The Rolex Forums   The Rolex Watch

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX


Go Back   Rolex Forums - Rolex Watch Forum > Other (non-Rolex) Watch Topics > Watches (Non-Rolex) Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 9 March 2018, 03:43 PM   #1
Vaxe
"TRF" Member
 
Vaxe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Austin TX
Posts: 2,122
A Lange & Sohne - price increase 4/1/2018

Was just informed by two ADs that ALS will be changing prices effective 4/1/18. I chuckled and asked if it's actually a price decrease, as $37K for a base Lange 1 in WG is already a hard mover in today's market.
Vaxe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9 March 2018, 04:01 PM   #2
GB-man
2024 Pledge Member
 
GB-man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: USA
Watch: addiction issues
Posts: 36,815
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaxe View Post
Was just informed by two ADs that ALS will be changing prices effective 4/1/18. I chuckled and asked if it's actually a price decrease, as $37K for a base Lange 1 in WG is already a hard mover in today's market.
They must be high. Love Lange but if you like a watch no worries, come back six months later and it will be there in the case.

Want a L1MP WG black badly.
__________________
GB-man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9 March 2018, 08:39 PM   #3
HL65
TRF Moderator & 2024 Patron
 
HL65's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Real Name: Ken
Location: SW Florida
Watch: One on my wrist.
Posts: 63,322
Quote:
Originally Posted by GB-man View Post
They must be high. Love Lange but if you like a watch no worries, come back six months later and it will be there in the case.

Want a L1MP WG black badly.
Exactly...Except come back 12 months later and still in the case.
__________________

SPEM SUCCESSUS ALIT
HL65 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10 March 2018, 08:44 AM   #4
AK797
2024 Pledge Member
 
AK797's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Real Name: Neil
Location: UK
Watch: ing ships roll in
Posts: 59,065
Was only offered 10% off a near £100K ZW Striking time so not surprised they want a price rise.
AK797 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10 March 2018, 12:25 PM   #5
Jay (Eire)
2024 Pledge Member
 
Jay (Eire)'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Real Name: @jb.watching
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,465
I really don't understand this.

I would be very curious to know what percentage of annual sales for ALS are without discount. Even the f'n Boutiques discount.
Jay (Eire) is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10 March 2018, 01:29 PM   #6
Marciano490
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Boston
Posts: 1,431
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay (Eire) View Post
I really don't understand this.

I would be very curious to know what percentage of annual sales for ALS are without discount. Even the f'n Boutiques discount.
Yeah. They basically tell you that when you walk in the door.
Marciano490 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10 March 2018, 02:44 PM   #7
tyler1980
"TRF" Member
 
tyler1980's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Houston
Posts: 17,622
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay (Eire) View Post
I really don't understand this.

I would be very curious to know what percentage of annual sales for ALS are without discount. Even the f'n Boutiques discount.
its ridiculous and is the only reason i dont own an ALS. If they held prices and reduced dealer margins to discourage discounts that would make more sense. I can't justify a purchase where the wild card in it being an ok value is finding the best discount.

Its not necessarily the price that is the discouraging factor as objectively they are probably worth it, its discounting. Whenever one is expected and the norm, someone can always get a better one than you and feeling like you overpaid vs someone else isnt a good feeling to have with a purchase experience.
tyler1980 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11 March 2018, 12:22 AM   #8
Jay (Eire)
2024 Pledge Member
 
Jay (Eire)'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Real Name: @jb.watching
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,465
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyler1980 View Post
its ridiculous and is the only reason i dont own an ALS. If they held prices and reduced dealer margins to discourage discounts that would make more sense. I can't justify a purchase where the wild card in it being an ok value is finding the best discount.

Its not necessarily the price that is the discouraging factor as objectively they are probably worth it, its discounting. Whenever one is expected and the norm, someone can always get a better one than you and feeling like you overpaid vs someone else isnt a good feeling to have with a purchase experience.
I agree with you. It does however seem that Corporate are oblivious to this. I've spoken with some senior people at ALS in North America and honestly they don't seem to acknowledge the problem. I've been told the same by others that have participated in focus groups organized by ALS where the participants were all significant ALS collectors invited by ALS. If they won't listen to those friends of the brand then there's little hope.

