Just another AD waiting list story

[Frank McKay]

Originally Posted by WatchNutcase

In the process of doing that, cheers

Awesome! can’t wait to see that baby on your wrist

[Nairn1980]

Well the good thing is you now know these models aren’t realistic at MRSP with no spend history. Your article says you’ve been reading the forums but maybe it still wasn’t clear enough?

Hopefully others read your posts and article and can re-align their expectations.

[Johnpierpontmorgan]

For any business like the ADs, they will give the highly prized and sought after product to a regular vip customer, whom have frequent business dealing than a complete stranger who just wants a highly demanded item but may not bring regular revenues for them.


its normal business dealings i guess.

think from their perspective and put yourself in their position.

[locker314]

Originally Posted by djyolky

I'm looking at Panerai, they are doing many more interesting things than Rolex.

Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk

Definitely not a bad choice! My current favourite watch is my PAM00661.

[WatchNutcase]

Originally Posted by Nairn1980

Well the good thing is you now know these models aren’t realistic at MRSP with no spend history. Your article says you’ve been reading the forums but maybe it still wasn’t clear enough?

Hopefully others read your posts and article and can re-align their expectations.

I knew it wouldn't be easy but I wanted to give it a shot

[fskywalker]

Thanks for sharing

[ilovethiscity]

Originally Posted by WatchNutcase

Panerai is a great option for sure. I'm still looking at Rolex grey but definitely more open to other brands.

I live where you live.. I didn’t even waste my energy! Went grey three times in a row now and I’ve never looked back, life is for living!

[DG123]

Originally Posted by WatchNutcase

I just published a blog post about my experience trying to purchase SS sports models from various ADs in my city. It's nothing new really but just my personal experience and my opinion of the whole "sport model shortage" situation.

I would copy and paste it over here but it's quite long so here is the direct link: https://www.watchreviewblog.com/role...orized-dealer/

The theme of your blog is that you want to buy an SS Daytona from an AD at MSRP.. I presume this is because you like the idea of buying a watch at MSRP that immediately is worth double what you paid for it.
You also wrote that a GMT or Submariner would be acceptable . These two watches are also worth more than MSRP, so again , like the SS Daytona, I presume your interest in these models is because you want to buy and have no financial risk.
The AD's you visited did offer you professional models including Air-King, Milgauss, and Explorer, however you declined to buy one of those (presumably because they did not offer the immediate financial appreciation of the Daytona, GMT, or Sub).
I would respect your blog story more if you had stated that the true reason for your 6 month search of AD's was to buy a watch with no financial risk to yourself.

[HHIslander]

Originally Posted by BumbleB

It’s a familiar story, but it’s only really been like this in the last few years. Before that the shortage was never this extreme. You can’t expect Rolex to ramp up its production because there’s a sudden hype in Sub, GMT, Daytonas. I know it’s frustrating but it’s market dynamics and for one-off buyers it’s OP, DJ or go grey.

You can usually get a beautiful OP, DJ, Explorer or Day Date as a Crown for an achievement.

I don’t think the shortage affects the brand perception negatively, probably the opposite.

Not sure why people think the ‘AD experience’ makes a difference, it really doesn’t, it’s just the price difference. You can get an empty warranty card at a grey dealer and put your name on it as well.

It’s really like this in my opinion:

1. You want to buy a highly sought-after SS Rolex and are not interested to buy any DJ, OP, Day Date or PM Rolex models

2. You have decided to build a Rolex collection, know what you want, have the $ to do so and want some PM pieces as well as SS pieces

3. You’re a high-roller with private collections and also buy jewelry/watches as presents for family/friends

If you’re in 2 or 3 you can go to an AD and build up the relationship, spend your money etc blabla

If you’re in 1 and cannot wait, you can:

A. buy Grey
B. buy from a trusted seller on TRF
C. have a good friend/family member in 2 or 3 help you out

If you’re in 1 and are not in a hurry/very patient,

D. get on many AD waitlists for the watch you want (drive to small towns, newly opened ADs, privately owned ADs, chain-owned ADs)
E. pop into an AD whenever you see one and enquire about the watch you want
F. Try your luck at airports whenever you travel (ask friends/family members that travel frequently/are in the airline industry)

If you’re upset with Rolex about it, you can move on to PP or AP but afraid it’s the same with sought after models. Or you can go Omega, Panerai or Tag or so but you may still end up wanting that elusive Rolex...


