Goldsmiths UK AD

[shammad10]

Hello all, I am new to the forum, been lurking for s few months before I joined!

I only got into watches around 2019 and have found it to be such a fascinating hobby.
I have been trying to build a ‘relationship’ with a dealer in the UK (Goldsmiths) and have been popping down to the store to chat to the sales assistants every few weeks, and we’ve been getting on really well.
I have my name down for an Explorer II.

Today the sales assistant took me aside and said:
‘I want to be as honest with you as possible. I am not allowed to sell a professional model to you. You have to buy around £10k worth of jewellery/watches from us to be offered a professional model’

What I don’t really understand is that they don’t want people to flip watches- but they are trying to get me to buy a DJ 28/31 which I have no use for and would sell. It makes no sense to spend £10k to buy a watch that retails at £6.8k! It would be cheaper for me to go gray!
How did you first timers get your foot in the door?

[vh2k]

Ignore what the SA said. It’s a test to see if you’ll buy stuff you don’t want. Be patient and you’ll get it.

[365DAS]

Originally Posted by vh2k

Ignore what the SA said. It’s a test to see if you’ll buy stuff you don’t want. Be patient and you’ll get it.

Unfortunately it’s not a test and some people that I know who work in the WoS group stores are being targeted to do this.

It’s a sad affair but very true as it stands. Some of these stores are targeted on other products and are being told to do certain things in order to get a watch that they have.

Now whether this is instructed from higher up (doubt it) but some retail managers will want to achieve target the right way…or wrong way (which this is!)

It happens and is happening as we speak and I personally know firsthand that’s coming from a customer that has a great spend history, yet they think that I’ll go for their bollocks (excuse the language use here but it’s genuinely frustrating and quite frankly…insulting!)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Stoffel]

Every time I hear stories like this about desperados popping in for a chat to “establish a relationship” makes me feel a bit sorry for the sales assistants. They’re having to listen to watchbores all day with little chance of getting a commission out of them. They probably take turns to take it on the chin while the rest go and actually sell watches and jewellery.

[Marcjvr]

Originally Posted by Stoffel

Every time I hear stories like this about desperados popping in for a chat to “establish a relationship” makes me feel a bit sorry for the sales assistants. They’re having to listen to watchbores all day with little chance of getting a commission out of them. They probably take turns to take it on the chin while the rest go and actually sell watches and jewellery.

Well that jewelry is not going to sell itself

[MWW70s]

Originally Posted by Stoffel

Every time I hear stories like this about desperados popping in for a chat to “establish a relationship” makes me feel a bit sorry for the sales assistants. They’re having to listen to watchbores all day with little chance of getting a commission out of them. They probably take turns to take it on the chin while the rest go and actually sell watches and jewellery.

I thought they are being paid for that, and it is only when they listen to watch-bores and appear to have understood them that they can get to sell their unwanted jewelries.

[Swiss Mad!]

Originally Posted by Stoffel

Every time I hear stories like this about desperados popping in for a chat to “establish a relationship” makes me feel a bit sorry for the sales assistants. They’re having to listen to watchbores all day with little chance of getting a commission out of them. They probably take turns to take it on the chin while the rest go and actually sell watches and jewellery.

Bit harsh - its a 2 way street - yes the SA has to listen to another 'watchbore' but if the stock was there to buy then they could probably retire on the commission as there's so much demand for Rolex at present.

Cant have a go at the customers, i.e 'us' just because the AD has no stock to sell.

[TimepieceRPP]

True, it is cheaper to go gray if you have no purchase history. However if you have spent time on reading some other threads, some who didn't have any purchase history did get to buy what they wanted from ADs. Good luck

[Oxfordian]

Originally Posted by shammad10

Hello all, I am new to the forum, been lurking for s few months before I joined!

I only got into watches around 2019 and have found it to be such a fascinating hobby.
I have been trying to build a ‘relationship’ with a dealer in the UK (Goldsmiths) and have been popping down to the store to chat to the sales assistants every few weeks, and we’ve been getting on really well.
I have my name down for an Explorer II.

