ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX
16 March 2018, 05:21 AM | #1 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: kæl.ɪ.ˈ
Watch: APRO & PPRegulator
Posts: 133
|
Legend status: manual Daytona v. modern Nautilus
Just a thought/question I've had lately and wanted to put out for the opinion of you esteemed Patek enthusiasts on a Rolex forum:
With the ongoing craze for the Nautilus causing steel 5711/12 5980s/90s to reach 2nd hand prices closer to the 50-60k mark, do any of you consider the relative (value and collectibility) merit of purchasing a manual wound Daytona instead? I suspect the vast majority of you (and myself I'll say) all waited and purchased your Nautilus from an AD at retail. But, when multiple treads on this forum have started asking how many non coveted PM Pateks one has to purchase from an AD to be considered for the opportunity to purchase a steel 5711 for 30k, obviously we all see at least a slight bubble. It hard to predict the future but manual wound Daytonas have been the top echelon of Rolex and sport but really all watch collectibility for a generation. Can we say the same for the modern Nautilus in whatever metal? These are tribute models produced for the last 12 years and many many still in active production. I know they are icons in some capacity but we arent talking about the original 3700. The manual wound Daytonas are legendary, but can we say the same for the modern incarnation of the Nautilus? I'd say no for modern Patek in general unless were talking about the Lemania Pateks/5370s/5131s and of course the sky-moons/minute repeaters. What do you all think? |
16 March 2018, 05:42 AM | #2 |
Banned
Join Date: Mar 2018
Real Name: Mike
Location: Allison Park
Watch: 214270
Posts: 540
|
The Nautilus will always be held in high regard.
|
16 March 2018, 05:44 AM | #3 |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 12,356
|
If I was paying a premium, I'd do a 4 digit Daytona in a heartbeat (and I vote with my wallet). There's just nothing else like it. Unfortunately with the market now, the 50k mark for a 5711/12 wouldn't get you very far on the 727 Daytona world @ all. So it's kind of a moot comparison......but for sure I'd sooner put that 50k toward a vintage Daytona versus a Nautilus.
|
16 March 2018, 05:56 AM | #4 |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Real Name: Neil
Location: UK
Watch: ing ships roll in
Posts: 59,242
|
The Nautilus is to (sports) WIS what a Rolex is to normal people. It's the go to statement piece.
|
16 March 2018, 11:06 AM | #5 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Real Name: Louis
Location: Bay Area, CA
Watch: PP 5131R
Posts: 4,786
|
I liked my Daytona but ultimately sold it, so no.
|
16 March 2018, 11:41 AM | #6 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: usofmfa
Posts: 3,157
|
I own both. Admittedly I’ve owned them for several years so my cost basis is relatively low,
I think it’s a fair question though, which offers more collector value at this point? Vintage Daytona is the gold standard of watch collecting and one in good shape will only appreciate in value as the years go by. I wouldn’t sell my relatively common relatively good shape 6239 for triple what I paid 5 years ago for example.
__________________
Instagram: soundsoserious |
16 March 2018, 11:41 AM | #7 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: U.S.A
Watch: Only Rolex & Patek
Posts: 3,345
|
Quote:
No brainer it got to be the Daytona...
__________________
Rolex Forum: Mainly Rolex & Benz pictures...!!! Click the above link to join the club...^^^... "SL BRABUS" aka BenzWorld Undercover Moderator |
|
16 March 2018, 12:17 PM | #8 |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: USA
Watch: addiction issues
Posts: 36,866
|
Unfortunately you’ll need 75-80k to even sniff a clean 6263, more for an ideal example.
Which one is a better buy at this point? I’d have to say Daytona but both are really soaring. I’ll never forget the first 4 digit Daytona I seriously considered buying was 36k and everyone was like what a horrible price! Marcelo Pisani said that they could ask whatever they want because it was a correct and clean example. It sat for a few weeks then sold. 6363 silver dial big red. Missed opportunity
__________________
|
16 March 2018, 12:27 PM | #9 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: N/A
Posts: 11,136
|
Legend status: manual Daytona v. modern Nautilus
5711 etc have been made in many more numbers than 3700. Will a 5711 be worth 100k like a manually wound Daytona is today? No I don’t think so and the current phenomenon is on the last of its leg is my best guess.