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Most succinct and accurate post I've ever read about how the process currently works. New buyers could really save themselves a lot of time and hassle by heeding this advice.

Nicely done!

[WatchNutcase]

Originally Posted by DG123

The theme of your blog is that you want to buy an SS Daytona from an AD at MSRP.. I presume this is because you like the idea of buying a watch at MSRP that immediately is worth double what you paid for it.
You also wrote that a GMT or Submariner would be acceptable . These two watches are also worth more than MSRP, so again , like the SS Daytona, I presume your interest in these models is because you want to buy and have no financial risk.
The AD's you visited did offer you professional models including Air-King, Milgauss, and Explorer, however you declined to buy one of those (presumably because they did not offer the immediate financial appreciation of the Daytona, GMT, or Sub).
I would respect your blog story more if you had stated that the true reason for your 6 month search of AD's was to buy a watch with no financial risk to yourself.

That would be great except that I didn't buy the watches offered because of fit on my small wrist (6.5 inches) and because I already have an air-king. The Milgauss I just wasn't sure about because of the lightning bolt second hand. The Daytona, GMT and Sub I've tried on, they fit me well and I like the heritage behind them. I don't sell any of my Rolexes, its a rule I have, once acquired it stays.

[GST15]

Good post Matt. Read your blog, very well done!

[DG123]

Originally Posted by WatchNutcase

That would be great except that I didn't buy the watches offered because of fit on my small wrist (6.5 inches) and because I already have an air-king. The Milgauss I just wasn't sure about because of the lightning bolt second hand. The Daytona, GMT and Sub I've tried on, they fit me well and I like the heritage behind them. I don't sell any of my Rolexes, its a rule I have, once acquired it stays.

All I'm saying is that the only Rolex watches you want to buy happen to be the 3 models which currently have an aftermarket value higher than the AD's MSRP.
I am not saying you are a flipper, only that you like the idea of buying a new watch from an AD and walking out the door knowing the watch is worth more than you paid for it.
It's not just you. This forum has posts everyday from guys complaining about not being able to buy an SS Daytona, GMT, or Sub from an AD at MSRP. And I believe the reason for this is guys want to buy something that is worth more than they pay.

[WatchNutcase]

Originally Posted by DG123

All I'm saying is that the only Rolex watches you want to buy happen to be the 3 models which currently have an aftermarket value higher than the AD's MSRP.
I am not saying you are a flipper, only that you like the idea of buying a new watch from an AD and walking out the door knowing the watch is worth more than you paid for it.
It's not just you. This forum has posts everyday from guys complaining about not being able to buy an SS Daytona, GMT, or Sub from an AD at MSRP. And I believe the reason for this is guys want to buy something that is worth more than they pay.

It's a valid perspective, but I've also asked myself the same question; would I even want these models if they're were sitting in the display window? Would I want them if they depreciated like an Omega?

Answer for me is yes on the Daytona. Due to fit, sizing, heritage of the watch. Similar to a Speedmaster.

Probably less so for the GMT, but I still have a strong desire for the GMT function.

[WatchNutcase]

Originally Posted by GST15

Good post Matt. Read your blog, very well done!

Cheers

[DG123]

Originally Posted by WatchNutcase

It's a valid perspective, but I've also asked myself the same question; would I even want these models if they're were sitting in the display window? Would I want them if they depreciated like an Omega?

Answer for me is yes on the Daytona. Due to fit, sizing, heritage of the watch. Similar to a Speedmaster.

Probably less so for the GMT, but I still have a strong desire for the GMT function.

If you've enjoyed wearing your Air King , and you like the Rolex brand, then I suggest you consider buying a 36 mm OP or 36 mm DJ. They are the company's best selling models, sensational watches, and readily available from an AD. Try one, you might like it

[WatchNutcase]

Originally Posted by DG123

If you've enjoyed wearing your Air King , and you like the Rolex brand, then I suggest you consider buying a 36 mm OP or 36 mm DJ. They are the company's best selling models, sensational watches, and readily available from an AD. Try one, you might like it

I really like them but find them a little too similar to my air-king. I am contemplating the Datejust blue dial with Jubilee though!

