Advice about which Moonwatch

[ratty]

Originally Posted by nikesupremedunk

The fit and finish of the watch is pretty good, not Rolex good but it definitely feels like a $5k watch.

Can you explain what you mean by this please?

I have a Speedmaster and a few Rolex watches, and I can't see any great difference in fit and finish between the two makes.

If a Speedmaster feels like a $5k watch, what do Rolexs feel like?

Thanks.

[nikesupremedunk]

Originally Posted by ratty

Can you explain what you mean by this please?

I have a Speedmaster and a few Rolex watches, and I can't see any great difference in fit and finish between the two makes.

If a Speedmaster feels like a $5k watch, what do Rolexs feel like?

Thanks.

Originally Posted by jumpmaster 175

"The fit and finish of the watch is pretty good, not Rolex good"

I disagree with this statement...as it pertains to SS Rolex. I have a Speedy Pro (Hesalite)and a Rolex Sub, and I think if you handed them to a person who knew nothing about the brand names, they would think the Speedy was a higher quality watch..or at least equal

Let me explain. Yes, the fit and finish is good on the Speedy, almost comparable to Rolex, but Rolex has the advantage in craftsmanship, detail, and innovation. For example, first day I wore the speedy to work, I noticed that I could hear it ticking from my wrist when I'm on the keyboard. I don't remember my Rolex doing that and I can't hear it unless I put my ear to the watch. Not a big deal to me but a little surprising on a $5k watch.

Next is the bracelet. Comparing to the oyster bracelet with easy link, the Omega really falls short. The design is nice but there is no taper at the clasp so it feels and looks bulky. The clasp has 2 useless micro adjustments and with no option of half link your only option is to purchase a gigantic adjustable clasp for close to $400 (paid $385 at OB). The clasp is so heavy and bulky it throws off the balance of the bracelet but I have no choice because this is the only way for me to get it to fit my wrist. This is probably my one and only complaint about the Speedmaster. The Rolex Oyster bracelet on the other hand is a joy to wear. It tapers nicely from 20 to 16mm, and there's 3 micro adjustment points with easy link feature for further adjustments. And you get this even on the $5900 Oyster Perpetuals.

There's no denying that the Speedmaster looks cool as hell. That's the reason why I bought it and I love the fact that they kept it vintage looking with the steel bezel, hesalite, and the old school dial. But to me details matter and IMO Rolex wins this round too. Comparing the dial of the Speedy to the Daytona for example, there's way more detail in the Rolex. All the indices and hands used are of higher quality and the bezel markings are etched and not printed on. If you hold them in each hand you will be able to see the difference pretty quick.

So yes, there is nothing wrong with the fit and finish of the Speedmaster, but if you handed me a Daytona and Speedy and I knew nothing about watches, I'd guess the Daytona is the higher quality watch. Do I hate the Speedy then? Not at all, in fact quite the opposite. It's getting the most wrist time right now, I've been wearing it for 2 weeks straight and it's refreshing to take a break from Rolex. The speedy is a wonderful watch for its price point and that's why I bought it. And to get back to the OP's point of this thread, yes, you should definitely buy one!

[mmaggi]

Wow... you're splitting hairs with some of the critique. No tapering on the bracelet makes Omega inferior to the Rolex version? Criticizing the loud ticking on a movement that was based on another movement that's over 60 years old???? Ok.....

[ratty]

Thanks for the reply.

I have to say that in all of the years my wife and I have had Speedmasters I’ve never heard them tick once! Do they tick?

It would be nice if the bracelet was easier to adjust but then my 5 digit Subs, GMT2 and most of my Daytonas are not easily adjusted either and I don’t have problems with them.

The Speedmaster’s bracelet may be a different design to to those on some Rolexes, but I see that as a design difference and certainly not a quality issue.

All this talk of Speedmasters has got me thinking that it’s possibly time to start thinking about getting another one, the only problem is which one!

[nikesupremedunk]

Originally Posted by mmaggi

Wow... you're splitting hairs with some of the critique. No tapering on the bracelet makes Omega inferior to the Rolex version? Criticizing the loud ticking on a movement that was based on another movement that's over 60 years old???? Ok.....

I guess I was a little harsh lol. I do enjoy the speedy for it's vintage charm and that's why I bought it.

[nikesupremedunk]

Originally Posted by ratty

Thanks for the reply.

I have to say that in all of the years my wife and I have had Speedmasters I’ve never heard them tick once! Do they tick?

