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23 April 2019, 03:55 PM | #1 |
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Crown & Caliber Selling Rolex's with Aftermarket Parts
Hey guys,
has anyone noticed that this company site sells watches with fake aftermarket parts? like a fake custom rolex diamond bezel, or a fake aftermarket diamond dial? i thought it was illegal to do so. https://www.crownandcaliber.com/coll...-20-rol-s9y7m6 https://www.crownandcaliber.com/prod...-20-rol-d8rq9n https://www.crownandcaliber.com/prod...-10-rol-x14g70 i thought Rolex shut these places down. or maybe its not illegal anymore. |
23 April 2019, 03:57 PM | #2 |
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The 3 you linked to are VERY UGLY watches. I would think Rolex would shut them down on purely bad taste reasons
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23 April 2019, 04:00 PM | #3 |
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This company is paying for tons of FB ads I started noticing them nonstop this week
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23 April 2019, 04:19 PM | #4 | |
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You don't even need to visit their site, if you have a trend of googling Rolex sellers, they can also target you through that as well. |
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23 April 2019, 04:21 PM | #5 |
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I think they could be saved through the fact they are resellers and do not fit the aftermarket pieces themselves. I've purchased from C&C and have mostly good things to say about them regarding my purchase. They are extremely clear about any aftermarket additions however if you check the descriptions.
As for the legality issue... I have read that Rolex deems any aftermarket parts to be counterfeit thus voiding the warranty and making it illegal to sell. The real question is weather they will actually take action against C&C for selling modified Rolex. Another thing to note is how a lot of people do choose the aftermarket route on vintage watches as the parts are not readily available. |
23 April 2019, 11:22 PM | #6 |
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I’m not sure it makes it counterfeit especially if it’s advertised as having aftermarket parts. Rolex can decline to service but they can’t make it illegal to sell. That’s like Ford making it illegal to sell one of their cars if you change the wheels. You can still find the Bamford and such for sale everywhere.
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24 April 2019, 01:13 AM | #7 |
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There is no law against a custom bezel with diamonds.
There is no law against adding diamonds to a genuine Rolex dial (or any brand for that matter). But if you fabricate items and expropriate an owner’s trademarks and intellectual property, then you have committed a crime. As for the items posted, C&C apparently is simply a reseller. As long as they cite custom or aftermarket parts I don’t see the problem. Now if you try to have Rolex work on a watch with aftermarket parts, you will get declined until they can make it authentic at your expense. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
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24 April 2019, 01:17 AM | #8 |
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One of their ads popped up on my Facebook a few months ago and I clicked on their link. I made a comment on the ad about how all of the watches were gaudy and hideous and none of them left the Rolex factory looking like they do now. They responded with a long diatribe about how some people prefer watches that have been embellished after manufacture and how it's a much more affordable way to buy watches. To each his own I guess. As long as they're not putting Rolex logos on anything that's not made by Rolex and they're only modifying existing pieces, I don't think it's breaking the law but am not smart enough to know. (shrug)
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24 April 2019, 01:46 AM | #9 |
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If they state the diamond bezels are aftermarket, and that the dials have had diamonds added, they aren't doing anything deceptive at all. They aren't "fake"
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24 April 2019, 02:00 AM | #10 |
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Wow. Looks like Rolex deems them to be "counterfeit" as per the statement at the bottom of every Rolex invoice receipt. it states;
“The addition of non-genuine parts to any Rolex watch renders it counterfeit as defined by Federal Law. It is therefore unlawful to sell or offer such modified watch for sale. Rolex will not service watches altered with non-genuine parts or accessories. " see https://www.rolexforums.com/archive/.../t-173168.html |
24 April 2019, 02:23 AM | #11 |
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There are probably as many Rolex watches for sale with aftermarket parts than there are otherwise..
Aftermarket and "fake" are not the same thing, regardless of what purists say.
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24 April 2019, 02:46 AM | #12 |
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What do you say about the many having their Rolex customized and "iced out" with diamonds and gemstones? The reality is that Rolex does not provide these from the factory, and those who desire to customize their watches with precious stones and diamonds can surely do so. That does NOT make it fake.
