I have a story for you..

[Sublovin]

Originally Posted by mountainjogger

Good points. But there would be additional costs to making it public, just like any other addition to a website.

No, you would just give the AD’s search access...no cost

[mountainjogger]

Originally Posted by Sublovin

No, you would just give the AD’s search access...no cost

Ok. Now It think I understand.

This would clearly help AD's who buy back and resell.

But I think that this might just punt the problem to the AD. Because the AD would have the same obligation not to hand a stolen watch back to a person who does not legally own it. We are in a area that I have no background on. But I can see problems.

Also, I question whether ADs would make this available to persons who are not buying from and AD. I would not do it if I was an AD. Why should I facilitate someone else's sale?

Serious problem area here. Not sure of the solution.

[mountainjogger]

Originally Posted by Freespeach

Is there a statute of limitations on the insurance company's right to claim the watch or even the original owner. If it has been say 5 years why can the OP just keep the stolen watch?

Good questions.

First, it is not always returned to the person who turned the stollen watch in for service, but does not own the watch. It is stollen property. Not that person's watch.

Second, even if it has been returned, the original owner and/or insurance company is usually notified. And now the holder of the watch has people threatening him or her with crime/civ liability. Not a pleasant place to be. And if legal action is instituted against the holder, it can get very expensive very quickly.

Finally, SOL's can be very complicated. It's not just how long the SOL is but when it accrues or starts to run. In many jurisdictions, SOL's for breach of contract for or for implied warranty of title begin to run immediately upon breach, or as the example, when the seller gives you a watch that is stollen and therefore in breach of the warranty of title. And some jurisdiction allow these claims to be shortened by contract. But... tort actions such as replevin by the true owner may not begin to run until discovery of the theft and the identity of the thief and the identity of the holder of the stollen property.

And to make it more complicated, depending on the jurisdiction, the innocent purchaser may also have a tort claim against the seller. And that may have a different SOL and a different accrual.

And last but not least there is the statute of repose, which is a whole other issue to look at and, again, varies by the jurisdiction.

These are not questions that can be answered without knowing all the facts, and without knowing law of the jurisdiction.

Again, the only simple answer is buy the seller.

I for one, would not hesitate to send a watch I purchased from a trusted seller to RSC. Why? Because I trust the trusted seller to make it right in the extremely unlikely event a mistake has been made. Because without their reputation, they are not a trusted seller.

Would I have worries about sending a watch to RSC I purchased at pawn shop where I did not know the owner, or on eBay where I did not know the seller? Absolutely. But I don't want to own something that I have to worry about so I do not purchase watches in those venues.

[easebak]

You say "I purchased it pre-owned it was good price."

How good? Good enough to flag up something funny...?

[GMT Aviator]

Originally Posted by directioneng

As I understand it???

The insurance Company has reimbursed the original insured owner and owns the watch if and when when it is recovered.

The jeweller should reimburse the OP and will be out of pocket unless they can they recover the funds from the ‘thief’ they bought it from.

As the OP has to now purchased the watch from the insurance company he just needs the jeweller to refund the original purchase price.


If all the ducks are lined up this should not be a problem.

This.

[GMT Aviator]

FWIW I’ve had a similar thing happen to me.

Dealer who supplied me the watch was great about it, wrote to Rolex himself explaining he had sold me the watch and wanted to help get the situation resolved. Assured me he would supply a full refund but Rolex, despite saying the watch was reported stolen when they had it at RSC, eventually turned around and said the watch was NOT in fact stolen and there wasn’t a problem. It’s now registered to me in the Rolex archives.

The point with the OP here is that the dealer who sold him the watch in fact owes the buyer a refund for at least the amount the OP has had to pay to the insurance company to rebut his own watch back.

Trouble is, I doubt they will want to get involved because I suspect it wouldn’t be the first or last time they’ve probably knowingly handled stolen goods, otherwise they’d of been more helpful in the first place.

[sapper]

@GVAZQUEZ please name this jeweler. I live in Houston and don’t want my shadow crossing his doorstep.