It would be nice if the bracelet was easier to adjust but then my 5 digit Subs, GMT2 and most of my Daytonas are not easily adjusted either and I don’t have problems with them.

The Speedmaster’s bracelet may be a different design to to those on some Rolexes, but I see that as a design difference and certainly not a quality issue.

All this talk of Speedmasters has got me thinking that it’s possibly time to start thinking about getting another one, the only problem is which one!

Hmm, yea I can definitely hear the ticking on my wrist when I am at work. I agree, quality is there for both brands, however I guess I'm more partial to Rolex since I'm more comfortable and experienced with them.

You should definitely pick up another Speedy. I was getting fatigued with Rolex and getting an Omega got my interest going again in watches. Maybe the new silver snoopy? I would love to get one but my budget only allowed for a hesalite pro...

[ratty]

I feel a bit like this at the moment.

There aren’t many current Rolex watches which I would be interested in and I can’t get those from an AD.

Recently I’ve been looking at Speedmasters again. I don’t know much about them and I’ve been trying to learn more. I have an Apollo / Soyuz from about 10 years ago and enjoy wearing it. My wife uses a Silver Snoopy as her daily watch and I can see the attraction of that version as well. I have my name down for a SS 321 and the new Snoopy but goodness knows if or when these will actually turn up.

I’m learning more about the older watches. I fancy a ‘Hesalite Sandwich’ with the tritium dial. I like how the tritium hour markers look. It’s just a case of finding a good one to have a look at.

I also like the current Hesalite version of the Speedmaster. I bought one a few years ago but returned it soon after. The buying experience was disappointing and this put me off the watch, but I wouldn’t mind giving another one a go. I like the idea of wearing one on a Silver Snoopy strap.

As I have said above, I have no problems with the Omega bracelet and I certainly have never heard a Speedmaster ticking so I would be happy to try another one and I prefer the look of the Hesalite version.

[samson66]

Originally Posted by nikesupremedunk

Let me explain. Yes, the fit and finish is good on the Speedy, almost comparable to Rolex, but Rolex has the advantage in craftsmanship, detail, and innovation. For example, first day I wore the speedy to work, I noticed that I could hear it ticking from my wrist when I'm on the keyboard. I don't remember my Rolex doing that and I can't hear it unless I put my ear to the watch. Not a big deal to me but a little surprising on a $5k watch.

Next is the bracelet. Comparing to the oyster bracelet with easy link, the Omega really falls short. The design is nice but there is no taper at the clasp so it feels and looks bulky. The clasp has 2 useless micro adjustments and with no option of half link your only option is to purchase a gigantic adjustable clasp for close to $400 (paid $385 at OB). The clasp is so heavy and bulky it throws off the balance of the bracelet but I have no choice because this is the only way for me to get it to fit my wrist. This is probably my one and only complaint about the Speedmaster. The Rolex Oyster bracelet on the other hand is a joy to wear. It tapers nicely from 20 to 16mm, and there's 3 micro adjustment points with easy link feature for further adjustments. And you get this even on the $5900 Oyster Perpetuals.

There's no denying that the Speedmaster looks cool as hell. That's the reason why I bought it and I love the fact that they kept it vintage looking with the steel bezel, hesalite, and the old school dial. But to me details matter and IMO Rolex wins this round too. Comparing the dial of the Speedy to the Daytona for example, there's way more detail in the Rolex. All the indices and hands used are of higher quality and the bezel markings are etched and not printed on. If you hold them in each hand you will be able to see the difference pretty quick.

So yes, there is nothing wrong with the fit and finish of the Speedmaster, but if you handed me a Daytona and Speedy and I knew nothing about watches, I'd guess the Daytona is the higher quality watch. Do I hate the Speedy then? Not at all, in fact quite the opposite. It's getting the most wrist time right now, I've been wearing it for 2 weeks straight and it's refreshing to take a break from Rolex. The speedy is a wonderful watch for its price point and that's why I bought it. And to get back to the OP's point of this thread, yes, you should definitely buy one!

Agree with the bracelet comments. Omega falls short on their bracelets. The Speedy bracelet in particular is a problem due to the lack of on the fly adjustment, only two micro adjustments, no half links, lack of taper, and just generally does not wear as comfortably as a Rolex bracelet.