There is a shop in Beverly Hills that has been making custom jewelry. Here is an "iced out" Sky-Dweller: https://www.instagram.com/p/BmxaiGYn..._web_copy_link This doesn't mean the watch is fake. It just means the watch has been modified.
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24 April 2019, 03:06 AM | #13 |
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I wonder what federal law would prevent you from modifying something and then selling it, provided that your modification didn't present itself as being OEM?
Somebody mentioned cars and tires here previously. That's a good example. Another example would be cars and audio systems. If you change the audio system in your car for another audio system and then sell the car, I don't think you've broken any laws..... I don't see how adding something to or swapping something could violate a federal law. |
24 April 2019, 03:31 AM | #14 | |
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There are many aftermarket parts suppliers that provide repair products to shops that do not have Rolex accounts.
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24 April 2019, 04:15 AM | #15 | |
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“The addition of non-genuine parts to any Rolex watch renders it counterfeit as defined by Federal Law. It is therefore unlawful to sell or offer such modified watch for sale." Technically, I would think that anything that is added would be "non-genuine," so, even a generic leather strap not stamped Rolex wouldn't be "genuine." Either Rolex is really reaching here or they're just stating their position poorly IMO. |
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24 April 2019, 04:28 AM | #16 |
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So adding a NATO makes a Rolex counterfeit by that definition. Not sure that would hold much water in court
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24 April 2019, 05:46 AM | #17 | |
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24 April 2019, 10:03 AM | #18 | |
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Member of NAWCC since 1990. INSTAGRAM USER NAME: SPRINGERJFP Visit my Instagram page to view some of the finest vintage GMTs anywhere - as well as other vintage classics. |
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24 April 2019, 11:54 AM | #19 |
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Good to know. Thanks!
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24 April 2019, 12:02 PM | #20 | |
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Calling a counterfeit dial "aftermarket" doesn't make it any less counterfeit. |
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25 April 2019, 04:19 AM | #21 | |
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If the brand name or logo has been added by someone other than the trademark owner, then yes it’s not allowed.
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26 April 2019, 01:03 AM | #22 |
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Hey all! Crown & Caliber employee here—just want to clarify a few things. Those watches were sold quite some time ago. In the watch details, it states that the additions to the watch are aftermarket. We verify the authenticity of the stones and confirm if they are aftermarket or from the manufacturer. We have full-time watchmakers on staff with more than 20 years of experience in authenticating and servicing luxury watches who verify the authenticity of every watch we receive.
You can always check our watch details on our listings or be in touch with our Client Services team should you have questions about a watch we have listed. But just to be blunt: we do not accept, nor do we sell fakes of any kind. The growth we've experienced as a company, the partnerships we've secured with established retailers and brands (Jared, Birks, etc.), the press we receive from top publications like Business Insider, Wall Street Journal, Forbes, etc.—none of it would exist if there was even a suspicion of us selling fakes. If you have any further questions, please feel free to ask. |
29 April 2019, 01:06 PM | #23 |
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Seems confusing but there are plenty of lawsuits out there that explain why its considered counterfeit when you sell a Rolex that has a custom part or is altered or modified with non-genuine parts. For example, in the lawsuit against Melrose Jewelers, Rolex sued them for Trademark infringement and won an $8.5 million judgment and shut them down.
