Prospective employer contacted current employer

[Zakalwe]

Originally Posted by artschool

why would his current employer wish to retain him when he has no loyalty?

The OP hasn’t provided enough information to allow his loyalty to be fairly judged - we have no idea why he’s applying for a new job.

In which case, sitting in judgement over a stranger in a pickle doesn’t really seem to be good form, does it?

[V25V]

Originally Posted by nick800

Thanks for the comments.

My boss is who told me to resign today. It was my boss that received the inquiry from the potential new company by the first person I interviewed with, who is not in HR.

I don't think I pissed anyone off during the interview process, as I have a plane ticket paid for by them to go meet with the CEO in a few days.

I"m not sure the industry matters. I've basically been a senior exec across multiple industries my entire career. This is a move from one industry to a totally different one.

Who was the first person you met with? This person did not know your boss from Adam and just called him out of the blue to ask about you? If that's what you are saying, this is extremely odd.

The industry matters, those in same industries tend to know each other at the C-level. They network with each other since they tend to be dealing with the same issues, so often you get this sort of "backdoor" reference when that is the case. Or they worked with or for one another at some point. However, some random person you interviewed with calling your boss who they have never met, to do a reference on you prior to anyone else even meeting you, let alone making an offer and having your permission, is VERY odd. So odd it doesn't even make sense, I have NEVER seen it.

[pickettt]

I think from the responses and advice given, we can deduce which of us are employers and which of us are employees.

[cda555]

Originally Posted by artschool

why would his current employer wish to retain him when he has no loyalty?

So people should only ever work at one place for life? Yeah, that’s not going to happen. I’m a person who likes to work for the same company for years, but the current trend with millennials is to bounce around for higher paychecks. It’s unreasonable to judge people who look for new jobs.


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[Wesley Crusher]

Originally Posted by cda555

So people should only ever work at one place for life? Yeah, that’s not going to happen. I’m a person who likes to work for the same company for years, but the current trend with millennials is to bounce around for higher paychecks. It’s unreasonable to judge people who look for new jobs.


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FWIW, this is only a trend because many employers no longer value their employees. You can only pay somebody peanuts for so long before they realize their worth.

[pickettt]

Originally Posted by cda555

So people should only ever work at one place for life? Yeah, that’s not going to happen. I’m a person who likes to work for the same company for years, but the current trend with millennials is to bounce around for higher paychecks. It’s unreasonable to judge people who look for new jobs.


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At the same time, it’s not unreasonable for employers to devalue those who are looking elsewhere. Loyalty is now and always has been a two way street.

[pickettt]

Originally Posted by Wesley Crusher

FWIW, this is only a trend because many employers no longer value their employees. You can only pay somebody peanuts for so long before they realize their worth.

Chicken or the egg? At least in this instance (which we don’t have all of the information), which party initiated the disloyalty?

[Abdullah71601]

Originally Posted by Wesley Crusher

FWIW, this is only a trend because many employers no longer value their employees. You can only pay somebody peanuts for so long before they realize their worth.

Companies work the snot out of employees, pile on responsibilities, and don't compensate for the increased workload. They jump to the next company, who values that experience more than the current employer. Then the cycle repeats.

Unless you're some kind of mafia don that demands loyalty, you probably hire for skills and competence. A candidate who jumped every 4-7 years likely has accumulated a solid skill set across a broad range of experiences. I wouldn't look at that as a negative. Whereas, I would be curious why someone with 20+ years in the same company is knocking on my door.

[nick800]

Thank you.

To answer who was the first person I met with, it was the same person who has contacted my current employer. I agree, that it would seem highly likely they know each other in some capacity regardless that it is different industries.

Regarding loyalty: I've been at this company for about a year and was contacted about the opportunity.

I was at my previous company for about 10 years. I could go on and on about how companies treat employees badly. That company has 30% turn over in employees, largely resignations, year after year. The reason is because most managers treat their people as pieces of equipment. I tried as hard as I could to shift the culture, and was successful for the divisions I was responsible for. But at some point, it gets real hard running a company when you have numerically 100% turnover every few years. The year I decided to leave, 1/2 of the executive team also left in about 8 months.