I moved up to a coaxial Speedmaster and the bracelet is improved in the sense that it has the micro adjustment clasp that allows three position on-the-fly adjustment, and comes with two half links. Makes it much easier to size correctly which has always been a problem with the Moonwatch. Having said that, it still in nowhere near as comfortable as my Rolex bracelets. Rolex isn't perfect but their bracelets are really fantastic, both in comfort and appearance. My Speedy bracelet has sharp edges to it and you can really tell on the wrist. It's a very good bracelet, but could be better.

[Gazoak]

I had the same dilemma. Small wrists and whether to go Hesalite or Sapphire. In the end I went Hesalite and don't regret it. I'm fairly careful with my watches and prefer the original vintage look. You won't regret it!

[dchernikoff]

Interesting discussion, all. Thanks for the info and advice. I think I'm leaning towards the hesalite because of the more vintage look - and both my Rolexes have the sapphire crystal with the "edge" on it so I think the hesalite will be a nice change. Plus I like history and that is the only one that is certified for EVA which gives it a certain historical place... And as for scratching the crystal, well it will be worn in rotation so not my one-and-only-always-on-my-wrist, I think that I'll give it a try and see how it holds up scratch-wise. Who knows, maybe I've matured enough over the years to not beat the hell out of my watch??? Time will tell...

I plan to go into a Omega AD this weekend and try them both on (I called ahead and yes they have both). Which should answer the size question, and hopefully solidify my hesalite vrs sapphire question as well.

-Dan

[ratty]

Good luck at the AD.

I’m looking forward to seeing / hearing what decision you make.

[dchernikoff]

Originally Posted by ratty

Good luck at the AD.

I’m looking forward to seeing / hearing what decision you make.

Was so nice to be able to try on both watches and compare. I decided on the Hesalite. I liked the engraving on the back, and the look of the domed crystal. And both of them looked fine on my wrist, not too big at all even though I thought 40mm was my limit. Beautiful watches, both - I was very pleased with the quality of workmanship and level of details, and the case and band were both stunning!

I was about to buy it on the spot, but my wife was giving out vibes, and our anniversary is only a week away, so I thought I'd wait "just in case" she wanted to surprise me with it (I surprised her with a Rolex last Christmas)... If not then I'll head back over there. The salesperson offered me $1135 off the list price, without my even asking. Gonna be hard to go back to a Rolex AD after this experience!

-Dan


-Dan

[fiddyg]

I went with the Hesalite crystal as well and wear it on the nano strap. It took a while to get used to winding it up every time I’d wear it as it wasn’t an automatic but besides that love the watch.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Nodzex]

Originally Posted by Oyster Sauce

1. Your wrist is perfect for the Speedy Pro...7” is not slender at all

2. You can’t go wrong with Hesalite or Sapphire. Based on your post, I recommend the sapphire sandwich...when you’re wearing it looks practically the same as the Hesalite (excepted for edge of the glass), and when you’re not wearing it, you can drool over the movement.

Best wishes!

I second this!

[ratty]

Originally Posted by dchernikoff

The salesperson offered me $1135 off the list price, without my even asking. Gonna be hard to go back to a Rolex AD after this experience!

-Dan


-Dan

Congratulations on getting the watch.

Can you tell us what $1135 represents as a percentage discount please?

[whiteibex]

Another point to consider when choosing between hesalite and sapphire is what people call the "milky ring" effect. You will find plenty images on Google. The original speedmaster was hesalite, and the sapphire was later on "fitted" on the same case, which gives this different reflection (which I kinda like but would deter others).

[danwang0520]

I got the sapphire crytal version.....

[dchernikoff]

Originally Posted by ratty

Congratulations on getting the watch.

Can you tell us what $1135 represents as a percentage discount please?

Its a 19% discount! List price is 5835 USD.

-Dan

[ratty]

Originally Posted by dchernikoff

Its a 19% discount! List price is 5835 USD.

-Dan

Thank you.

[ratty]

Originally Posted by dchernikoff

Its a 19% discount! List price is 5835 USD.

-Dan

Are there taxes to be added to the USA prices, or is $5835 the total price?

I'm trying to work out what discounts are available, but am I right in thinking that prices are plus taxes at different rates in different US states?

I would be very surprised if I could get a 19% discount in the UK.

[texasmade]

Originally Posted by ratty

Are there taxes to be added to the USA prices, or is $5835 the total price?

I'm trying to work out what discounts are available, but am I right in thinking that prices are plus taxes at different rates in different US states?