I own one ALS, which of course I bought used at a discount of ~50% from retail (buying new would have been ~25-30% discount), and appreciate the watches very much. I would like to add another but unless I find something that I think is a steal (in order to do my best to protect the downside if I need to move it on) I'll continue to allocate my watch dollars elsewhere.
Jay (Eire) is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11 March 2018, 09:00 AM   #9
barihunk
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: NC
Posts: 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by HL65 View Post
Exactly...Except come back 12 months later and still in the case.
Yup. Was casually browsing at an AD and they basically implied they moved <1 Lange 1 (of any variant) each year, while attempting to FOMO me into getting the one they had on display at a 5% discount. It wasn't even in the color I wanted.
barihunk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11 March 2018, 10:20 AM   #10
texasmade
"TRF" Member
 
texasmade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Real Name: Robert
Location: Lone Star State
Watch: AP RO 15400, FOIS
Posts: 2,326
Quote:
Originally Posted by barihunk View Post
Yup. Was casually browsing at an AD and they basically implied they moved <1 Lange 1 (of any variant) each year, while attempting to FOMO me into getting the one they had on display at a 5% discount. It wasn't even in the color I wanted.
Which ALS watches actually move then? The 1815 Chrono, maybe the regular 1815 (and the Up Down), anything else?
texasmade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11 March 2018, 10:28 AM   #11
Justindo
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: California
Posts: 2,176
I'm curious about the price increase as well, as they don't exactly fly out of the cases, which is a shame because they make superb watches at very fair prices. Even at list price, they are a bargain compared to Patek when you consider the quality but they are an even better deal with a discount or used.
Justindo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11 March 2018, 11:54 AM   #12
benlee
"TRF" Member
 
benlee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Real Name: Ben
Location: SIN & JKT
Watch: Rolex, AP, PP
Posts: 9,873
I always thought L1 is their bread and butter line. Looks like they are doing quite badly. Have always appreciated Lange watches but can't seem to make the leap to buy them. Perhaps they need better marketing.
__________________
Follow me on Instagram : benlee789
benlee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12 March 2018, 01:02 AM   #13
GB-man
2024 Pledge Member
 
GB-man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: USA
Watch: addiction issues
Posts: 36,815
Quote:
Originally Posted by benlee View Post
I always thought L1 is their bread and butter line. Looks like they are doing quite badly. Have always appreciated Lange watches but can't seem to make the leap to buy them. Perhaps they need better marketing.
Without question imho.
__________________
GB-man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12 March 2018, 01:18 AM   #14
tyler1980
"TRF" Member
 
tyler1980's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Houston
Posts: 17,622
Quote:
Originally Posted by benlee View Post
I always thought L1 is their bread and butter line. Looks like they are doing quite badly. Have always appreciated Lange watches but can't seem to make the leap to buy them. Perhaps they need better marketing.
+2

You shouldn't have to live on the forums like us to have a clue who they are. That is the case though.
tyler1980 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12 March 2018, 01:51 AM   #15
benlee
"TRF" Member
 
benlee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Real Name: Ben
Location: SIN & JKT
Watch: Rolex, AP, PP
Posts: 9,873
Quote:
Originally Posted by GB-man View Post
Without question imho.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyler1980 View Post
+2

You shouldn't have to live on the forums like us to have a clue who they are. That is the case though.
They need to hijack the current AP CEO. He is all about marketing
__________________
Follow me on Instagram : benlee789
benlee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12 March 2018, 02:16 AM   #16
mps354
2024 Pledge Member
 
mps354's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Real Name: Mike
Location: CT
Posts: 8,968
It’s a shame, they make superb watches but are relatively unknown. I guess good for the rest of us when buying one Pre-Owned
mps354 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12 March 2018, 03:07 AM   #17
Le Chef
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Chicago
Posts: 2,005
Marketing is nowhere near as good as the product which is exceptional. Pricing policy is clearly not right as you should not need to discount if you have your model tested thoroughly. Communication is of the "echo chamber" type - social media talking to existing enthusiasts who already know the story. There's a need for deeper storytelling and greater reach to give HNW individuals meaningful "social currency" for Lange, and therefore the confidence to buy.
Le Chef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12 March 2018, 04:59 AM   #18
AK797
2024 Pledge Member
 