[GVAZQUEZ]

Originally Posted by easebak

You say "I purchased it pre-owned it was good price."



How good? Good enough to flag up something funny...?

Sir at the time I was young I was not as familiar as I am now I paid 3,900 I thought it was fair. At that time there was not the demand as now.

There a saying “if you did nothing wrong why worry” I sent it in for service to RSC because I was not worried about it being reported stolen..


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[Butchh]

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

I had to re-post it because I orginally posted it int he wrong place...

I bought my first Rolex when I was around 22-23, it was black sub 16610 with the rehaut it was awesome I purchased it pre-owned it was good price. I was just excited for buying my first rolex and I just got back from my first trip to west africa working.. Then I went back and bought a bought a cartier for my wife the same year most likely....

Since then I have been blessed and purchased several rolexes for my wife and I from AD's.

I thought I would send my first sub to service because the bezel was not spinning correctly through one of my AD (benbridfge) to RSC I know the guy in service super cool dude..

I got a call weeks later that one of the two watches I sent for service was reported stolen? So I rolex attny contacted me I had proof of purchase (Invoice) and had to purchase my watch back from the insurance company.

I got my attny involved because this was ridiculous and the jeweler told my attny that he lost paper work in harvey (massive local flood Houston)...

So basically I paid my attny for nothing really just to send a letter to the jeweler and sort of negotiate $500.00 with insurance company... Jeweler told us that he was going sue us for harassment??? I was like what the hell man I bought a watch from you I have the receipt serial number and everything and you want to sue me???

So I pay my attny, insurance company get the rolex back.... UN SERVICED!!!! I just went through all that for nothing...

Once I had my watch back I went back to Benbridge to resend the watch to get serviced at RSC very clearly instructions send it to RSC so I could get my service card etc...

I get a phone call a few weeks ago my watch is in I'm like great this is over...The watch is identical unserviced I was seriously not having it... I had long talk with the manager because the guy I knew in service had been transferred to Austin.. got in touch with him he contacted cooperate and took care of it now the watch is at RSC getting serviced.... Worst part is when they called me that the watch was in it was in bubble wrap in a cardboard box and the lady looked me straight in the eye and told me that's how rolex dose it now!

million dollar question has anyone been through a case like this and how did you do about my attny was like Gabe why invest money fighting with this jeweler, my main point is: Im out 8k now that I shouldn't be plus its not right this guy is running a business and I'm just supposed to walk away like its cool you sold me a stolen watch and take zero responsibility for it..

Take a deep breath, and start over, bro.

[cruise_bone]

If you did any of this in Writing with your Jeweler he probably couldn't understand your writing either, so this is all on you.

[77T]

For the stub we have running about access to Rolex’s restricted theft list, consider this (at least in USA).

AD’s who purchase pre-owned jewelry, watches and gold have access to the National Crime Information Center database for tracking stolen articles information. They make queries via local authorities and are supposed to hold items much like a pawn shop does.

In the OP’s case, the Texas authorities ought to be informed that this jeweler sold a stolen watch. There are consequences that may result - and a forewarned jeweler might be willing to correct this situation to the OP’s satisfaction.

If the jeweler is unwilling, then file a complaint with the authorities and pursue damages separately in a “no cost” manner. No attorneys are needed if the OP uses small claims court to recover his $500 “rebuy” expenses with that insurer of the stolen watch.




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[absoluteczech]

Originally Posted by dxbtousa

what?

Right? I'm sometimes amazed how people have enough money to buy these watches, pay attorney fees, yet they can't seem to write a coherent sentence as if they never passed middle school.

OP did you even proof read your post before hitting submit?

[1665fan]

So who the hell is the thief jeweler???? Most importantly....and he lied about losing papers in flood, he never had them he knew he was buying and flipping stolen goods

[JR16]

Originally Posted by mountainjogger

Yes this OP is confusing beyond my ability to follow. And this varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction and the facts (of which we are clueless) are key. But as to your question, sometimes it works like this.

• Original owner has title.
  
