Need some help... 1815 chronograph or Cornes de Vache

[HMHM]

I have seen both but I think with you having own the 5172, you will eventually be feeling cold with either once you own it. The 1815 has a great movement but the layout is weird, as the two sub dials are primarily at the bottom which affects its symmetry. The CdV colour scheme just doesn’t do it for me (personal preference, nothing wrong with the watch). Between the 2, definitely the 1815, but the blue 5172 still reigns supreme and I feel once the initial novelty of acquiring wears off, it will not get much wrist time compared to the 5172G.

[JR16]

I went with the 1815 chrono above the VC and PP and have no regrets. I think the movement is superior (by a slim margin c/w PP) and the aesthetics resonated with me. Really dislike the dial and the lugs of the VC- just not my thing though I can see how others are attracted to it. OP can’t go wrong either way.


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[GB-man]

Originally Posted by HMHM

I have seen both but I think with you having own the 5172, you will eventually be feeling cold with either once you own it. The 1815 has a great movement but the layout is weird, as the two sub dials are primarily at the bottom which affects its symmetry. The CdV colour scheme just doesn’t do it for me (personal preference, nothing wrong with the watch). Between the 2, definitely the 1815, but the blue 5172 still reigns supreme and I feel once the initial novelty of acquiring wears off, it will not get much wrist time compared to the 5172G.

You bring about a good point I’d take the 5172 of the three. Also the reason the 1815 is droopy is because the movement was designed with the datographs grand date in mind.

[CFR]

You can see Lange prices here (see the "Historic Data" tab or the "Annual Prices" tab).

1815 Chrono in WG is $67,800 USD. The two that I like are the WG/black dial (414.028) and the "Boutique" edition with the blue elements (414.026).

Tough call between the 1815 Chrono and the CdV. They're both nice watches. The aesthetics of the CdV dial are too top-heavy for me -- too much printing (plus markers) concentrated in the top half of the dial, making the negative space on the bottom portion stand out in a way that is unbalanced to me. I wish the subdials on the CdV were lower. The 1815 Chrono is super nice but I never liked it enough to pull the trigger. Thought about getting the Boutique version when it first came out but didn't. Then the black dial version came out later, and a lot of people who would've gotten the Boutique version opted for the black dial -- a real home run for Lange. I ended up preferring the Gen1 Datograph to the 1815 Chrono.

[ButtButt]

Originally Posted by HMHM

I have seen both but I think with you having own the 5172, you will eventually be feeling cold with either once you own it. The 1815 has a great movement but the layout is weird, as the two sub dials are primarily at the bottom which affects its symmetry. The CdV colour scheme just doesn’t do it for me (personal preference, nothing wrong with the watch). Between the 2, definitely the 1815, but the blue 5172 still reigns supreme and I feel once the initial novelty of acquiring wears off, it will not get much wrist time compared to the 5172G.

That's an interesting point. I have thought about it and I think there could be occasions for either of them. The 5172 I can wear anywhere (weather permitting) and is more casual while the 1815 and CdV are just a touch more dressy. I can see myself wear either of them to a nice meal or a board meeting.

I've been thinking a bit more on what watches I want to collect, and the idea of a high end chronograph from PP, VC, AP, Lange sounds quite appealing to me.

Originally Posted by JR16

I went with the 1815 chrono above the VC and PP and have no regrets. I think the movement is superior (by a slim margin c/w PP) and the aesthetics resonated with me. Really dislike the dial and the lugs of the VC- just not my thing though I can see how others are attracted to it. OP can’t go wrong either way.


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Thanks, I agree there is no wrong choice here.

Originally Posted by GB-man

You bring about a good point I’d take the 5172 of the three. Also the reason the 1815 is droopy is because the movement was designed with the datographs grand date in mind.

So was there anything specific that stopped you from saying yes to the CdV all those times in the past?

Originally Posted by CFR

You can see Lange prices here (see the "Historic Data" tab or the "Annual Prices" tab).

1815 Chrono in WG is $67,800 USD. The two that I like are the WG/black dial (414.028) and the "Boutique" edition with the blue elements (414.026).

Tough call between the 1815 Chrono and the CdV. They're both nice watches. The aesthetics of the CdV dial are too top-heavy for me -- too much printing (plus markers) concentrated in the top half of the dial, making the negative space on the bottom portion stand out in a way that is unbalanced to me. I wish the subdials on the CdV were lower. The 1815 Chrono is super nice but I never liked it enough to pull the trigger. Thought about getting the Boutique version when it first came out but didn't. Then the black dial version came out later, and a lot of people who would've gotten the Boutique version opted for the black dial -- a real home run for Lange. I ended up preferring the Gen1 Datograph to the 1815 Chrono.

Thanks for the link and beautiful picture, that is super helpful. I will always love the Datograph, just a bit sad the size doesn't work for me.

[CFR]

Originally Posted by ButtButt

I will always love the Datograph, just a bit sad the size doesn't work for me.