AK797's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Real Name: Neil
Location: UK
Watch: ing ships roll in
Posts: 59,065
Quote:
Originally Posted by benlee View Post
They need to hijack the current AP CEO. He is all about marketing


They are like VC they make a great product but either overprice them or don't allow discounts. Price exclusivity is not going to work, manipulating supply works so much better we have seen, but then people do have to know about you first.
AK797 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20 March 2018, 10:17 AM   #19
GreenLantern
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Montana
Posts: 3,222
Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Chef View Post
Marketing is nowhere near as good as the product which is exceptional. Pricing policy is clearly not right as you should not need to discount if you have your model tested thoroughly. Communication is of the "echo chamber" type - social media talking to existing enthusiasts who already know the story. There's a need for deeper storytelling and greater reach to give HNW individuals meaningful "social currency" for Lange, and therefore the confidence to buy.
+1

Marketing is dismal.

Pricing is dismal. Many pieces, while I do believe they are worth every penny, are overpriced relative to the market. This creates steep discounts, and thus scares buyers away due to expected / perceived value loss.

The correct solution is to price above market, but only a bit above market. As opposed to leaving things at $180k when the market is truly $85k, and then forcing people to pay full (original) MSRP at brand-owned Boutiques (like AP is trying to do).

As such, they need to revamp their marketing strategy *and* their business end of things with respect to pricing and distribution.

They also make weird decisions with respect to opening new accounts with ADs, and should pick ADs that will help further develop the brand.

That said, I'd be happy to run the show for them. They need only ask, and pay me enough, of course. ;)
GreenLantern is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20 March 2018, 10:54 AM   #20
PJ S
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 3,990
^
Until you comprehend that we’re less than 2% of the market, were residual value even matters, I think you can forget waiting by the phone for that call.
If AL&S were struggling to sell the 5–6K pieces made each year, with ADs giving them an earful about being stuck with stock or unable to meet status-retention targets, then you’d see a different approach.
As it is, it’s business as usual...
PJ S is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23 March 2018, 02:19 PM   #21
MrBenF
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Real Name: Ben
Location: Sydney
Posts: 114
Just returned from HK where I went close to pulling the trigger on an 1815 chronograph. Interesting none of the *9 ADs have stock nor have even received the piece even though it’s released Jan last year.

The *2 boutiques have stock and I was offered a discount plus range of gifts. Finally walked away due to weak resale. Also viewed the new models released at SIHH. The SA said policy is no discount in the 1st year of release.

As a comparison, the previous WG model (new with open papers) was available at -30% at grey dealers. Some ADs also have stock but didn’t talk prices as I’d settled on the black dial.

As an aside, my local AD has one coming but refused to entertain discounts. Told him situation with boutique but still wouldn’t move. U can guess how the conversation ended: chuckle.

Someone mentions VC. For anyone not having been in HK recently, VCs are everywhere (boutiques, # sales points, window display, signage etc). Not sure re pricing policy since didn’t make any enquires.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
MrBenF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23 March 2018, 02:53 PM   #22
benlee
"TRF" Member
 
benlee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Real Name: Ben
Location: SIN & JKT
Watch: Rolex, AP, PP
Posts: 9,873
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBenF View Post
Just returned from HK where I went close to pulling the trigger on an 1815 chronograph. Interesting none of the *9 ADs have stock nor have even received the piece even though it’s released Jan last year.

The *2 boutiques have stock and I was offered a discount plus range of gifts. Finally walked away due to weak resale. Also viewed the new models released at SIHH. The SA said policy is no discount in the 1st year of release.

