Let’s discuss the new Daytona 4131 movement changes.

[saxo3]

Nobody can know what these new calibers (4131, 7140, 9002) will deliver with the Chronergy escapement.

We have to wait .... but don't forget the 32xx all have the Chronergy escapement since 2015.

There was no obvious need to move from 4130 to 4131, imo.

[envuks]

Originally Posted by tifosi

I am very certain that both movements will function exactly the same with or without a solid gold rotor. I wouldn't call it a "lesser" movement for not having a gold rotor. If you want the "best movement", pony up and get the Platinum Daytona. Problem solved.

I do agree that the function will be the same, but it’s silly (at best) to have any difference in the same movement when it’s in a different watch. Especially when it’s the same movement reference number.

I’m going to respectfully disagree with it not being a “lesser movement” without the gold rotor. If I have to pony up to a PT Daytona to get the best, naturally I’m not getting the best when I buy a $40k non-PT PM version.

Like I said, silly at best. A marketing gimmick is what actually comes to mind. For the prices of all these watches, we should always get the gold rotor. Just show it on the PT version to make it feel special.

My $.02 which is probably worth just that :-)


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[tifosi]

Originally Posted by envuks

I do agree that the function will be the same, but it’s silly (at best) to have any difference in the same movement when it’s in a different watch. Especially when it’s the same movement reference number.

I’m going to respectfully disagree with it not being a “lesser movement” without the gold rotor. If I have to pony up to a PT Daytona to get the best, naturally I’m not getting the best when I buy a $40k non-PT PM version.

Like I said, silly at best. A marketing gimmick is what actually comes to mind. For the prices of all these watches, we should always get the gold rotor. Just show it on the PT version to make it feel special.

My $.02 which is probably worth just that :-)


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I really do see what you are saying in the scheme of things. I just personally don't see what difference having a gold rotor makes, I guess. But that's fine. That's just me. If I don't pay for something to have something that something more expensive has, I don't expect to get it.

[Solo118]

Originally Posted by tifosi

I really do see what you are saying in the scheme of things. I just personally don't see what difference having a gold rotor makes, I guess. But that's fine. That's just me. If I don't pay for something to have something that something more expensive has, I don't expect to get it.

The only difference in my eyes, is that they are exhibiting the movement, they better show why you paid all that money for Platinum.

It has no mechanical advantage or disadvantage, it is all about looking nice.

[Omarion07]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Nobody can know what these new calibers (4131, 7140, 9002) will deliver with the Chronergy escapement.

We have to wait .... but don't forget the 32xx all have the Chronergy escapement since 2015.

There was no obvious need to move from 4130 to 4131, imo.

Chronergy escapement was Rolex's answer to Omega's Co-axial. It's meant to be more efficient and provides longer service intervals compared to the traditional Swiss lever. You've seen (with data) how precise they can be, even compared to 31xx and Omega's calibres, until they catch "the virus" that is. Rolex didn't foresee this happening unfortunately. But they seem to have enough faith in Chronergy escapement that they updated all their movements to it (except cals 4161and 22xx).

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[Omarion07]

Originally Posted by Solo118

The only difference in my eyes, is that they are exhibiting the movement, they better show why you paid all that money for Platinum.



It has no mechanical advantage or disadvantage, it is all about looking nice.

Based on what I've gathered online, Cal 4131 has fewer parts, is easier to service, and provides longer service intervals. It might even have to do with Omega updating their moonwatch to Co-axial escapement two years ago. Rolex doesn't want their flagship unicorn to not have "the latest tech" aka Chronergy.

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[Solo118]

Originally Posted by Omarion07

Based on what I've gathered online, Cal 4131 has fewer parts, is easier to service, and provides longer service intervals. It might even has to do with Omega updating their moonwatch to Co-axial escapement two years ago. Rolex doesn't want their flagship unicorn to not have "the latest tech" aka Chronergy.

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I was just speaking about the 4131 between the platinum and every other model. The platinum is the only one with the gold rotor, otherwise no other modifications to the movement.

I have always been happy with the 4130, and the 4131 looks even better on paper. Should be a treat for those that get this newer Daytona.

[Keepchasing]

IMO if it ain’t broke , don’t fix it.

4130 most accurate movement I’ve had.

+1 every couple months.

[ecdc]

Originally Posted by Solo118

The only difference in my eyes, is that they are exhibiting the movement, they better show why you paid all that money for Platinum.