Originally Posted by Zakalwe

The OP hasn’t provided enough information to allow his loyalty to be fairly judged - we have no idea why he’s applying for a new job.

In which case, sitting in judgement over a stranger in a pickle doesn’t really seem to be good form, does it?

[texasmade]

Originally Posted by artschool

you should do the honourable thing and resign with what's left of your integrity intact.

Didn't realize that an employer is a king, mafia don, or street gang? I guess it's blood in blood out to get employed at your job.

[Star Ferry]

Originally Posted by pickettt

I think from the responses and advice given, we can deduce which of us are employers and which of us are employees.

regardless, OP needs to at least talk to a lawyer. the employer perspective won't help him if the advice is "Resign now, you disloyal serf!" That prevents him from getting unemployment benefits and may only be in the interest of his employer. I understand there are plenty of bad employees and running a business isn't easy, but there's a clear power differential involved that makes employees vulnerable, as is the case here with the OP.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by nick800

To answer who was the first person I met with, it was the same person who has contacted my current employer. I agree, that it would seem highly likely they know each other in some capacity regardless that it is different industries.

Well, I mean who was the person in the company? CFO? CTO? etc.

Also, if they did know each other in any sort of close manner, a backdoor reference would have never been brought to your attention. He would have asked your boss, who he knew would keep it to himself and either try to retain you or provide a good word and let it play out from there. The fact that your boss came to you and told you to resign as a result of this call makes me think two things. 1, they do not know each other well, if at all. 2, this whole story is very fishy. Why would this person you met with (would still like to know who in the company he/she is) call your boss who they clearly do not know well, if at all, and try to conduct a reference on someone they are in the earliest stages with and without their consent? It just doesn't make any sense at all, of course that was going to blow up your spot and put you in a terrible situation. And how is this person who did this still employed by your current employer? He/she is a moron if that's really how this went down.

[artschool]

Originally Posted by pickettt

I think from the responses and advice given, we can deduce which of us are employers and which of us are employees.

i think you are dead right with that one.

[nick800]

Appreciate the comments. I agree it sounds fishy. It would to me if I was reading the story. Of course I have left some points out that are irrelevant, or not looking to speak overly bad about anyone. Even more so given the situation is not yet resolved one way or another.

I have nothing to gain from an internet post that would be distorted to favor my point of view. I was shocked at the situation and was mostly sharing the absurdity with a group of people that are likely more experienced/successful than any other general audience.

The person in the prospective company goes by title of General Manager. He’s leading the search, and is not the CEO.

Originally Posted by V25V

Well, I mean who was the person in the company? CFO? CTO? etc.

Also, if they did know each other in any sort of close manner, a backdoor reference would have never been brought to your attention. He would have asked your boss, who he knew would keep it to himself and either try to retain you or provide a good word and let it play out from there. The fact that your boss came to you and told you to resign as a result of this call makes me think two things. 1, they do not know each other well, if at all. 2, this whole story is very fishy. Why would this person you met with (would still like to know who in the company he/she is) call your boss who they clearly do not know well, if at all, and try to conduct a reference on someone they are in the earliest stages with and without their consent? It just doesn't make any sense at all, of course that was going to blow up your spot and put you in a terrible situation. And how is this person who did this still employed by your current employer? He/she is a moron if that's really how this went down.

[JasoninDenver]

My thoughts are that you will get the new job you intervieed for or possibly the new vacancy in the general manager position that just opened up after the CEO realized how bad his current geneeral manage is.

[bobernet]

I’m guessing smaller/younger company? I can’t imagine an experienced exec anywhere behaving like this “GM.”

[cda555]

Is it possible to do a virtual/Skype interview with the prospective CEO?


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[nick800]

New company is close to 300 employees. Been around for 20 years.

I did hint at the skype idea with CEO by saying "I'd happily make myself available for a skype call if you think that would be an option."

I didn't want to outright tell them what they should do, as that could be taken wrong.