  
  
  
  
• Watch is stollen.
  
  
  
  
  
• Thief acquires no title. Purchaser from thief acquires no title (even an innocent purchaser). Subsequent purchasers acquire no title (even innocent purchasers).
  
  
  
  
  
• Original owner make insurance claim. Insurance company pays claim. Insurance company now stands in the original owner's shoes (under the wording of the policy, the wording of the claim settlement documents or the law of the jurisdiction).
  
  
  
  
  
• Watch is recovered. Since the insurance company stands in the owners shoes, the watch goes to the insurance company.
  
  
  
  
  
• It does not go to the subsequent purchaser, because remember that he acquired no title.
  
  
  
  
  
• Original owner is notified and given the option to purchase the watch back from the insurance company. Original owner declines.
  
  
  
  
  
• Subsequent purchaser, who acquired no title, can try purchase the watch from the insurance company. In some jurisdictions, the original owner has a right to be paid his deductible or other losses as well. And it can become complicated. That is why lawyers sometimes get involved.
  
  
  

The hard lesson from this is, at least in many jurisdictions in the US, a thief cannot acquire or pass title with regard to personalty such as a watch. In other words, if you purchase a watch which was previously stollen, you purchase nothing, except maybe a lawsuit.



So, the old adage - buyer beware. Or as we say on this forum - buy the seller, not the watch.



Because if you buy the watch and it turns out to be stollen, you have purchased nothing. Except maybe a claim against the seller for breach of implied warranty of title. But the statute of limitations may have expired. Or you may have problems proving your case. Or the seller may not have the money. Or the seller may not cooperate.



But if you have bought the seller, you have purchased the seller's reputation. And the odds that the seller will make it right drastically improve.

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[Sunny Arizona]

Originally Posted by Frits1980

Re-post without the booze/what ever you are smoking so we can understand...

My thoughts...your words.

[brigadoonb]

Please either send me a pm with the jeweler's name or post it online so others don't run into this situation.

[Phil t 32]

Originally Posted by NachoNeal

Especially if your mother's brother, Jack, likes horseback riding.

Especially if, your mothers brother Jack, likes horseback riding

Any points for a right answer ??


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[ganagati]

OP DECODED

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

I had to re-post it because I orginally posted it int he wrong place...

I bought my first Rolex when I was around 22-23, it was black sub 16610 with the rehaut it was awesome I purchased it pre-owned it was good price. I was just excited for buying my first rolex and I just got back from my first trip to west africa working.. Then I went back and bought a bought a cartier for my wife the same year most likely....

OP got his first watch, not from an AD. He instead went with a shifty jeweler.

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

Since then I have been blessed and purchased several rolexes for my wife and I from AD's.

Bought more watches at Ben Bridge.

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

I thought I would send my first sub to service because the bezel was not spinning correctly through one of my AD (benbridfge) to RSC I know the guy in service super cool dude..

First watch wasn't working, so it was sent to RSC through the AD, Ben Bridge. He knows a guy at RSC. The dude is cool.

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

I got a call weeks later that one of the two watches I sent for service was reported stolen? So I rolex attny contacted me I had proof of purchase (Invoice) and had to purchase my watch back from the insurance company.

Turns out, watch #1 was somebody else's stolen property, but because he had the original receipt, it was okay. He was able to buy it back from the insurance company ... my guess that value equaled the insurance payout for the original watch theft claim - $500

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

I got my attny involved because this was ridiculous and the jeweler told my attny that he lost paper work in harvey (massive local flood Houston)...

Watch #1 was purchased from a jeweler, thought probably not an AD. Jeweler said "paperwork was lost" to get out of it. OP was mad and get his attorney involved. He didn't like that he had to re-purchase a watch that was sold to him by a shifty jeweler that was now trying to deny any culpability.

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

So basically I paid my attny for nothing really just to send a letter to the jeweler and sort of negotiate $500.00 with insurance company... Jeweler told us that he was going sue us for harassment??? I was like what the hell man I bought a watch from you I have the receipt serial number and everything and you want to sue me???