I would be very surprised if I could get a 19% discount in the UK.

Kind of depends. Up until last year, the rule was the company needed to have a physical store in the state in order to charge sales tax at time of purchase. If the company didn't have a physical store, then it was up to the individual to remit sales tax on their own to their state. There was a recent tax ruling that up ended this long standing practice so some companies are still going by the old rule and some are collecting from everyone.

[dchernikoff]

Originally Posted by ratty

Are there taxes to be added to the USA prices, or is $5835 the total price?

I'm trying to work out what discounts are available, but am I right in thinking that prices are plus taxes at different rates in different US states?

I would be very surprised if I could get a 19% discount in the UK.

No, $5835 is the MSRP. That is taxed additionally, according to the state sales tax which differs form state to state - in California it's 9% now. So whatever price they sell you the watch at (including discounts) then gets taxed added to it according to the state sales tax rate. We don't have VAT, just sales tax.

-Dan

[ratty]

Originally Posted by dchernikoff

No, $5835 is the MSRP. That is taxed additionally, according to the state sales tax which differs form state to state - in California it's 9% now. So whatever price they sell you the watch at (including discounts) then gets taxed added to it according to the state sales tax rate. We don't have VAT, just sales tax.

-Dan

Thanks for this.

So a watch / item has a MSRP of $5835, but it doesn't actually sell for that, it sells for that plus any state tax. This means that the actual price of the watch varies from state to state.

Is this correct?

This is different to the UK where prices include VAT (Value Added Tax) at 20%. If the UK advertised price is £4000, that is all you pay no matter where in the UK you buy it. If you negotiate a discount of 10%, the price drops to £3600. Because of the two different systems it's difficult to directly compare UK prices to US prices. It sounds as if there are bigger discounts to be had in the US compared to the UK. I would be amazed if an AD offered a 19% discount in the UK. I would be very surprised if a buyer could negotiate a 19% discount of an Omega at an AD. I have heard of discounts of up to about 9% at ADs but most do not like to go higher than single figures in my experience. I have always been told that there is no discounts at all at the Omega Boutiques in the UK.

Can anyone tell me how it works in Canada please?

Thanks again.

[wlchuccc]

Originally Posted by ratty

Thanks for this.

So a watch / item has a MSRP of $5835, but it doesn't actually sell for that, it sells for that plus any state tax. This means that the actual price of the watch varies from state to state.

Is this correct?

This is different to the UK where prices include VAT (Value Added Tax) at 20%. If the UK advertised price is £4000, that is all you pay no matter where in the UK you buy it. If you negotiate a discount of 10%, the price drops to £3600. Because of the two different systems it's difficult to directly compare UK prices to US prices. It sounds as if there are bigger discounts to be had in the US compared to the UK. I would be amazed if an AD offered a 19% discount in the UK. I would be very surprised if a buyer could negotiate a 19% discount of an Omega at an AD. I have heard of discounts of up to about 9% at ADs but most do not like to go higher than single figures in my experience. I have always been told that there is no discounts at all at the Omega Boutiques in the UK.

Can anyone tell me how it works in Canada please?

Thanks again.

The OBs in the UK do offer a small discount for some non LE pieces as far as I know.

[1William]

I negotiate my discounts as a tax included situation. Some will play the game and some will not. Since you own the taxes if you can get the discount and the taxes included that is the percentage.

[texasmade]

Originally Posted by ratty

Thanks for this.

So a watch / item has a MSRP of $5835, but it doesn't actually sell for that, it sells for that plus any state tax. This means that the actual price of the watch varies from state to state.

Is this correct?

Not just state to state but can also vary from city to city too. Where I live, tax is 8.25%. My parents live about 30 minutes from me and their tax used to be 7.25% a few years ago. I think it was recently raised to 8.25%.

[ratty]

It appears to be a complicated system.

[Atr365]

Just to chime in last minute. My very first watch was a DJ36 loved it and still own it today. I purchase the Moonwatch with hesalite without hesitation because it closely resembles the first Moonwatch. I have no issues with the crystal and I do bang my everyday watches like this one... I keep a tube of Polywatch and use it once a year if I like to refine the crystal like new.

[Atr365]

Originally Posted by dchernikoff

Great into! Thanks all. I’m even more excited about this watch. I’ll find an AD to try them on and see if I can get a discount. If not then I’ll probably go with a seller on here.

-Dan

Topper’s Jewelers is open with appts.