The Crown speaks on counterfeits...

[002]

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. “Replica and counterfeit”

These are the 30 year old watch equivalents to MTV’s pimp my ride. No way does someone think they are buying a new 100% Rolex watch. I totally agree with the car analogies being used. It is totally reasonable to replace consumable parts with non Rolex parts. Especially when they’re no longer available. Dials and crystals are expected to be replaced. So they chose to “upgrade” during service.

No one at a track day walks up and says “nice car, too bad it’s counterfeit. You know, the tires, pistons, suspension and paint aren’t original”.

This forum is more replica or counterfeit than those watches. Real forums have meaningful, in-depth conversations about the hobby. This is just shallow yuppie nonsense.

I think that Rolex is upset for the same reason that I am. The current brand/image is played out, overly shallow (even for Rolex) and everyone is trying to get their piece of the action. From greys, gready AD’s, fashion mods, you tube “reviews” to franken watch chrono24 specials. Half the threads are technical nonsense about timing, polishing or girl sizes. Multiple Tudor threads locked just because someone wants to talk about the watch they like and someone can’t let it be. The rest are people humble bragging about what to buy next before the latest even arrives at the AD. An “incoming” by a guy that hasn’t even had the watch delivered to the AD. That’s where I draw the line.

Flame away or ban or whatever happens when people don’t enjoy 20 page long threads congratulating someone for getting the same model that everyone else has, and probably decided on it after googling “best Rolex”.

This is easily the lamest forum I’ve ever wasted time on. Of course there are some cool people here, but not enough.
Peace out ✌️ off to enjoy my hobbies in real life.

[uncleluck]

Originally Posted by 002

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. “Replica and counterfeit”

These are the 30 year old watch equivalents to MTV’s pimp my ride. No way does someone think they are buying a new 100% Rolex watch. I totally agree with the car analogies being used. It is totally reasonable to replace consumable parts with non Rolex parts. Especially when they’re no longer available. Dials and crystals are expected to be replaced. So they chose to “upgrade” during service.

No one at a track day walks up and says “nice car, too bad it’s counterfeit. You know, the tires, pistons, suspension and paint aren’t original”.

This forum is more replica or counterfeit than those watches. Real forums have meaningful, in-depth conversations about the hobby. This is just shallow yuppie nonsense.

I think that Rolex is upset for the same reason that I am. The current brand/image is played out, overly shallow (even for Rolex) and everyone is trying to get their piece of the action. From greys, gready AD’s, fashion mods, you tube “reviews” to franken watch chrono24 specials. Half the threads are technical nonsense about timing, polishing or girl sizes. Multiple Tudor threads locked just because someone wants to talk about the watch they like and someone can’t let it be. The rest are people humble bragging about what to buy next before the latest even arrives at the AD. An “incoming” by a guy that hasn’t even had the watch delivered to the AD. That’s where I draw the line.

Flame away or ban or whatever happens when people don’t enjoy 20 page long threads congratulating someone for getting the same model that everyone else has, and probably decided on it after googling “best Rolex”.

This is easily the lamest forum I’ve ever wasted time on. Of course there are some cool people here, but not enough.
Peace out ✌️ off to enjoy my hobbies in real life.

Nope, no flaming from me. I agree!

Must mean the chap who’s cars I look after has a load of fake Ferraris because he’s had them re-painted over the years!

Whilst these modified watches aren’t for me, I actually feel for the company if Rolex wipe them out. Why not use the effort to go after the actual fakers rather than modifiers?


Could be worse Rolex, could be worse...

[Andad]

I think long goodbyes are more ridiculous.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by 2nastie

I don't understand why Rolex would get bent on someone/company changing the colours of their watch. It's customisation, it's up to the general public or consumer to accept it or not. People are buying these for their modification and vividly knows its a customisation.

Actual fake/counterfeit watches on the other hand. Rolex should crack down on these. Aren't there forums, websites, etc. that sells these things? Rolex hasn't done much to get rid of those. Frankly from the videos I've seen the fakes are improving. If Rolex was cracking down on these, it should be harder to source.

I wrote before that the Insta showcase should mean less people buying fakes as they can't show them off there and more saving up to buy the real thing so they can, but then even if they do now they can't find one in ADs, so not much point in Rolex cracking down now, not that they can be effective in stopping anything over the internet, these guys are much more tech savvy.

[mountainjogger]

Originally Posted by directioneng

I think long goodbyes are more ridiculous.