It has no mechanical advantage or disadvantage, it is all about looking nice.

Was the caseback platinum, too, in the former Platona? if so, I'd rather have the platinum caseback that a piece of sapphire showing a gold rotor.

[envuks]

Originally Posted by tifosi

I really do see what you are saying in the scheme of things. I just personally don't see what difference having a gold rotor makes, I guess. But that's fine. That's just me. If I don't pay for something to have something that something more expensive has, I don't expect to get it.

Understood. I guess the angle that I’m coming from is that top brands (AP, PP, VC, etc) cover up gorgeous movements all the time behind solid casebacks. They don’t make a more visually appealing movement when it’s visible and a less appealing version when it isn’t seen.

The horology side of my brain feels so triggered by this.

Put the same movement in all the watches and decide which models will show it and which will hide it. It’s watchmaking and something to take pride in.

The concept of making the movement look nicer when you see it than when you don’t just doesn’t sit well with me. As a concept that feels lower-end to me.

Again, this is probably just my own quirks


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[enjoythemusic]

Well, one thing is curious. Since platinum metal is heavier than gold by volume, why not use a platinum rotor?

[Omarion07]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Well, one thing is curious. Since platinum metal is heavier than gold by volume, why not use a platinum rotor?

Maybe it affects the chronometric performance? or a cost cutting measure?

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[Gab27]

A decision to modify the highly-successful and outstanding 4130 does seem to present pretty significant risk. I am very curious about the logic behind this decision. I presume one part of it would likely be reduced manufacturing costs/complexity (which could potentially have a lot of benefit if planning to manufacture it at the new locations), and potentially also an attempt to align movement offerings?

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Well, one thing is curious. Since platinum metal is heavier than gold by volume, why not use a platinum rotor?

There's a sweet spot for optimal weight for a rotor, if it's too heavy it will not work as well and strain the posts on the bridge to which it is attached.

It will probably be a while before I can get my hands on one, but I'm curious to see the weight compared to the non gold 4131 and the regular 4130 rotor.

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by ecdc

Was the caseback platinum, too, in the former Platona? if so, I'd rather have the platinum caseback that a piece of sapphire showing a gold rotor.

Yes, it's solid platinum.

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Nobody can know what these new calibers (4131, 7140, 9002) will deliver with the Chronergy escapement.

We have to wait .... but don't forget the 32xx all have the Chronergy escapement since 2015.

There was no obvious need to move from 4130 to 4131, imo.

A few of points that have come to mind regarding the change of escapement
Firstly, Rolex have staked a critical aspect or two of their reputation on the Chronergy.
Secondly, a universal adoption of the Chronergy for their movements increases their production capability because they don't have two totally separate lines of escapements to produce. An escapement and its associated Balance spring is a highly technical thing to produce because it's the heart of the movement and difficult to get right.
Thirdly, it's possible Rolex believes it to have the potential to extend service intervals and bring it more into line with their 10 year service interval declaration(with conditions attached of course).

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by envuks

So I spend $40k on a PM Daytona and I get the lesser version of the 4131 for my $40k…. That’s not exactly a feel good moment for a discerning buyer and here rolex is saving ~$100 in gold costs. This is silly. All the rotors should be 18k.

I sincerely hope you don't equate a gold rotor as a defining feature of a superior movement

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by SearChart

There's a sweet spot for optimal weight for a rotor, if it's too heavy it will not work as well and strain the posts on the bridge to which it is attached.

Approximate densities in g/cm^3:
Stainless Steel 904L: 7.95
Platinum: 21.45
Gold: 19.3

If one needs to build a new rotor with the same weight you can adapt the rotor thickness, diameter, hole sizes, alloy composition...

It looks 'simple' between Platinum and Gold.

[Omarion07]

Originally Posted by saxo3

Approximate densities in g/cm^3:
Stainless Steel 904L: 7.95
Platinum: 21.45
Gold: 19.3

If one needs to build a new rotor with the same weight you can adapt the rotor thickness, diameter, hole sizes, alloy composition...

It looks 'simple' between Platinum and Gold.

Rotor in the other "non platinum" versions is made of tungsten.

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[Seo]

If the new escapement is more efficient shouldn’t something have improved like the pr or something?

[thenewrick]

The 4131 is a nice upgrade but I'm a hard pass on Daytona until they go high beat rate. I know nobody else cares but me. But the 1/10th of a second chronograph is what I'm waiting for. Maybe in another 7 years!