[DG123]

Originally Posted by WatchNutcase

I really like them but find them a little too similar to my air-king. I am contemplating the Datejust blue dial with Jubilee though!

I really like the DJ - blue dial - jubilee Unlike most others, though, my preference is for that watch to have a smooth bezel rather than the fluted.

[legacy404]

This model is similar to how Hermes sells their handbags. If Rolex had unconstrained production of sports models, it would probably all be bought up by flippers and grey market sellers who have the purchasing power to buy up the entire inventory at a time. This also wouldn't reflect well on the brand, so I'm guessing this is one way to deter them.

As Rolex is a private company, they can do what they want. And if they think theres too many sports models out there already, they can control production as they see fit. It also benefits owners by maintaining the watches value. One of the reasons why people buy Rolexes is because they do hold value, and unconstrained production would totally destroy that.

I wouldn't say they are intentionally doing this to make it hard for people to attain them, but actually looking at the long term picture for the brand. I'm sure they could make more money if they wanted to buy increasing production.

[WatchNutcase]

Originally Posted by legacy404

This model is similar to how Hermes sells their handbags. If Rolex had unconstrained production of sports models, it would probably all be bought up by flippers and grey market sellers who have the purchasing power to buy up the entire inventory at a time. This also wouldn't reflect well on the brand, so I'm guessing this is one way to deter them.

As Rolex is a private company, they can do what they want. And if they think theres too many sports models out there already, they can control production as they see fit. It also benefits owners by maintaining the watches value. One of the reasons why people buy Rolexes is because they do hold value, and unconstrained production would totally destroy that.

I wouldn't say they are intentionally doing this to make it hard for people to attain them, but actually looking at the long term picture for the brand. I'm sure they could make more money if they wanted to buy increasing production.

100% accurate. Those are the 2 sides to the story. Very difficult and expensive to obtain but they hold their value. The thing is who cares about the watch holding value if you need to spend 50k on PM pieces to obtain one model that holds value, in the end you lose money.

I hope Rolex isn't looking at this from a value point of view, we're here to buy nice watches not gold bullion.

[brucethemanlee]

unfortunately you and everyone else want some of the 5 or 6 hottest watches on the planet (BLRO, Daytona, SkyDweller, Nautilus, Aquanaut, Royal Oak, etc). you have thousands upon thousands of people wanting these watches

How do you propose ADs allocate these pieces? Essentially, they are giving you free money. I know blah blah blah you're a real watch guy and not in it for the money, etc. But the ADs need to allocate to their BEST and long time regular clients because they are the one's really paying the bills and keeping the light on.

Therefore all those pieces go to them - first. Next you have thousands of phones calls and emails, hundreds of walk-ins all wanting the same watches. Sure initially if the list is manageable and small they can have one on hand, but if the list becomes so long that given the short the waiting time is 5-10 years - then what's the point of keeping a list.

Its all about supply and demand and all about the biggest bang the AD can get to keep their business profitable:
1) big one time spenders
2) ongoing spenders who come back year after year after year and multiple times per year
3) combination of above
5) buyers every few years (like yourself)
4) one time buyers

Unfortunately 4) and 5) are at bottom of the list.

Trust me if anyone is complaining about ADs and waiting lists and bundling and VIPs ..... if you owned a AD yourself - you'd be doing the same thing to maximize profits for the long term

At the end of the day.... if you don't like what Rolex and their ADs are doing go to another brand.

No one is forcing you to buy a Rolex.

If you still want a Rolex because you think its looks good and built well and whatever else - then its on you to play the game or the hand that's dealt. Not fair, i know - but that's the way it is.

[djyolky]

Originally Posted by WatchNutcase

Yes very true, I don't mind how it was 5 years ago. A little bit of scarcity makes the game fun, but when it's virtually impossible to buy any nice SS sports model it's gone way too far. I can understand such a thing with brands like Patek for example who are more meticulous and have fully decorated movements, but for mass produced Rolex it's unacceptable. They have the means to expand or just shift production velocity from less desired models into the professional line but they've decided not to.

But then would you want one so badly...

