inspire much confidence), and I've gotten the i don't know comment. I have also gotten a "refer to our website" comment. Never a definitive yes its ok or no it not ok. Its not like when you ask you are getting a reply from anyone who actually knows the ins and outs of the laws.

This is why I am asking for advice from someone who may have actually been in this exact same position (as I'm sure its fairly common) and how it was handled in a practical sense rather than in a hypothetical sense. ... so a Rolex forum is specifically the right avenue for this query.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by kilyung

I contacted CBP about this very question last year and was told that importation restrictions apply to returning expats. Now is this correct? Who knows but the fact that the CBP agent that responded to my inquiry thought so would at least indicate poor training and possible issues in trying to do so.

Thats the problem... do import restrictions apply to travelers on vacation and people moving their entire house equally? The CBP website says you can bring ALL personal and household effects if repatriating to the US. There is a specific section on it which makes it seem as though it is a separate policy for expats... IE the duty is waved for returning expats on personal goods that have been used vs a regular traveler who may have to pay duty on the exact same thing when returning which implies there are differences between a regular traveler and a returning expat. The sense i have gotten with regard to the import restrictions applying that they refer to when speaking to CBP is more centered around prohibited items that are restricted regardless if you are a returning expat or not, like meats, endangered species furs, illegal items, etc.

In addition, the "INTENT" of the Rolex trademark restriction is to prevent grey market items flowing across the border and to stop people from buying multiple Rolex watches in a country where they are cheaper (which is weird as they are priced fairly consistently from country to country) and bringing them back to the US and hurting Rolex USA's sales. Not to stop someone amassing a collection over a number of years in the country where they live and then bringing them with them when they return home. So clearly the letter of the law and the intent of the law so to speak are also different.

[kilyung]

Well at face value the response I got makes some sense. If you legally bought and owned something on a banned list such as elephant ivory, it is still illegal to bring it into the U.S. If you legally bought and owned a new Land Rover, you could not import it as a personal item as it isn't DOT approved. Unfortunately I think CBP personal item exemptions take a back seat to restrictions.

[kilyung]

If you're looking for a definitive answer, you're not likely to find it here. It'll have to be CBP answered - and likely frustrating and/or flawed.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by kilyung

If you're looking for a definitive answer, you're not likely to find it here. It'll have to be CBP answered - and likely frustrating and/or flawed.

that likely is true about getting flawed answers. I also asked CBP to consider how the 1 rolex per person would be applied if i brought 3 with me and traveled with my wife and 2 year old son. That's one Rolex per person, so is that ok even though the 2 year old clearly could not have purchased it and is too small to wear it? So even if the import restriction apply to me when I move back to the US I can't even get an answer as to how many total Rolexes I can bring between 3 people. Frustrating.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by Gaijin

I don't know and I would love to. Ex pay American living in Japan with a collection.

we just need to find a former expat with a collection and not current expats like us and see what they did. This can't be an uncommon thing.

[Tools]

You are confusing duty-free with Trademark Law. Two different animals.

Trademark imports are independent from your household or personal goods imports when you return to the US; as are other safety/protection laws. You can still only hand carry one Rolex trademarked watch, but it will be duty-free if you have owned it for more than a year.

Likewise you cannot import your automobile if it is not fitted and certified to meet US auto import safety/emission law. There are also other laws, weapons, appliances, etc., that you cannot simply lump with your duty-free household/personal property goods.

[tyler1980]

Clearly whatever the particulars turn out to be as I will probably have to get a professional/legal person to dig into this for me, I think we can all agree that this is not the intent of what Rolex is trying to prevent with this trademark restriction ..IE preventing collectors who have lived overseas for years and years from bringing their watch collections home with them. Otherwise what would they rather us do? Not buy any Rolexes ever? I know I'm done buying Rolexes because of this for the time being. If I live overseas for multiple years I am not hurting Rolex USA's market share as I could not buy a Rolex in the US if i wanted to as I don't live there and the trademark restriction is to protect Rolex USA from competition from overseas IE purchasing a multiple watches on an overseas vacation rather than from Rolex USA or Purchasing a multiple Rolexes on the grey market in Europe and bringing them back for personal use or sale. Because obviously the restriction was not intended toward people like me and because returning expats generally get quite a bit more leeway with bringing their stuff back to the us with them when they return I just wanted to know if anyone else has had an experience with this which it appears not.