Today the sales assistant took me aside and said:
‘I want to be as honest with you as possible. I am not allowed to sell a professional model to you. You have to buy around £10k worth of jewellery/watches from us to be offered a professional model’

What I don’t really understand is that they don’t want people to flip watches- but they are trying to get me to buy a DJ 28/31 which I have no use for and would sell. It makes no sense to spend £10k to buy a watch that retails at £6.8k! It would be cheaper for me to go gray!
How did you first timers get your foot in the door?

Easy, bought myself a watch I wanted, my DJ41. Then my wife decided that she wanted a nice watch so I bought a DJ31 for her. When I asked for the new Submariner I was lucky enough to get one within 3 weeks of the launch.

I still have every watch I have bought, not just Rolex.

[M9APO]

I had the same experience with Goldsmiths. Had the ‘interview’ on my initial visit, talked about watches in general for 45 mins, all good.

Followed up a month later only to be told that I’m on the list but at the bottom due to zero purchase history. I went to their other branch upstairs and bought another Tudor and was told “that’ll do, we’ll get you into a sports Rolex soon’.

The Tudor failed after 10 days and I eventually got a refund after 3 months so there goes my purchase history!

I’d also registered interest at another family owned AD and now have my first Rolex(SS DJ) and on a proper waitlist for a Sub, I even got a VIP gift(3 watch leather case).

My advice would be to go to a non-chain AD in a small town/city in a less ‘well off’ area!

[telesquire]

I would love to have a recording of such a conversation so that I could firstly send it to Rolex UK and then the Consumer Protection body for the Unfair Trading Act. Rolex freely advertise their watches with retail prices and when available you should be able to purchase the watch you want without having to spend £10k on another product first. Its 2021....you they can't manipulate and coerse consumers like that, we have acts and laws to protect us from such practices.

[StanGMT]

Goldsmiths are the AD I refer to in this thread: https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=825114. Unless you have a substantial purchase history with them (which flippers do have) you will not get to the front of the queue in a very long time.

Stan.

[Nairn1980]

Originally Posted by telesquire

I would love to have a recording of such a conversation so that I could firstly send it to Rolex UK and then the Consumer Protection body for the Unfair Trading Act. Rolex freely advertise their watches with retail prices and when available you should be able to purchase the watch you want without having to spend £10k on another product first. Its 2021....you they can't manipulate and coerse consumers like that, we have acts and laws to protect us from such practices.

You are allowed to state a qualifying purchase.

Eg M&S sell a cosmetic Advent Calendar that you can only buy if you spend £xx on non food purchases. It has a retail price but only with qualifying spend.

Porsche sell and advertise some models like GT3….. however from what I hear, unless you’ve purchased some less desirable models you have no chance.

Whether we like it or not, this kind of thing does freely happen in the UK and across the world.

No one has right of supply and a retailer can pick and choose who to sell to as long as it’s not on the grounds of disability, sexual orientation, race etc (hard to prove even if this happened).

[Sandpit]

Originally Posted by Nairn1980

You are allowed to state a qualifying purchase.

Eg M&S sell a cosmetic Advent Calendar that you can only buy if you spend £xx on non food purchases. It has a retail price but only with qualifying spend.

Porsche sell and advertise some models like GT3….. however from what I hear, unless you’ve purchased some less desirable models you have no chance.

Whether we like it or not, this kind of thing does freely happen in the UK and across the world.

No one has right of supply and a retailer can pick and choose who to sell to as long as it’s not on the grounds of disability, sexual orientation, race etc (hard to prove even if this happened).

It can be hard to any form of 911 these days, let alone a GT3. But yes you’re right. You generally need to have history to get a limited production model.

Unfortunately OP, this is the game these days. You could maybe try a smaller family AD. I wouldn’t waste my time going in to see Goldsmiths every few weeks. They could sell that watch multiple times over to existing customers.

