Red Sub Mark VI???

[michaellu]

Hello!

New guy here.

I happen to have acquired a Red Sub recently and I have a few questions on what should I do about it.

Initially, I had doubts on its authenticity and went to have it checked today. The appraiser said that it was authentic and purchased here in Japan.

The appraiser said that the band and the crown has been replaced. (you might have noticed that the either the dial or the crown is not perfectly aligned)

I am going to go and have it appraised somewhere else as well to make sure that it isn’t a lemon.



If this is authentic, should I have it restored at the RSC? (edited) Any advice?

Thank you!

[sdimi]

I'm no expert but the dial looks strange to me.
ft first means it should be a Mark IV, V, or VI.
It has closed 6's so that makes it a Mark VI but the f in ft does not line up with the m in submariner correctly.
Then looking at the alignment/spacing of ROLEX with the coronet and ROLEX with OYSTER PERPETUAL DATE there seems to be a problem.
The long 12 hour plot looks strange also.
The crown guards are incredibly fat?

Do you know what the serial number is?

[michaellu]

Originally Posted by sdimi

I'm no expert but the dial looks strange to me.
ft first means it should be a Mark IV, V, or VI.
It has closed 6's so that makes it a Mark VI but the f in ft does not line up with the m in submariner correctly.
Then looking at the alignment/spacing of ROLEX with the coronet and ROLEX with OYSTER PERPETUAL DATE there seems to be a problem.
The long 12 hour plot looks strange also.
The crown guards are incredibly fat?

Do you know what the serial number is?

Thanks for the reply!

Must have been altered before. Crown isn’t rotating as well. Appraiser said something was changed and improperly returned. I guess a visit to the RSC or a vintage watch store’ll do the job. I don’t know the serial number since I didn’t remove the bands myself. Will keep you posted.

[benzng]

Originally Posted by sdimi

I'm no expert but the dial looks strange to me.
ft first means it should be a Mark IV, V, or VI.
It has closed 6's so that makes it a Mark VI but the f in ft does not line up with the m in submariner correctly.
Then looking at the alignment/spacing of ROLEX with the coronet and ROLEX with OYSTER PERPETUAL DATE there seems to be a problem.
The long 12 hour plot looks strange also.
The crown guards are incredibly fat?

Do you know what the serial number is?

Good observations
This is a Mark 6
https://momentum-dubai.com/products/...h-box-papers-1

[J!m]

That crown is all I need to see on this. Does it even have a coronet on it? And what's with the protruding o-ring??

The more I look, the more I don't like about it.

I'm a fan of (and on the lookout for) a Mk VI dial for my watch and the color of that red ink on the dial is not very vibrant. The late red dials tended to be quite vibrant (one of the reasons I'm looking). The color looks more like an older, early version, which the text is not right for in general.

Best case this is a collection of parts; worst case it is a forgery.

[Chunky]

Originally Posted by J!m

That crown is all I need to see on this. Does it even have a coronet on it? And what's with the protruding o-ring??

The more I look, the more I don't like about it.

I'm a fan of (and on the lookout for) a Mk VI dial for my watch and the color of that red ink on the dial is not very vibrant. The late red dials tended to be quite vibrant (one of the reasons I'm looking). The color looks more like an older, early version, which the text is not right for in general.

Best case this is a collection of parts; worst case it is a forgery.

I agree with your post

[btinl]

Sorry everything looks fake

[Cheutc]

glossy tritium lume plots? and also the writing looks grey instead of white, also the rolex crown looks wrong

[SubKing]

that watch is a fake for sure. nothing is correct. fake date indicator which means the movement is most likely fake. fake insert, fake hands fake dial, fake case as the crown guards are wrong, fake crown..

[michaellu]

Originally Posted by J!m

That crown is all I need to see on this. Does it even have a coronet on it? And what's with the protruding o-ring??

The more I look, the more I don't like about it.

I'm a fan of (and on the lookout for) a Mk VI dial for my watch and the color of that red ink on the dial is not very vibrant. The late red dials tended to be quite vibrant (one of the reasons I'm looking). The color looks more like an older, early version, which the text is not right for in general.

Best case this is a collection of parts; worst case it is a forgery.

Thank you for your reply.

If it is a collection of parts, it could also be the poor choice of replacement parts (some may be fake.

I really do hope that this is a collection of parts. If it is, what can I do about it? Could I have the broken parts be replaced at the RSC? Or would they say no to this as some of the parts may seem like counterfeits.

By the way, this was just given to me by someone who got it from a warehouse clearer a long time ago. So I have no idea about the history of this watch.



Btw. Thanks everyone for your wisdom. Much appreciated!

[michaellu]

Thanks everyone for your replies!

[springer]

No need to go elsewhere. It is definitely a "lemon." Take it back.

[twnturbo]

The bezel though is a kissing 40 is that fake ,i've never heard of a fake kissing 40 ,the glossy lume plots are the giveaway for me .

[btinl]

Originally Posted by twnturbo

The bezel though is a kissing 40 is that fake ,i've never heard of a fake kissing 40 ,the glossy lume plots are the giveaway for me .

The four is not correct. I believe the kissing 40 inserts are mk1 or mk3.

[Xantiagib]

sorry but it all screams fake to me....

[Swearengen]

I started running when I saw the winding crown

[SubKing]

Originally Posted by twnturbo

The bezel though is a kissing 40 is that fake ,i've never heard of a fake kissing 40 ,the glossy lume plots are the giveaway for me .

I’ll put it to you this way, I have seen much better fakes than this one

[Kingface66]

"The appraiser said that it was authentic"

This appraiser should be ashamed of himself.

[R!$]

the lugs also seem weird
Sad to see this on such a cool watch

[civic4982]

Almost every part of this watch appears to be put together from a collection of aftermarket parts.

The crown alone is enough to run. Followed by the quite awkward appearing hands and date wheel.

I’d be surprised if an actual Rolex movement was even under the hood here.

Sorry you ran into this watch. Hope there’s no issues taking it back.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[116710er]

That's just terrible all around. The appraiser should find a different line of work.

[TheDude]

Originally Posted by benzng

Good observations

This is a Mark 6

https://momentum-dubai.com/products/...h-box-papers-1

Those dial views are distorted because of the crystal on that one.

Here’s mine with a relatively recent (~10yrs) service crystal.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[subx]

sometimes I wonder out loud if those threads with newby posters asking to see if their watch is real, ... are not fishing expeditions to see if they have finally come up with a fool proof fake watch design....

absolutely nothing against OP, it's just that 1 of 4 new threads are pretty much the same scenario.

anyway, yes, this is a fake watch...

[subx]

anyway, sorry about rant, carry on...

[Johnnie K]

Too many items stand out as fakes. The crown screams fake, it has a hole in the middle where the Rolex crown should be. Doubt if Rolex ever had a crown like that. As pointed out, the crown gasket is showing when the crown is screwed in. The crown protective lugs don't look anything like they should. It certainly screams fake. I doubt an RSC would do any repairs with this watch even if it is a Rolex. Too bad.

[Kingface66]

Can we put a nail in this thread? It's fake.

[1665fan]

Flat 4 kissing insert....it’s worth millions!!!! Millions of dog turds lol