Read it here. https://law.justia.com/cases/federal...00/538474/105/ extract: "Melrose offers for sale and sells, among other items, altered Rolex watches that bear one or more of the Rolex Registered Trademarks. Melrose s altered Rolex watches contain one or more non-genuine components (i.e. components not manufactured by Rolex, including, for example, non-genuine bezels, bracelets, and/or dials.. Melrose s altered Rolex watches have non-genuine bracelets that bear counterfeit copies of Rolex s CROWN DESIGN ( and/or ROLEX marks." A Rolex with a non-genuine or altered part is considered ( the watch ) counterfeit - it is a fake. Even if its been disclosed. |
29 April 2019, 08:13 PM | #24 | |
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29 April 2019, 10:11 PM | #25 | |
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“Melrose’s altered Rolex watches have non-genuine bracelets that bear counterfeit copies of Rolex’s CROWN DESIGN ( ) and/or ROLEX marks. 12. Melrose’s altered Rolex watches include refinished dials (some with diamonds added) from which one or more of Rolex’s Registered Trademarks have been removed and reapplied. 13. Melrose’s altered Rolex watches include non-genuine bezels (some with diamonds added). The bezel of the watch is designed to create a sealed pressure-proof environment for the watch movement. If the bezel is not of the precise measurement and does not fit properly, outside elements such as water, moisture, and dust can penetrate the watch case and damage the movement. Rolex examined altered Rolex watches purchased from Melrose and determined that the non-genuine bezels on the watches had insufficient fittings and did not protect against the penetration of moisture into the watch movement. 14. Melrose’s unauthorized use of marks identical to or substantially indistinguishable from one or more of the Rolex Registered Trademarks on altered Rolex watches and in connection with the marketing and sale of altered Rolex watches is likely to cause confusion, mistake, or deception among consumers and the public. Such unauthorized use is likely to cause consumers and the public to mistakenly believe that Melrose’s altered Rolex watches are genuine Rolex watches or are authorized, sponsored, or approved by Rolex, when, in fact, they are not.” The distinction here was that buyers thought they were buying a Rolex product when in fact they were not. If I paint my explorer with red hobby paint there is no law that forbids me from doing that with my own property. Rolex may decline to service it and if I resell it as a factory original I would have committed the same violation as Melrose. Otherwise I can sell it as a personally hobby painted watch and they would never have a case |
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12 May 2019, 08:01 AM | #26 | |
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1.) Platforms (Facebook, Google, .etc) aren't the one's retargeting, it's the individual advertisers, i.e. Zappos, Amazon. 2.) In order to remarket to a user you have 2 options. - a.) The user has visited some portion of a page you control with a corresponding platform pixel. This means it can be a landing page or your own website and if you're using Google then it must have a google remarketing pixel. Same with Facebook, the page must have a remarketing pixel to use it. In this instance the pixel fires a cookie and it stays on your computer for a very long time. You can clear your cookies, though. -b.) You can target people through their email address. Sadly, this is true. If I have your email address I can create a custom audience on Facebook and retarget you. On Google I would be able to retarget your when you search only, but it can be for unrelated terms. In this instance you either signed up for something or your email was found and added to a list. The last example being extremely unprofessional. -- How Advertisers Use Remarketing If I was to run an ecommerce website selling watches, as long as I had a pixel on every page, I could set up a campaign on Google to show you the exact product you were just looking at...on every website you visit with Google Ads installed. On Facebook it's only on the FB platform (FB/IG), but on Google it extends to millions of websites. It's a very powerful tool for getting buyers back in the sales funnel, and you have so many different ways to filter a person. 1.) Time on site: Are they serious? Show them ads! 2.) Abandoned Cart: Let's show them a discount and get them back! 3.) Purchase: I need them to make another purchase! -- Without getting too in-depth you can see why advertisers use remarketing and how it's associated to you specifically. On both Facebook and Google ads you only have to report the ad to never see it again. Click the report link on FB or the X on Google Ads and explain why you don't like it. This kind of feedback works incredibly quickly, not only for you but for everyone. So don't think reporting ads doesn't matter because it does. If only 5 people reported an ad it could easily get shut down, sometimes even less. If multiple ads from the same advertisers continually get shut down due to user reporting/SPAM the advertiser can lose their account within days of the 2nd or 3rd infraction. Hope it helps. |
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29 May 2019, 02:54 AM | #27 |
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I bought a Turnograph from Crown and Caliber, they were unaware it had a white gold bezel. It appeared to me to have an after market bracelet, and not a very good one. It had a plastic security seal that if removed caused a high restocking fee. I returned it .
Like everything , caveat emptor. |
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