OP is annoyed that he had to involve his attorney over $500. He's even more annoyed when the shifty jeweler threatens to sue for harrassment.

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

So I pay my attny, insurance company get the rolex back.... UN SERVICED!!!! I just went through all that for nothing...

He got the rolex back, but it was unserviced. WTF!

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

Once I had my watch back I went back to Benbridge to resend the watch to get serviced at RSC very clearly instructions send it to RSC so I could get my service card etc...

Sends it BACK to RSC, but this time through Ben Bridge. Specifies he wants a service card?

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

I get a phone call a few weeks ago my watch is in I'm like great this is over...The watch is identical unserviced I was seriously not having it...

Few weeks later, watch is still not serviced

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

I had long talk with the manager because the guy I knew in service had been transferred to Austin..

OP is even more angry now, and talks with the manager. His RSC buddy transferred

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

got in touch with him he contacted cooperate and took care of it now the watch is at RSC getting serviced....

Managed to get in touch with his buddy, who contacted Rolex corporate. The watch was finally getting serviced!

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

Worst part is when they called me that the watch was in it was in bubble wrap in a cardboard box and the lady looked me straight in the eye and told me that's how rolex dose it now!

Watches apparently sit in bubble wrap in cardboard boxes while waiting to be serviced. Doesn't seem like the end of the world to me, but OP doesn't like it.

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

million dollar question has anyone been through a case like this and how did you do about

Has anyone else had a situation like this?

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

my attny was like Gabe why invest money fighting with this jeweler,

Attorney thought it was silly to fight the jeweler.

Originally Posted by GVAZQUEZ

my main point is: Im out 8k now that I shouldn't be plus its not right this guy is running a business and I'm just supposed to walk away like its cool you sold me a stolen watch and take zero responsibility for it..

He's out 8K fighting the shifty jeweler. And still mad. Can't say I blame him, but I'd rather just write a really nasty yelp.com review.....

[Tha Baron]

This is one of them Seinfeld posts...

[J.P.Jones]

Originally Posted by ganagati

OP DECODED


OP got his first watch, not from an AD. He instead went with a shifty jeweler.

Bought more watches at Ben Bridge.

First watch wasn't working, so it was sent to RSC through the AD, Ben Bridge. He knows a guy at RSC. The dude is cool.

Turns out, watch #1 was somebody else's stolen property, but because he had the original receipt, it was okay. He was able to buy it back from the insurance company ... my guess that value equaled the insurance payout for the original watch theft claim - $500

Watch #1 was purchased from a jeweler, thought probably not an AD. Jeweler said "paperwork was lost" to get out of it. OP was mad and get his attorney involved. He didn't like that he had to re-purchase a watch that was sold to him by a shifty jeweler that was now trying to deny any culpability.

OP is annoyed that he had to involve his attorney over $500. He's even more annoyed when the shifty jeweler threatens to sue for harrassment.

He got the rolex back, but it was unserviced. WTF!

Sends it BACK to RSC, but this time through Ben Bridge. Specifies he wants a service card?

Few weeks later, watch is still not serviced

OP is even more angry now, and talks with the manager. His RSC buddy transferred

Managed to get in touch with his buddy, who contacted Rolex corporate. The watch was finally getting serviced!

Watches apparently sit in bubble wrap in cardboard boxes while waiting to be serviced. Doesn't seem like the end of the world to me, but OP doesn't like it.

Has anyone else had a situation like this?

Attorney thought it was silly to fight the jeweler.

He's out 8K fighting the shifty jeweler. And still mad. Can't say I blame him, but I'd rather just write a really nasty yelp.com review.....

Nicely done. Now decode this.

[brucethemanlee]

huh?

[SS Oyster]

Man, sorry, but this story is really hard to follow. Hope all works out well.

Buy watches from reputable people, keep your receipts, boxes and papers that prove you are the owner.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bluepilot15]

Originally Posted by J.P.Jones

Nicely done. Now decode this.

That’s clearly a SS Daytona waitlist. I’m number 7.