This.

[mountainjogger]

Originally Posted by 002

... this is ridiculous.

This forum is more replica or counterfeit than those watches. Real forums have meaningful, in-depth conversations about the hobby. This is just shallow yuppie nonsense.

This is easily the lamest forum I’ve ever wasted time on. Of course there are some cool people here, but not enough.
Peace out ✌️ off to enjoy my hobbies in real life.

Don't

Let

The

Door

[Speedbird-1]

Originally Posted by directioneng

I think long goodbyes are more ridiculous.

True.

He does make one or two fair points though.

[SMD]

Rolex better hope they win this one.

[JParm]

Originally Posted by GB-man

Seems odd to go after this small outfit when they could target Bamford, AG, TM etc

I still don't understand how those brands get away with it, but this tiny brand can't?

Pretty much everyone in the watch world has heard about Bamford, and if you're a Rolex fan like most here, the same goes for Tempus Machina and Artisans de Geneve.

How are they still operating??

[ecdc]

I know! But Rolex's "definition" that any mod makes the watch a counterfeit doesn't actually square with the law. So I wonder if the counterfeit argument would even be enough to get an injunction, much less survive summary judgment. But who knows, this civil IP enforcement isn't the kind of law I've done and my experience with IP is related to a few instances of defending related federal criminal matters. It should be an interesting case to follow.

Originally Posted by JacksonStone

It would be interesting, but I don't see the argument for laCalifornienne watches as derivative, since Rolex is claiming they are outright counterfeits. Derivative works aren't counterfeits, and the first sale doctrine doesn't entertain counterfeits. So the legal question is, by altering a Rolex watch with aftermarket parts, does that watch cease to be a true Rolex? If so, the argument goes, by selling that watch as a true Rolex, laCalifornienne is using the Rolex mark in order to represent the watch as something it's not; ergo, it's counterfeit. The entire argument hinges on whether a once-genuine watch modified with aftermarket parts ceases to be a genuine version of the branded watch.

But that may all be beside the point. As noted by others, the entire point of the suit may be to bankrupt the company between litigation costs and, in the event of an injunction, the inability to generate revenue. The merits might not even matter, and almost certainly won't matter beyond the district level.

[Blansky]

I don't have a dog in this fight but it will be interesting how it plays out. I'm not sure if the car comparison that people use with watches is completely relevant though, for the simple reason that there are companies that make aftermarket parts for cars that are available from everywhere except the dealership.

In fact some of the companies that make genuine parts also make "jobber" parts and sell them to automotive stores.

I think Rolex keeping its "brand integrity" is different than a car company.

But as far as the "fashion" thing goes:

[037]

The car comparison only works (in my example) if we compare paint to paint. Once aftermarket parts and an aftermarket part industry are introduced, the comparison I made originally no longer applies.

Sadly, many analogies seem to not work with watches, not just cars.

[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by 007timer

Modifying the watch will void warranty

Which warranty? It's a +30 year old watch.

[007timer]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

Which warranty? It's a +30 year old watch.

Strictly referring to a new/newer watch. Obviously a pre-owned watch doesn’t not have any remaining warranty.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by 007timer

Strictly referring to a new/newer watch. Obviously a pre-owned watch doesn’t not have any remaining warranty.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know. That's why the threat of Rolex seems ridiculous.

[007timer]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

I know. That's why the threat of Rolex seems ridiculous.

But if anyone has resources to do it. It’s Rolex. It will be very interesting to see how this plays out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[goin camping]

I am hard pressed to be on the factory side here.

Somebody bought a watch and in the course of time it ended up with this company which modified it and resold it.

No different than a car, house, lawnmower, couch or anything else.

This company is selling a used and modified Rolex. Does Rolex really think they can control what anyone in the world will do with the watches they manufactured until the end of time?

[RJRJRJ]

Originally Posted by jpeezy14@hotmail.com

I still don't understand how those brands get away with it, but this tiny brand can't?

Pretty much everyone in the watch world has heard about Bamford, and if you're a Rolex fan like most here, the same goes for Tempus Machina and Artisans de Geneve.

How are they still operating??

I would guess

1. They think this place is making low quality versions and it may hurt the Rolex brand

and/or

2. They just want to win and set a precedent which they can use to go after more companies in the future.

[sillo]

Originally Posted by RJRJRJ

2. They just want to win and set a precedent which they can use to go after more companies in the future.

This is the one I’m going with. Rolex being Rolex.

