1958 6536/1 Sub Dial question.

[Senior_Movements]

Hello all!

Excited to be on this board! I have been digging through information where I can find it but I'm at a bit of a loss on this one.

I inherited a 1958 6536/1 Sub from my father (who is still alive but retired and unfortunately his memory is quickly fading) and I'm trying to figure out why the dial seems to have a 200m depth rating on it but all signs point to it being a 6536/1. I know my father bought this one as a group of 3 probably about 50 years ago and it was second hand at the time and I know the dial was never changed in my fathers ownership. Everything I find on the web seems to point to this model only having 100m depth variants for dials i.e red depth, etc.

The serial number matches 1958 and the movement seems to be correct as well being a 1030.

Can anyone point me in the right direction? any help would be greatly appreciated!

Unfortunately I don't have enough posts to post a photo yet. I'm working on it.

Michael

[Tools]

Anybody can attach a photo using the paperclip icon and meeting size requirements.

[Juhuatai]

Does it specifically say 6536 between the lugs?

[Dan S]

If it is a 6536 case, it definitely sounds like the dial is not original, but please try to post some photos. You will need to crop the photo to exclude irrelevant parts and reduce the size to fit the requirements. Perhaps you can also show the engravings between the lugs.

[Senior_Movements]

Originally Posted by Juhuatai

Does it specifically say 6536 between the lugs?

Yes the case is 6536/1 and the serial number is 398599 which aligns with 1958.

There is a serial number: N815543 on the inside as well on the movement but I'm not able to track anything on that. Assuming its the Rolex factory build code.

Also, about 30 years ago, I lost the original white pearl bezel when it popped off in a place where I was not able to stop and look for it, (long story). So the one on it is not original.

I know its dirty as hell, please don't judge. I wear this watch daily. :)

Thanks again,

Michael

[TuRo]

Can you measure the winding crown across before you get us photographs might be a 6538/1 if you are super-lucky :-)

[Senior_Movements]

Originally Posted by pauldavidthorpe

Can you measure the winding crown across before you get us photographs might be a 6538/1 if you are super-lucky :-)

unfortunately not, it has the 6MM crown, I had the thought the same thing :)

[Senior_Movements]

Also a little background, my father is a retired watchmaker so I've been around amazing watches all my life. My father worked in new York then later in Boston for Cartier as their old collections specialist until they started forcing him to replace 100 year old movements that he was repairing with quarts movements and it crushed his sole until he retired. its just my fathers memory now in his 80's is failing and I've acquired all of his repair items like his bench, lathe and even old school vibrograph :) I'm getting into the 40 or so vintage timepieces (nothing crazy) that he left me now as a hobby.

[TuRo]

The watch has a refinished/repainted dial, hence the 200m - - Swiss - is not a designation and Swiss sub dials were mainly chapter ring dials (ring around outside of minute markers). The hash minute markers don't go to dial edge as they should also on a Rolex dial. Rgds Paul.

[Senior_Movements]

Originally Posted by pauldavidthorpe

The watch has a refinished/repainted dial, hence the 200m - - Swiss - is not a designation and Swiss sub dials were mainly chapter ring dials (ring around outside of HR markers). The hour markers don't go to dial edge as they should on this dial. Rgds Paul.

that's what I was afraid of. I know this thing hasn't been touched since my father picked it up second hand sometime in the early 70's so I'll ask him about it and see if he has any memory of it which I doubt but thank you very much!

[Juhuatai]

As Paul said, refinished dial but wear and enjoy!

[Senior_Movements]

Is there any way of me finding out what dial is supposed to be on it and trying to locate a new old stock or used original dial for it? Or are we talking impossible at this point?

Thanks again!

[TuRo]

Not impossible, but before you do that please fire over some photos of engravings between lugs and caseback inside and the mvt/calibre to make sure the rest of watch is fine that your Dad bought.
Btw a 58 dial will be a Swiss or Swiss exclamation in gilt so won't be cheap and will run you £6k min up to £15k for a rarer version. A much cheaper option will be a tritium T25 service dial from the 70/80s for about £1-2k

[Kingface66]

Originally Posted by Senior_Movements

Is there any way of me finding out what dial is supposed to be on it and trying to locate a new old stock or used original dial for it? Or are we talking impossible at this point?

Thanks again!

Do some searches for 6536 dials. There’s a ton of info on the web, this forum, VintageRolexForum (VRF), other forums, websites, books, etc. For a watch of this rarity and value, it’s worth doing as much research as you can. As for finding a NOS dial for it….that’s gonna be a Herculean task, and will be many many thousands of dollars. Used original will also be tough, and expect to pay quite a bit. A later service dial may be the “easiest” course to take.