[Etschell]

Originally Posted by nick800

I called the HR contact at the prospective employer. She was horrified and apologized profusely (remember, it was not HR that contacted my current employer). I just politely explained the predicament I am now in, and asked if she had any ideas.

They have a process, which I understand, that included meeting with the CEO. Naturally. She is trying to see if there is an early opportunity to meet in person, but he is currently traveling. Which I knew prior to this event.

So...we'll just see what happens. I'm not going to resign. If they want to fire me, then oh well. Most of this is out of my control now.

What I really wanted to say was: Given that I am being told to resign today, you need to figure out how to make me an offer by end of day. I know my references came back impeccable. It is possible for your CEO to get on the phone this afternoon, or your risk losing your top candidate (as stated by you). He'll know within 5 minutes if I'm a fit or not. So let's get on with it because now I'm in a bad situation from one of your rogue employees.

But, I find it is usually better to lead people down the path to making the right decision rather than telling them what the answer is.

Dont do that.

Stay put and do nothing. Dont dare tell a prospective employer what to do. Dont do it. She apologized take it.

Your best case scenario is you get the new job and dont burn the bridge with your soon to be old employer.

I pound litigation 24 7. You dont want to be there because all you will get is some nuisance money. Both relationships will be ruined.

Litigants never win even when they win. There is a cost to litigation. Professionals in the litigation field always win. You dont want to play in my world unless you have to. The toll is more than just financial....

Right now other than your boss, who sounds quite emotional, being an annoyance nothing has happened. He cant fire you. He has no authority.

I am sure it will work out just fine for you. Good luck.

[pickettt]

Originally Posted by Star Ferry

regardless, OP needs to at least talk to a lawyer. the employer perspective won't help him if the advice is "Resign now, you disloyal serf!"

I certainly hope that wasn’t the intonation.

[Old Geezer]

Originally Posted by Abdullah71601

Don’t resign.

Speak to a lawyer ASAP, then follow his advice.

This !!!!

[Old Geezer]

Originally Posted by nick800

New company is close to 300 employees. Been around for 20 years.

I did hint at the skype idea with CEO by saying "I'd happily make myself available for a skype call if you think that would be an option."

I didn't want to outright tell them what they should do, as that could be taken wrong.

Nick, I hope it works out with you with the new employer so you are not out in the cold. If it turns out to be a rookie mistake and the company is a good place to be, move on. It's always easier to look for a job when you have a job. Good luck !

[superdog]

Originally Posted by pickettt

I think from the responses and advice given, we can deduce which of us are employers and which of us are employees.

Was thinking similarly.

[Fat_ninja]

OP - breathe. One step at a time. Don't wrack our brain too hard on this. One door closes, one door opens. If this works out great... if it doesn't work out, you'll look for the next job.

Be confident in yourself in your skillset...irrespective of what others believe.


Breathe... relax. You can and will land on your feet.

[CamSLC]

Very unprofessional of the prospective employer and very irritating of the current employer. In the industry I worked in this would be a very blatant fopaux. Hope the new opportunity presents itself quickly.

[037]

Originally Posted by pickettt

I think from the responses and advice given, we can deduce which of us are employers and which of us are employees.

Which category is self-employed with no employees?

[V25V]

Originally Posted by 037

Which category is self-employed with no employees?

Then you wouldn't be an employer. You would be a sole proprietor.


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[037]

Originally Posted by V25V

Then you wouldn't be an employer. You would be a sole proprietor.

I'm aware of the technical definition. But, I'm neither an employer nor employee per his deduction.

[dtwer]

Originally Posted by blassy

Been in the recruitment game for 20 years and I've never even seen this.
I would have a big issue with this.
They could be so confident that they want to hire you and it's in the bag that it's a done deal.
On the other hand....I would question the integrity of a company that would allow this to happen.
Like was said - all out of your hands now, but I would think litigation could be in your future if it doesn't go down the way I want it. Hard to get rid of a a taste in your mouth that bad.

This.

I would serious reconsider working for a company like this. Either they are ruthless or they are simply clueless; none of which bodes well for you as an employee.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by 037

I'm aware of the technical definition. But, I'm neither an employer nor employee per his deduction.

Gotcha.


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