[REDiesel]

Originally Posted by Tools

Likewise you cannot import your automobile if it is not fitted and certified to meet US auto import safety/emission law.

Originally Posted by kilyung

If you legally bought and owned a new Land Rover, you could not import it as a personal item as it isn't DOT approved.

I think you could import it but not register it to drive on public roads. Keep it for the track and/or farm for instance would be ok.

[Rashid.bk]

Originally Posted by Tools

You are confusing duty-free with Trademark Law. Two different animals.

Trademark imports are independent from your household or personal goods imports when you return to the US; as are other safety/protection laws. You can still only hand carry one Rolex trademarked watch, but it will be duty-free if you have owned it for more than a year.

I agree with this. I think there seems to be some confusion as to what is what.
I understand Rolex's trademark laws to apply to a traveler who is returning after a trip, this person is allowed one Rolex purchase abroad.

A repatriating person is bringing his valuables and property back with him....

Now I'm not 100% of course but it seems common sense that you could return home with your watch collection, art collection, shoes, china etc....

I have traveled abroad many times, multiple times a year, always carrying two and sometimes three Rolexes and returning to the US....not even once was I even asked about them. Mostly I travel with four watches as I work abroad, two Rolexes, a Suunto and a Polar HR fitness watch. Never once stopped or questioned.
But I understand your need for a definitive answer prior to showing up at the customs gate....

[watchabout]

I think a lawyer consultation is your best option. No half answers there. CBP have no idea what they're doing most of the time.


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[beshannon]

Originally Posted by watchabout

CBP have no idea what they're doing most of the time.

And this would be but one reason why I rarely post here any longer.

[mikhaelj]

Would be nice to know how to go about this. Planning to come back to home with my 3 rolex


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[watchabout]

Originally Posted by beshannon

And this would be but one reason why I rarely post here any longer.

If you work at CBP please don't take my comment personally. However I stand by what I wrote. CBP personnel is rude most of the time and literally answered "No idea" on a number of occasions where I had to deal with them.

Of course I've run into highly professional decent officers sometimes, but sadly that's the exception, not the rule.


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[Pop Alexandra]

You should get in touch with some consultants from your area. They should be able to guide you better, as they're familiar with the regional regulations.

[sechsgang]

Normally, the only thing the CBP doesn't want to be is duped or hidden things from, even if your worst case is to call ahead and ask for a representative to talk to when you get in and explain the situation, they tend to almost never really stick you for anything. I've not once not gotten heavy discounts even when reporting to customs with things I've bought, with full receipts and paperwork filled out when I literally red flag myself in order to talk directly to someone who will be waiting. Im not saying just go with your whole collection and wing it, but they have always been incredibly easy to work with if you're respectful, calm and earnest. Granted some legal council would always be a nice thing to have just in case, but having an easygoing, respectful personality while figuring it out with CBP will go a LONG way.

[GB-GMT]

Customs broker here that specializes in corporate relocation.

You are allowed to return to the US with your personal effects with no issues. As mentioned above, if any goods were purchased in the last 12 months, they will be dutiable. If you have owned the goods for more than 12 months it is duty free.

You can bring in 50 Rolex’s as long as you are not reselling.

If you have multiple watches that are stickered and look new, then USCBP might ask some questions to make sure you are not importing to resell. No worries about any trademark restrictions when you are importing personal effects.

[Pballkm21]

Originally Posted by Pop Alexandra

You should get in touch with some consultants from your area. They should be able to guide you better, as they're familiar with the regional regulations.

Sheesh. This thread is over 5 years old.