That being said, it does not get much better than manual wind daytonas and nautili. One of my 6263s and 3700 1/a here. Love these watches frankly The next best thing: lemania patek indeed!!! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Instagram: @watches_anonymous |
16 March 2018, 12:29 PM | #10 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: N/A
Posts: 11,136
|
And a truly top screwdown manual wind Daytona is now $100k
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Instagram: @watches_anonymous |
17 March 2018, 04:36 AM | #11 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: kæl.ɪ.ˈ
Watch: APRO & PPRegulator
Posts: 133
|
Thank you for your impressions as collectors of both manual Daytonas and 3700s. Yes, agree top non-PN screw downs are in that 75-100k range so not quite a fair comparison to the 5711 2nd hand, but how about the 6239s/6262s? Seems they can be had for 50-60k on Chrono24s. What are your impressions of those? I know they arent anywhere near the pinnacle of Daytona collecting but I'd say neither is a 5711 to PP by any means. I would suspect the 6239 is closer tho right?
|
17 March 2018, 11:58 AM | #12 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: N/A
Posts: 11,136
|
Quote:
Pump pusher daytonas are great and preferred by some purists - more true vintage. I like the “beefier” feel and look of a screwdown personally and the 6263 with the bezel is my favorite all around combination. I would be careful about buying a vintage Daytona from chrono 24 from random dealers. Need to develop a bit of expertise to buy big vintage rolex today’s market am afraid! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Instagram: @watches_anonymous |
|
17 March 2018, 10:43 PM | #13 |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Real Name: @jb.watching
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,469
|
Purely $ for $ consideration of future value then no doubt the Daytona.
But as others have said it's not exactly the same dollars. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
17 March 2018, 11:26 PM | #14 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: usofmfa
Posts: 3,157
|
One major advantage of the 5711 is that authenticity can be confirmed in that you can buy a fully documented watch with all box and papers relatively easily. Not so easy with the vintage Daytona.
__________________
Instagram: soundsoserious |
18 March 2018, 02:52 AM | #15 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Real Name: @jb.watching
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,469
|
Quote:
Yes, more risk. But I think that is something which will reward the diligent and knowledgeable Daytona buyer in the future. Usually people take more risk because the upside is greater, no different here. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
|
18 March 2018, 03:18 AM | #16 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: kæl.ɪ.ˈ
Watch: APRO & PPRegulator
Posts: 133
|
As such, for those of you who have purchased 4 digit daytonas second hand, have you stuck to sellers on Rolex Passion Report?
|
18 March 2018, 03:35 AM | #17 | |||
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: N/A
Posts: 11,136
|
Legend status: manual Daytona v. modern Nautilus
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Not risky to buy a known and standard production 6263/65 IMHO. There is a ton of knowledge out there and pretty easy to find the same Watch having come up for sale in the past of compare or find someone you trust. Where people get in trouble is the more rare stuff (ie solo dials, stamped dials etc). There is a thread in the vintage Rolex subforum on “trusted dealers” and no RPM is not the extent of the list of dealers. Just do your basic diligence, ask questions about originality (and service parts) etc. PS: there are some top fake 5711s out there! But just like anyone who really knows, not a concern. There is a lot of unwarranted fear mongering in vintage Rolex.... I guess people want an excuse to not jump in Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Instagram: @watches_anonymous |
|||
18 March 2018, 06:16 AM | #18 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 12,356
|
Quote:
I do agree with thomaspp to stay away from rare prototype dials etc...questionable origin to start with. It is a real minefield when we're talking vintage Daytona. |
|
18 March 2018, 07:35 AM | #19 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: bay area
Posts: 571
|
I've been back and forth on vintage vs modern. I think vintage is a fantastic option for 4th or 5th or nth watch. Once you have your core daily watch rotation dialed in, to me there is much more romance in a vintage watch that was not made at least partially with computers.
I'd pick up the 40K pre daytona for sale on a well known watch blog over a 40k nautilus (IF i otherwise didn't want to wear a nautilus regularly:) Your case is especially tricky because the nautilus is probably the ultimate daily wearer for most. |
18 March 2018, 08:29 AM | #20 | |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: usofmfa
Posts: 3,157
|
Quote:
__________________
Instagram: soundsoserious |
|
18 March 2018, 09:05 AM | #21 |
"TRF" Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Stratosphere
Posts: 1,990
|
I own and enjoy the heck out of my 5711. Have owned it for almost 2 years and haven’t ever thought of selling it.
Having said this, for me nothing really comes close to the charm of a quality and beautifully aged Vintage Rolex, and especially not a Daytona. Pure magic on the wrist really. |
18 March 2018, 09:14 AM | #22 | |
2024 Pledge Member
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 12,356
|
Quote:
|
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) | |
|
|
*Banners
Of The Month*
This space is provided to horological resources.