Most likely not. Most people don't realize this. I see you addressed this earlier, but are you really being honest with yourself?

Another poster touched on it, but also ask yourself this question, if you could buy a Daytona at MSRP and the second you walked out with it, the value halved, would you buy that Daytona?

Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk

[WatchNutcase]

Originally Posted by brucethemanlee

unfortunately you and everyone else want some of the 5 or 6 hottest watches on the planet (BLRO, Daytona, SkyDweller, Nautilus, Aquanaut, Royal Oak, etc). you have thousands upon thousands of people wanting these watches

How do you propose ADs allocate these pieces? Essentially, they are giving you free money. I know blah blah blah you're a real watch guy and not in it for the money, etc. But the ADs need to allocate to their BEST and long time regular clients because they are the one's really paying the bills and keeping the light on.

Therefore all those pieces go to them - first. Next you have thousands of phones calls and emails, hundreds of walk-ins all wanting the same watches. Sure initially if the list is manageable and small they can have one on hand, but if the list becomes so long that given the short the waiting time is 5-10 years - then what's the point of keeping a list.

Its all about supply and demand and all about the biggest bang the AD can get to keep their business profitable:
1) big one time spenders
2) ongoing spenders who come back year after year after year and multiple times per year
3) combination of above
5) buyers every few years (like yourself)
4) one time buyers

Unfortunately 4) and 5) are at bottom of the list.

Trust me if anyone is complaining about ADs and waiting lists and bundling and VIPs ..... if you owned a AD yourself - you'd be doing the same thing to maximize profits for the long term

At the end of the day.... if you don't like what Rolex and their ADs are doing go to another brand.

No one is forcing you to buy a Rolex.

If you still want a Rolex because you think its looks good and built well and whatever else - then its on you to play the game or the hand that's dealt. Not fair, i know - but that's the way it is.

Yes this is unfortunately the reality

[Johnpierpontmorgan]

Originally Posted by brucethemanlee

unfortunately you and everyone else want some of the 5 or 6 hottest watches on the planet (BLRO, Daytona, SkyDweller, Nautilus, Aquanaut, Royal Oak, etc). you have thousands upon thousands of people wanting these watches

How do you propose ADs allocate these pieces? Essentially, they are giving you free money. I know blah blah blah you're a real watch guy and not in it for the money, etc. But the ADs need to allocate to their BEST and long time regular clients because they are the one's really paying the bills and keeping the light on.

Therefore all those pieces go to them - first. Next you have thousands of phones calls and emails, hundreds of walk-ins all wanting the same watches. Sure initially if the list is manageable and small they can have one on hand, but if the list becomes so long that given the short the waiting time is 5-10 years - then what's the point of keeping a list.

Its all about supply and demand and all about the biggest bang the AD can get to keep their business profitable:
1) big one time spenders
2) ongoing spenders who come back year after year after year and multiple times per year
3) combination of above
5) buyers every few years (like yourself)
4) one time buyers

Unfortunately 4) and 5) are at bottom of the list.

Trust me if anyone is complaining about ADs and waiting lists and bundling and VIPs ..... if you owned a AD yourself - you'd be doing the same thing to maximize profits for the long term

At the end of the day.... if you don't like what Rolex and their ADs are doing go to another brand.

No one is forcing you to buy a Rolex.

If you still want a Rolex because you think its looks good and built well and whatever else - then its on you to play the game or the hand that's dealt. Not fair, i know - but that's the way it is.

yep AD are also business operate by business owners.

they would give their prized products to regular VIPs.

any rational human that runs a business will do that


COMMON SENSE IS NOT SO COMMON AFTER ALL IT SEEMS

[DG123]

Originally Posted by djyolky

But then you want one so badly...

Most likely not. Most people don't realize this. I see you addressed this earlier, but are you really being honest with yourself?

Another poster touched on it, but also ask yourself this question, if you could buy a Daytona at MSRP and the second you walked out with it, the value halved, would you buy that Daytona?

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I think "hot watch models" are defined by the rare condition of aftermarket pricing being higher than MSRP.