I'm curious, is the Dato too big for you? Or too small? I wasn't sure, since 19cm wrist seems pretty average, and personal preferences vary so much.

For reference, current/Gen2 Dato (Up/Down) is 41.0x13.1mm. Older/Gen1 Dato (shown on my wrist) is 39.0x12.8mm. Current 1815 Chrono is 39.5x11.1mm.

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by CFR

You can see Lange prices here (see the "Historic Data" tab or the "Annual Prices" tab).

1815 Chrono in WG is $67,800 USD. The two that I like are the WG/black dial (414.028) and the "Boutique" edition with the blue elements (414.026).

Tough call between the 1815 Chrono and the CdV. They're both nice watches. The aesthetics of the CdV dial are too top-heavy for me -- too much printing (plus markers) concentrated in the top half of the dial, making the negative space on the bottom portion stand out in a way that is unbalanced to me. I wish the subdials on the CdV were lower. The 1815 Chrono is super nice but I never liked it enough to pull the trigger. Thought about getting the Boutique version when it first came out but didn't. Then the black dial version came out later, and a lot of people who would've gotten the Boutique version opted for the black dial -- a real home run for Lange. I ended up preferring the Gen1 Datograph to the 1815 Chrono.

Beautiful dato

[ButtButt]

Originally Posted by CFR

I'm curious, is the Dato too big for you? Or too small? I wasn't sure, since 19cm wrist seems pretty average, and personal preferences vary so much.

For reference, current/Gen2 Dato (Up/Down) is 41.0x13.1mm. Older/Gen1 Dato (shown on my wrist) is 39.0x12.8mm. Current 1815 Chrono is 39.5x11.1mm.

It was more the thickness than anything, it just felt really chunky on my wrist. I also didn’t really like how the date windows were different levels and would have preferred if 1-9 showed a 0 in front instead of being empty.

[RobGomez]

I faced the same dilemma a few years ago between a boutique 1815 and the steel CdV and went with the latter. It seems everyone is in agreement that the 1815 movement is more technically advanced and impressive vs the lemania on the VC. For me, the proportions and design of the VC outweighed the strong point (movement) of the ALS. On the wrist the Lange felt sterile and chunky while the VC was charming and nuanced. The fact that the VC is steel and has a movement that is typically reserved for PM cases was also cool to me. I wonder if that movement has ever been fitted to any other steel cases. Sharing a few pics of each watch on my ~7” wrist. It all comes down to personal preference!



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[EEpro]

Originally Posted by RobGomez

I faced the same dilemma a few years ago between a boutique 1815 and the steel CdV and went with the latter. It seems everyone is in agreement that the 1815 movement is more technically advanced and impressive vs the lemania on the VC. For me, the proportions and design of the VC outweighed the strong point (movement) of the ALS. On the wrist the Lange felt sterile and chunky while the VC was charming and nuanced. The fact that the VC is steel and has a movement that is typically reserved for PM cases was also cool to me. I wonder if that movement has ever been fitted to any other steel cases. Sharing a few pics of each watch on my ~7” wrist. It all comes down to personal preference!



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VC looks so much better on your wrist.


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[hgg43c]

1815

[ButtButt]

Originally Posted by RobGomez

I faced the same dilemma a few years ago between a boutique 1815 and the steel CdV and went with the latter. It seems everyone is in agreement that the 1815 movement is more technically advanced and impressive vs the lemania on the VC. For me, the proportions and design of the VC outweighed the strong point (movement) of the ALS. On the wrist the Lange felt sterile and chunky while the VC was charming and nuanced. The fact that the VC is steel and has a movement that is typically reserved for PM cases was also cool to me. I wonder if that movement has ever been fitted to any other steel cases. Sharing a few pics of each watch on my ~7” wrist. It all comes down to personal preference!


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Thanks for sharing, those both look amazing on you!

[Bearxj86]

I find the 1815 boutique goes well with more
Straps from the front. CDV lugs unique. Movement side it’s Lemania which is a reliable nicely finished but vs a fly back game changing movement from a finish. Front can debate but backside no contest..








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[ButtButt]

Originally Posted by Bearxj86

I find the 1815 boutique goes well with more
Straps from the front. CDV lugs unique. Movement side it’s Lemania which is a reliable nicely finished but vs a fly back game changing movement from a finish. Front can debate but backside no contest..

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Man all these pics aren't making the decision any easier Those straps make the 1815 look much more casual, love it.

[GB-man]

I would love to hear anyone make an argument the dial, case or hands are superior on the 1815.

[gliazzurri]

Originally Posted by GB-man

I would love to hear anyone make an argument the dial, case or hands are superior on the 1815.

I'll have a go with it. All of this comes down to personal preferences and style preferences.