Seiko just came out with their first 1/10th second chronograph this year and it looks pretty sweet. Zenith of course has theirs.

https://grandseikoboutique.us/produc...agraph-slgc001

One day.. one day..

[OverGeared]

Originally Posted by thenewrick

The 4131 is a nice upgrade but I'm a hard pass on Daytona until they go high beat rate. I know nobody else cares but me. But the 1/10th of a second chronograph is what I'm waiting for. Maybe in another 7 years!

Seiko just came out with their first 1/10th second chronograph this year and it looks pretty sweet. Zenith of course has theirs.

One day.. one day..

I love Grand Seiko, and that watch is gorgeous, but if you gave Rolex another 4mm of width and 3.5mm of thickness to work with, I bet they could get the 4131 up to hi-beat and it'd probably be able to walk your dog for you. Keeping case dimensions down to "I could wear this under a suit" definitely takes priority for them over beat rate for them.

But like you say, maybe one day...

[faimag]

I would rather like to see a platinum rotor in the platona, though that might be a bit too heavy. But it would be interesting - at least aesthetically - to match the rotor to the case metal if they had implemented the exhibition caseback on all models.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Omarion07

Rotor in the other "non platinum" versions is made of tungsten.

Originally Posted by faimag

I would rather like to see a platinum rotor in the platona, though that might be a bit too heavy.

No problem to choose between platinum, gold, and tungsten because they have (very) similar densities.

Approximate densities in g/cm^3:
Stainless Steel 904L: 7.95
Platinum: 21.45
Gold: 19.3
Tungsten: 19.25

If one needs to build a new rotor with the same weight you can adapt the rotor thickness, diameter, hole sizes, alloy composition...

It looks 'simple' between Platinum, Gold, and Tungsten.

[Edgeworth]

Reading through some old threads on this forum this morning (darn this insomnia, haha). In this thread from earlier this year, after the release of the “new” Daytona, the biggest gripe about the upgraded 4131 movement appears to be that only the ice blue platinum model with the see-through case back has the 18k gold rotor and the 4131 in all other Daytona models has a tungsten rotor.

I was surprised that there were no complaints about the faux chatons in the 4131. There was a recent thread discussing the faux chatons in the 7140 movement of the new 1908 models, and most posters seemed to dislike that decorating choice by Rolex.

My guess is that at the time of this thread, most posters didn’t notice the new chatons, let alone realize that they are faux chatons.

I’m kind of ambivalent on it but don’t mind the faux chatons as much as some posters seemed to in the 7140 thread,

[Seo]

Originally Posted by Edgeworth

Reading through some old threads on this forum this morning (darn this insomnia, haha). In this thread from earlier this year, after the release of the “new” Daytona, the biggest gripe about the upgraded 4131 movement appears to be that only the ice blue platinum model with the see-through case back has the 18k gold rotor and the 4131 in all other Daytona models has a tungsten rotor.

I was surprised that there were no complaints about the faux chatons in the 4131. There was a recent thread discussing the faux chatons in the 7140 movement of the new 1908 models, and most posters seemed to dislike that decorating choice by Rolex.

My guess is that at the time of this thread, most posters didn’t notice the new chatons, let alone realize that they are faux chatons.

I’m kind of ambivalent on it but don’t mind the faux chatons as much as some posters seemed to in the 7140 thread,

As a new owner of a 4131 movement I can confirm I am part of the group of people who couldn’t care less about chatons. My Patek sure, Rolex, not so much.

My early impression of the 4131 is not overly positive. I have a manual winding issue and though the watch is running well it’s not as consistent as my other 4130 movements. My 4130 consistently do their timing on a daily basis, this one fluctuates between -0.5 to +2 for the same wearing pattern. I’ve only had the watch for a month and I intend for it to be my main daily for 2024 so let’s see how it goes.

[Edgeworth]

Originally Posted by Seo

As a new owner of a 4131 movement I can confirm I am part of the group of people who couldn’t care less about chatons. My Patek sure, Rolex, not so much.

My early impression of the 4131 is not overly positive. I have a manual winding issue and though the watch is running well it’s not as consistent as my other 4130 movements. My 4130 consistently do their timing on a daily basis, this one fluctuates between -0.5 to +2 for the same wearing pattern. I’ve only had the watch for a month and I intend for it to be my main daily for 2024 so let’s see how it goes.

Congrats on your new Daytona. Sounds like a nice daily for 2024!