[JParm]

Originally Posted by RJRJRJ

I would guess

1. They think this place is making low quality versions and it may hurt the Rolex brand

and/or

2. They just want to win and set a precedent which they can use to go after more companies in the future.

Both good points. With respect to #2 though, wonder if they've done this before though with other "brands" that have tried to customize Rolex?

[037]

Originally Posted by RJRJRJ

2. They just want to win and set a precedent which they can use to go after more companies in the future.

#2 seems more plausible. But, that brings me back to my earlier point:

Originally Posted by 037

A company can only control so much. It's as if Rolex is trying to license its products rather than sell them.

It's as if Rolex believes they "own" a watch outside of the warranty period. They can deny service and deny warranty, but the only thing they can do with modifiers is scaring them out of modifying. So, #2.

[NYC6]

deleted

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by 037

#2 seems more plausible. But, that brings me back to my earlier point:

It's as if Rolex believes they "own" a watch outside of the warranty period. They can deny service and deny warranty, but the only thing they can do with modifiers is scaring them out of modifying. So, #2.

I don't think it has to do with "owning" a sold watch, it has to do with selling and marketing a Rolex that is no longer a copyrighted Rolex.

I think a person can do it but not a company. You can mod your own watch and sell it on ebay all day long but a company buying old Rolexes, modding them and selling them as a Rolex may just be copyright infringement. A company has a right to their intellectual property.

Don't know how they let Bamford get away with it.

Should be interesting. I'm not a fan of people stealing intellectual property rights so I'll cheer for Rolex on this one.

[RJRJRJ]

Originally Posted by 037

#2 seems more plausible. But, that brings me back to my earlier point:

It's as if Rolex believes they "own" a watch outside of the warranty period. They can deny service and deny warranty, but the only thing they can do with modifiers is scaring them out of modifying. So, #2.

I think Rolex is gonna say that they didn't distance themselves enough from Rolex, maybe even implying that they were selling them as genuine Rolex products. Ever see in the classifieds, the disclaimers, something along the lines of: "I am in not way affiliated with Rolex" etc... Well, now we know why lol.

[037]

Originally Posted by Blansky

I don't think it has to do with "owning" a sold watch, it has to do with selling and marketing a Rolex that is no longer a copyrighted Rolex.

I think a person can do it but not a company. You can mod your own watch and sell it on ebay all day long but a company buying old Rolexes, modding them and selling them as a Rolex may just be copyright infringement. A company has a right to their intellectual property.

Don't know how they let Bamford get away with it.

Should be interesting. I'm not a fan of people stealing intellectual property rights so I'll cheer for Rolex on this one.

Perhaps. I still wonder why the owner of a car can modify his or her car and the automobile manufacturers aren't going after anyone for copyright or trademark infringement. There are some rather bizarrely modified vehicles out there that still bear the manufacturer's logos and word marks. Some of them are professionally modified and resold as a business.

The 'counterfeit' part of it is where things get sticky and the modifier's use of specific verbiage. Expectation and service might be another. Perhaps these watches aren't running properly and Rolex is seeing them show up in their service centers by the thousands.

And, yeah, I don't get why Bamford, Blaken, Pro-Hunter, Artisans de Geneve, et al. can get away with it yet a couple from Cali makes the news. The devil must be in the details. Should be interesting, indeed.

Originally Posted by RJRJRJ

I think Rolex is gonna say that they didn't distance themselves enough from Rolex, maybe even implying that they were selling them as genuine Rolex products. Ever see in the classifieds, the disclaimers, something along the lines of: "I am in not way affiliated with Rolex" etc... Well, now we know why lol.

Distance very well might prove to be the key.

[Speedbird-1]

I adore a lot of Rolex watches.
But, on reflection, I don't give a hoot about them or their 'reputation', for they couldn't care less about my frustration at not being able to purchase (at MRSP) the new watch I desire.
Rolex will survive, they always have..........so far.

[MILGAUSS88]

Originally Posted by exador

Interesting. Wonder why Rolex never went after Bamford then?

They did, and Bamford is no longer selling Rolex watches.

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by Bizcut1

Check this out:

https://www.thefashionlaw.com/home/r...erfeit-watches



Ben

Tells me someone’s making money.

[Knappo 1307]

I'm starting to drift further and further from Rolex........

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by Knappo 1307

I'm starting to drift further and further from Rolex........

Superlative Toblerone Tossers.