[waxy88]

Originally Posted by telesquire

I would love to have a recording of such a conversation so that I could firstly send it to Rolex UK and then the Consumer Protection body for the Unfair Trading Act. Rolex freely advertise their watches with retail prices and when available you should be able to purchase the watch you want without having to spend £10k on another product first. Its 2021....you they can't manipulate and coerse consumers like that, we have acts and laws to protect us from such practices.

I am not sure any law is being broken and this practice is fairly well acknowledged in the UK.

I actually do not blame the ADs for this approach to selling one of the most in demand brands of consumer products in the world. Where demand far outstrips supply why wouldn’t you choose the customers who generate more revenue for your business?

Realistically would you sell a high demand piece, which literally has hundreds of people on a waitlist for it, to a random customer who has never spent a penny in your store before and may never again? Or would you sell it to the customer or has spent thousands with you. If it was our business I suspect most of us would do the same.

Now I admit that this has played into the hands of the flippers in the past, but I do believe WOS group are trying to do something about this, probably because Rolex have given them the word

[Meyrin]

Originally Posted by telesquire

I would love to have a recording of such a conversation so that I could firstly send it to Rolex UK and then the Consumer Protection body for the Unfair Trading Act. Rolex freely advertise their watches with retail prices and when available you should be able to purchase the watch you want without having to spend £10k on another product first. Its 2021....you they can't manipulate and coerse consumers like that, we have acts and laws to protect us from such practices.

Indeed we have, at least in the UK, for example the "Trade Descriptions Act 1968". I haven't waded through all of it, but it seems to me that the ridiculous and shameful games many ADs play with their potential customers could constitute as offences under this Act of Parliament!

[StanGMT]

I've said this in another thread, but after 53 years wearing my 1675 GMT Master I wanted to 'retire' it and buy another, current, Pepsi GMT to see out the rest of my days. But then I encountered Goldsmiths - the only AD in my part of the country. To cut a long story short I decided not to play their game and I quit Rolex and bought an Omega Speedmaster (Master Chronometer) from Beaverbrook's Omega Boutique, to become my new daily watch. I won't buy anything from Goldsmith's again. I'm delighted with the Speedy and am quite happy to just bring out my vintage GMT on special occasions.

Stan.

[dannyp]

Originally Posted by telesquire

I would love to have a recording of such a conversation so that I could firstly send it to Rolex UK and then the Consumer Protection body for the Unfair Trading Act. Rolex freely advertise their watches with retail prices and when available you should be able to purchase the watch you want without having to spend £10k on another product first. Its 2021....you they can't manipulate and coerse consumers like that, we have acts and laws to protect us from such practices.

The problem will be "proving" that the watch was available at any given point in time. It's not like it's in the case and you are being told you cannot have it. Can't force someone to sell you something they don't have (or, at the very least, you can't prove that they have).

[harvey]

…are the kids off school already?

[2loaded]

Originally Posted by harvey

…are the kids off school already?

[Madman37]

Originally Posted by harvey

…are the kids off school already?

I didn’t know victor meldrew was on this forum. Wow

[Burlington]

Apparently showering them with gifts can help

[Harry-57]

If you don't have a purchase history with a Rolex AD, now is not the best time to be seeking models from ADs which are in demand. The market just isn't tilted in your direction at the moment.

In your situation I would explore watches I like from brands where a grey dealer or an AD will give me a discount. If I was obsessed with a particular model and just had to have it, I would pull the funds together and just buy it. Then enjoy the hell out of it and forget about the mark up.

I have a 216570 Polar. It was my first Rolex. I love it today as much as I ever did and I will not part with it. I bought it new from my AD for £5650, which was below MSRP, in February 2018. According to C24 it's estimated current value is £10-11k. Let's say you can score a good one in the UK for £9k. It's just not worth it. You can argue (correctly) that it's actually worth what someone is willing to pay for it, but it is not a £9k watch, simple as that.

It won't be this bonkers for ever.