As a comparison, the previous WG model (new with open papers) was available at -30% at grey dealers. Some ADs also have stock but didn’t talk prices as I’d settled on the black dial.

As an aside, my local AD has one coming but refused to entertain discounts. Told him situation with boutique but still wouldn’t move. U can guess how the conversation ended: chuckle.

Someone mentions VC. For anyone not having been in HK recently, VCs are everywhere (boutiques, # sales points, window display, signage etc). Not sure re pricing policy since didn’t make any enquires.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Which 1815 chrono? I know of a good Lange AD in HK and can introduce to you if you are interested.
__________________
Follow me on Instagram : benlee789
benlee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23 March 2018, 03:14 PM   #23
MrBenF
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Real Name: Ben
Location: Sydney
Posts: 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by benlee View Post
Which 1815 chrono? I know of a good Lange AD in HK and can introduce to you if you are interested.


It’s the WG with black dial that’s introduced last year. Any intro’s would be good. Pls send me a PM.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
MrBenF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24 March 2018, 02:45 PM   #24
Justindo
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: California
Posts: 2,176
Quote:
Originally Posted by AK797 View Post


They are like VC they make a great product but either overprice them or don't allow discounts. Price exclusivity is not going to work, manipulating supply works so much better we have seen, but then people do have to know about you first.
While I generally agree with you about VC (despite making gorgeous watches, their pricing is too high in most cases, especially for their higher end and platinum models, although they do seem to be getting a bit better with their newer releases) I don't totally agree with you about Lange. Yes, some of their watches are priced a bit high compared to other Langes (e.g., the Lange 1s), but some are priced too low (e.g., the 1815 Chronographs and the Saxonia Moonphase) compared to their brand brethren. All, however, are priced considerably lower than Patek and Lange's quality is superior.
Justindo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1 April 2018, 01:43 PM   #25
Vaxe
"TRF" Member
 
Vaxe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Austin TX
Posts: 2,122
4/1 tomorrow, let’s see if my ADs weren’t blowing smoke
Vaxe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1 April 2018, 05:01 PM   #26
TJMike
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 428
The new US price list is out. There are modest price rises on some, but not all models. I would post a link, but I can't as my post count is too low. The new price list is at PuristSPro. Click the Lange tab and the price list is in the thread "ALS Worldwide Price Increase?"
TJMike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1 April 2018, 09:52 PM   #27
Reloko
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Manila
Posts: 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by TJMike View Post
The new US price list is out. There are modest price rises on some, but not all models. I would post a link, but I can't as my post count is too low. The new price list is at PuristSPro. Click the Lange tab and the price list is in the thread "ALS Worldwide Price Increase?"


Authorized Dealer in the Philippines has increased prices effective April 1.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Reloko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3 April 2018, 02:09 AM   #28
Hogtown Fatty
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: YYZ
Posts: 150
what's resale on the current 1815 chrono (not datograph)? have many used ones been sold? i can't seem to find any data.
Hogtown Fatty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3 April 2018, 03:47 PM   #29
conkers
"TRF" Member
 
conkers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Real Name: Roger
Location: Hong Kong
Watch: Too many!
Posts: 5,984
The one I bought on 30th March went up over USD10k. Ouch!
__________________
IG: @conkers1971
Revolution Video Feature: https://www.revolution.watch/collect...f-conkers1971/
conkers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3 April 2018, 04:01 PM   #30
MrBenF
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Real Name: Ben
Location: Sydney
Posts: 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by conkers View Post
The one I bought on 30th March went up over USD10k. Ouch!
Which model did u get?
MrBenF is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Takuya Watches

Bobs Watches

My Watch LLC

OCWatches

DavidSW Watches

Coronet


*Banners Of The Month*
This space is provided to horological resources.





Copyright ©2004-2024, The Rolex Forums. All Rights Reserved.

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX

Rolex is a registered trademark of ROLEX USA. The Rolex Forums is not affiliated with ROLEX USA in any way.