[SlideRacker]

Great read Matt! Consider yourself very lucky you had epiphany after only 6 months. Personally, it took me several years before I reached the inevitable conclusion everyone else who's been doing this for a while reaches. I own 4 grail pieces and I'll go over the story behind each one:

Grail #1 Black Daytona 116250
Bought from a grey dealer back in 2005. At that time MSRP was $6700. I paid $10K. It was a lot back then and I was even kicking myself a bit as to why I capitulated and went grey. That purchase is looking real sweet now.

Grail #2 Black Daytona 116500LN
Bought directly from and AD with no prior purchase history. You read that right. Nada. Zip. Zero. How did I pull this off? Connections. A relative was good friends with the owner of a multi-store AD. They made 1 call (actually I think it may have been a text). AD moved me to the top of the list, ahead of all the other VIPs. I had it 3 weeks later.

Grail # 3 Submariner 116610LN
Bought from an AD with no prior purchase history. No connections this time. How did I pull this off? I got lucky and ran into a very sweet young lady who somehow felt sorry for me. She was also hoping this would be the piece they'd use to reel me in get me to bundle and buy high end pieces later on. But I never took the bait. There have been many similar stories here in TRF. It depends largely on luck and where you're located.

Grail #4 GMT 126710BLRO
Bought grey and paid what I had to pay.

So there you have it. Other than just laying down and going grey I don't thing any of my experiences are repeatable. It will save you a lot of time and frustration. And time is the most precious resource of all. We tend to forget that sometimes. Best of Luck!

[goodolejr]

Originally Posted by SlideRacker

Great read Matt! Consider yourself very lucky you had epiphany after only 6 months. Personally, it took me several years before I reached the inevitable conclusion everyone else who's been doing this for a while reaches. I own 4 grail pieces and I'll go over the story behind each one:

Grail #1 Black Daytona 116250
Bought from a grey dealer back in 2005. At that time MSRP was $6700. I paid $10K. It was a lot back then and I was even kicking myself a bit as to why I capitulated and went grey. That purchase is looking real sweet now.

Grail #2 Black Daytona 116500LN
Bought directly from and AD with no prior purchase history. You read that right. Nada. Zip. Zero. How did I pull this off? Connections. A relative was good friends with the owner of a multi-store AD. They made 1 call (actually I think it may have been a text). AD moved me to the top of the list, ahead of all the other VIPs. I had it 3 weeks later.

Grail # 3 Submariner 116610LN
Bought from an AD with no prior purchase history. No connections this time. How did I pull this off? I got lucky and ran into a very sweet young lady who somehow felt sorry for me. She was also hoping this would be the piece they'd use to reel me in get me to bundle and buy high end pieces later on. But I never took the bait. There have been many similar stories here in TRF. It depends largely on luck and where you're located.

Grail #4 GMT 126710BLRO
Bought grey and paid what I had to pay.

So there you have it. Other than just laying down and going grey I don't thing any of my experiences are repeatable. It will save you a lot of time and frustration. And time is the most precious resource of all. We tend to forget that sometimes. Best of Luck!

Lot of long-waiting TRF members about to pound their desks in frustration after reading #2

[Ravager135]

I've said it many times on this forum, I do not envy those looking to start a Rolex collection in this day and age. I feel fortunate I built my collection when I did and have moved away from the brand until things change in terms of availability. It used to be that a stainless Daytona was the only watch you couldn't walk into an AD and try on. Now, it's almost everything in the professional range.

I have a relationship with a family owned AD. They have offered to put me on waiting lists for pieces. There is nothing I am dying to get currently, but they are honest about wait times. It has, unfortunately, disincentivized me from purchasing additional Rolex watches. Two of the most desired watches I own were purchased after seeing them in person. The BLNR I saw at the Rolex boutique in NYC and picked up a few months later. I initially didn't even like it at release, but fell in love after being shown an example that was waiting for someone to pick up. The second, my 116610LV I purchased out a window on a random day from my local AD. Seeing the green in person drew me instantly inside the store.

[ArtNouveau]

Received 11 months apart the old fashioned way, same SA for over 22 years. Sorry but shortcuts are few and far between.

[BumbleB]

I have a good relationship with a couple ADs in different countries.

Received 3 weeks apart from my AD:



Within a month after buying these:




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[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by BumbleB

Within a month after buying these:




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Who would have thought....