[Vetracer]

Maybe I’m just lucky. I wondered into Watches of Switzerland who own Goldsmiths in the UK in 2019. Chatted to the staff who were very friendly. I registered interest in three Rolex watches. I’d only bought jewellery for my wife in the past from Goldsmiths but had not spent more than £4000 on some diamond earrings.

During the pandemic lockdown in 2020, they called me up and offered me a selection of watches. I bought a turquoise dial OP 41 and a Submariner and collected them when they reopened. I’m hopeful I’ll get called again soon. I visited the store recently and they had display only pieces to try on.

[greengold]

Originally Posted by Vetracer

Maybe I’m just lucky. I wondered into Watches of Switzerland who own Goldsmiths in the UK in 2019. Chatted to the staff who were very friendly. I registered interest in three Rolex watches. I’d only bought jewellery for my wife in the past from Goldsmiths but had not spent more than £4000 on some diamond earrings.

During the pandemic lockdown in 2020, they called me up and offered me a selection of watches. I bought a turquoise dial OP 41 and a Submariner and collected them when they reopened. I’m hopeful I’ll get called again soon. I visited the store recently and they had display only pieces to try on.

Incorrect, Arum group own WOS..and Goldsmiths..and Mappin & Webb

[Oxfordian]

Originally Posted by greengold

Incorrect, Arum group own WOS..and Goldsmiths..and Mappin & Webb

Correct, apparently the WoS name is used as it represents what they sell, if the stores were called Arum no one would understand.

[vh2k]

Originally Posted by greengold

Incorrect, Arum group own WOS..and Goldsmiths..and Mappin & Webb

Actually, the entity is The Watches of Switzerland Group. They changed their name three years ago.

[Nairn1980]

Originally Posted by vh2k

Actually, the entity is The Watches of Switzerland Group. They changed their name three years ago.

This

[Nairn1980]

Originally Posted by shammad10

Hello all, I am new to the forum, been lurking for s few months before I joined!

I only got into watches around 2019 and have found it to be such a fascinating hobby.
I have been trying to build a ‘relationship’ with a dealer in the UK (Goldsmiths) and have been popping down to the store to chat to the sales assistants every few weeks, and we’ve been getting on really well.
I have my name down for an Explorer II.

Today the sales assistant took me aside and said:
‘I want to be as honest with you as possible. I am not allowed to sell a professional model to you. You have to buy around £10k worth of jewellery/watches from us to be offered a professional model’

What I don’t really understand is that they don’t want people to flip watches- but they are trying to get me to buy a DJ 28/31 which I have no use for and would sell. It makes no sense to spend £10k to buy a watch that retails at £6.8k! It would be cheaper for me to go gray!
How did you first timers get your foot in the door?

No female family members who you could gift a nice DJ 28/31 to? (Wife/gf/mistress/mother/sister)
You’d delight a family member AND build purchase history - bingo

[waxy88]

And to the OP, yes you can possibly get Rolex models from an AD without a “spend history”, but that would probably be outside the WOS group, as someone else mentioned.

I think the SA has actually done you a solid by being totally upfront and honest with you, rather than misleading you into believing you might get the piece you were after. I think there is something to be said for having a good relationship with an SA and I have done that with a number of people, which has meant I have managed to get some hard to get watches. However what “having a relationship” means in my mind is being a genuine person who clearly has a passion for watches, of all kinds. For examp,e I was excitedly showing my SA my new G Shock tha5 I bought the other week and we talked for ages about G Shocks and how cool they were. But it is also about just chatting about life with your SA, shared interests etc. One particular SA I will chat to about our shared love for boxing endlessly.

If you don’t want to buy a 2831 DJ, my advice would be to indulge you passion for watches in other brands that Goldsmiths also sells. There are some incredible watches from Omega, Tudor, Cartier and Breitling to name a few. Personally I love all watches, so it has been no chore for me to buy all kinds of watches to build my collection and my purchase history.

Ultimately if all you care about is owning a Rolex which is in high demand and that is all you want, my advice is just go to a grey dealer and buy straight away.