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by Senior_Movements

Is there any way of me finding out what dial is supposed to be on it and trying to locate a new old stock or used original dial for it? Or are we talking impossible at this point?

Thanks again!

Anything is possible if price is no object. Are you ok paying 5 figures for a nice dial? If so, then as noted, you really need to start by doing your due diligence to make sure that the rest of the watch is correct before making a major investment in the dial.

[southtexas]

Can you take a few group photos of the other watches you received from him? You might have some real interesting pieces, given your dad’s position.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Juhuatai]

There's a NOS 6536 service dial on ebay for 16k. Obviously overpriced but in general for NOS you will be paying a crazy premium.

[Senior_Movements]

Originally Posted by southtexas

Can you take a few group photos of the other watches you received from him? You might have some real interesting pieces, given your dad’s position.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm working on it. I've been setting up his workbench so I have a place to remove case backs, etc. I have roughly 40 pieces all in some form of reconditioned condition. None of the big names like Patek or anything but a bunch of Hamiltons, a rare Gerard perregaux, flags dial. I will get some pics up soon. Hard with the size limitations to convert all these pics over.

[Dan S]

If I were considering spending $16k for a service dial, I'd be curious to send it to Rolex to see what their restoration department could do.

[Senior_Movements]

I'm trying to do this on my phone. Bear with me. Attachment 1305751

Attachment 1305752

[Dr.Smellody]

Originally Posted by Dan S

If I were considering spending $16k for a service dial, I'd be curious to send it to Rolex to see what their restoration department could do.

I've always wondered this myself. I read somewhere that this restoration department services start at $10k. I wonder what Rolex's position is on refinished dials. I imagine that would require them to be switched out.

[Mark020]

Originally Posted by Dan S

If I were considering spending $16k for a service dial, I'd be curious to send it to Rolex to see what their restoration department could do.

#metoo

[TuRo]

If you spent $16k on a post 2000 Swiss Luminova or T25 white service dial you'd be off-your-rocker imho, as the watch would probably be worth less than that afterwards!
In fact I saw a perfectly ok 5508 100m 1980s T25 dial on e bay a few months back that went for £1450.00 dial was bluey grey hue, white writing and matte dial edge was ok, dial feet were fine.

[Senior_Movements]

Yes, I'd only entertain replacing the dial with something that I could prove was originally meant to be on the watch when produced. I'd love to get the build sheet for this thing.

Also, I tried to post some pics last night from my phone but think they need to be approved by a mod first as I don't see that post. I might just upload everything to my google drive and give you guys the link.

[TuRo]

Just to show how they can be found cheaper end of scale - here's a SL Rolex Service Dial £2500.00
https://www.chrono24.co.uk/rolex/dia...13069.htm#gref

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by Senior_Movements

Yes, I'd only entertain replacing the dial with something that I could prove was originally meant to be on the watch when produced. I'd love to get the build sheet for this thing.

Also, I tried to post some pics last night from my phone but think they need to be approved by a mod first as I don't see that post. I might just upload everything to my google drive and give you guys the link.

A period-correct dial for this watch in decent condition is unicorn poop, and would be extremely expensive. I'd wager that any that exist are being hoarded by collectors who will not let them go easily. The parts that people have mentioned so far are "service" dials, which are authentic replacement parts. A parts list will not help you to distinguish original from service/aftermarket, you need the type of detailed knowledge gained from experience to identify the details of the printing.

This site only hosts photos of a very limited size, so you will need to crop and down-size the file before uploading. No approval needed. Most people will probably not click on a strange link. After 10 posts (you're almost there), you can host your full size photos on a site like Imgur, and embed BBCode links.

[Juhuatai]

I mean yes, I agree one can find service dials for cheaper. But a 6536 dial is definitely rarer than a 5508 dial.

[Senior_Movements]

I'll be taking some detailed photos of all the serial numbers I can find on the watch after some basic disassembly this afternoon. Stay tuned.

[Senior_Movements]

Finally had some time to take some detailed photos with my microscope of watch. Let me know your thoughts.

I plan to remove the movement and get the dial off to examine the back of it next.

Also, I've seen photos here: https://rolexhaven.com/6536-1-tropical--58.html that appear to show the dials with the "Swiss" at the bottom so is it possible that this dial is original? Like I said, my father acquired the watch late 70's ish and never replaced the dial so I'm at a loss there.

[subx]

it's a 6536-1. which is my favorite sub, congrats.
However it will need a dial (unobtainium), correct hands, and correct bezel insert (58 is very expensive usually a red triangle)... look to spend $15K-20K+ to put it back to spec :(