[m j b]

Originally Posted by smym18

Incredibly difficult to follow and understand this story.

Originally Posted by Rori

I thought it was me. I couldn’t follow.

Originally Posted by mountainjogger

Sorry, OP's but your story is difficult to follow.

Originally Posted by Littletommy

I'm confused.

Originally Posted by Hollie_Rollie

I’m lost. OP wish you the best with everything.

Originally Posted by s7horton

OP, maybe edit your post to correct the grammar and punctuation. You may get better advice that way.

Originally Posted by Frits1980

Re-post without the booze/what ever you are smoking so we can understand...

Originally Posted by richard371

Im so lost and I have not even eaten an edible yet.

LOL.

The facts (such as I could understand them) don't really add up. I call troll.

[1665fan]

This post is garbage....post jeweler!!!!!!

[J.P.Jones]

Originally Posted by Bluepilot15

That’s clearly a SS Daytona waitlist. I’m number 7.

Please punch in once you get it. Heh..

[ganagati]

Originally Posted by J.P.Jones

Nicely done. Now decode this.

Rough translation, but it says something along the lines of....


I bought my first Sundial when I was around 22-23, it was black quartz with the rehaut it was awesome I purchased it pre-owned it was good price. I was just excited for buying my first sundial and I just got back from my first trip to west africa working.. Then I went back and bought a bought a wife the same year most likely....

Since then I have been blessed and purchased several sundial for my wife and I from merchants.

I thought I would send my first sundial to get adjusted because the shadow was not spinning correctly through one of my merchants (benbridfge) to RSC I know the guy in service super cool dude..

I got a call weeks later that one of the two sundials I sent for service was reported stolen? So I merchant's vizier contacted me I had proof of purchase (papyrus) and had to purchase my sundial back from the insurance company.

I got my local vizier involved because this was ridiculous and the jeweler told my vizier that he lost paper work in harvey (massive local flood Nile)...

So basically I paid my vizier for nothing really just to send a letter to the jeweler and sort of negotiate 500 pieces of silver with insurance company... Jeweler told us that he was going sue us for harassment??? I was like what the hell man I bought a sundial from you I have the papyrus and everything and you want to sue me???

So I pay my vizier, insurance company get the sundial back.... UN SERVICED!!!! I just went through all that for nothing...

Once I had my sundial back I went back to Benbridge to resend the sundial to get serviced at RSC very clearly instructions send it to RSC so I could get my service card etc...

I get a scroll a few weeks ago my sundial is in I'm like great this is over...The sundial is identical unserviced I was seriously not having it... I had long talk with the merchant because the guy I knew in service had been transferred to Cairo.. got in touch with him he contacted cooperate and took care of it now the sundial is at RSC getting serviced.... Worst part is when they sent me a scroll telling me that the sundial was in it was in a leaf wrap in a wicker box and the lady looked me straight in the eye and told me that's how the merchant dose it now!

million silver pieces question has anyone been through a case like this and how did you do about my vizier was like Gabe why invest money fighting with this jeweler, my main point is: Im out 8k now that I shouldn't be plus its not right this guy is running a business and I'm just supposed to walk away like its cool you sold me a stolen sundial and take zero responsibility for it..

[Sublovin]

Originally Posted by mountainjogger

Ok. Now It think I understand.

This would clearly help AD's who buy back and resell.

But I think that this might just punt the problem to the AD. Because the AD would have the same obligation not to hand a stolen watch back to a person who does not legally own it. We are in a area that I have no background on. But I can see problems.

Also, I question whether ADs would make this available to persons who are not buying from and AD. I would not do it if I was an AD. Why should I facilitate someone else's sale?

Serious problem area here. Not sure of the solution.

I don’t see the issue. This is how car dealers work. They check the database to see if the watch is stolen. Before handling the watch they ask for ID and if it comes up stolen it gets reported.
As for “why” AD’s would want to help...same reason many AD’s will size a watch for free that wasn’t purchased from them. These are resellers of luxury goods. Any chance to interact with a potential customer is a good opportunity for future business.