For me, I don't like the teardrop look on the VC. I'll admit it is unique and has a French-esque design element. I think it makes it look more feminine, though this is not a slight. Just saying it is like how a Ferrari looks feminine compared to say a Lamborghini. It's very appealing but in a different way.

But for me I like the linear components of the other style and maybe on a different dial/watch I could go with the teardrop style much more--maybe on a Journe for example with the other romantic elements associated with it.

Secondly on the dial on the VC, to my eye it feels like a target--and I feel that it is pulled to the center more like a bullseye almost. The racetrack on the 1815 I love which is both historic and romantic to pocket watch era as well, which I find appealing. There is a form to that which is "linear" in some manner which I like. It's very structured I feel. I also feel the VC is much more busy just by looking at it, but that again is because I don't like jammed up dials with too much info crammed (i.e. some perpetual calendar designs how they are implemented).

I do not see any issue with the fact the subdials are lower. I don't see why a watch needs to be symmetrical vertically and horizontally (and I'd say many many are certainly not. Again the 1815 line has that design element and don't see any imbalance at least to me. I find my eye going to left-right symmetry substantially more than looking at a watch and thinking about up-down symmetry (which even usually can be offset by a brand on the top or a subdial seconds on the bottom in some cases.

[Bearxj86]

Originally Posted by GB-man

I would love to hear anyone make an argument the dial, case or hands are superior on the 1815.

I do prefer sword hands but agree the dial side and lugs of the CDV is a strength

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by gliazzurri

I'll have a go with it. All of this comes down to personal preferences and style preferences.

For me, I don't like the teardrop look on the VC. I'll admit it is unique and has a French-esque design element. I think it makes it look more feminine, though this is not a slight. Just saying it is like how a Ferrari looks feminine compared to say a Lamborghini. It's very appealing but in a different way.

But for me I like the linear components of the other style and maybe on a different dial/watch I could go with the teardrop style much more--maybe on a Journe for example with the other romantic elements associated with it.

Secondly on the dial on the VC, to my eye it feels like a target--and I feel that it is pulled to the center more like a bullseye almost. The racetrack on the 1815 I love which is both historic and romantic to pocket watch era as well, which I find appealing. There is a form to that which is "linear" in some manner which I like. It's very structured I feel. I also feel the VC is much more busy just by looking at it, but that again is because I don't like jammed up dials with too much info crammed (i.e. some perpetual calendar designs how they are implemented).

I do not see any issue with the fact the subdials are lower. I don't see why a watch needs to be symmetrical vertically and horizontally (and I'd say many many are certainly not. Again the 1815 line has that design element and don't see any imbalance at least to me. I find my eye going to left-right symmetry substantially more than looking at a watch and thinking about up-down symmetry (which even usually can be offset by a brand on the top or a subdial seconds on the bottom in some cases.

You make excellent points…this is a well thought out response. Truthfully if the Lange chrono movement was offered in a steel or titanium case I’d probably be willing to overlook some other parts I dislike.

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by Bearxj86

I do prefer sword hands but agree the dial side and lugs of the CDV is a strength

Give me your TN. Thanks

[gliazzurri]

Originally Posted by GB-man

You make excellent points…this is a well thought out response. Truthfully if the Lange chrono movement was offered in a steel or titanium case I’d probably be willing to overlook some other parts I dislike.

The thing is that everyone’s right on this question. I don’t mean that like there can’t be a loser but the options are so appealing to different tastes. I certainly don’t want to persuade anyone to change his or her opinion. Just trying to explain how my tastes line up.
As I think more about the two I think both could be argued to be classic designs. Though of two culturally different styles. The VC does indeed feel classic in the implementation of those lugs we are discussing. Classic like some era of history I just can’t name. As with the traditional dial aspect with the layout and chrono setup. At the same time the Lange I think is so technically classic in a German way. I know some think of this as sterile as in devoid of character. On the other hand I see that it can have a lot of stark character in a different manner, perhaps more in the more cerebral design.

As some talk about how watches are mini representations of who we are, I can understand why the 1815 chrono appeals more to me based on those considerations. Though the other is no slouch…it just doesn’t gel as well with my ideals and visual reward.

[GB-man]

I tend to like watches that have some warmth to the design. I like Journe, Vacheron and Patek for that reason. I also put a high value on comfort and Lange seems to stick to their relatively unergonomic case designs.

Your points are appreciated and much more nuanced than I figured I would get so thank you. Truth is I will likely buy that VC someday so I’ve already made up my mind on this fight even though I’m not the OP!

[CFR]

Originally Posted by GB-man

I tend to like watches that have some warmth to the design. I like Journe, Vacheron and Patek for that reason.

This resonates with me. I always liked the Journe Octa Calendrier because through its asymmetry, it reminded me of a whimsical take on a Lange design.

For me this is the warmest Lange ever made, a real treat.

[Jmaster]

Let me start of by saying I love Lange, and their movements are clear a mile ahead of anything based on Lemania. If that’s what you want, OP, than you wouldn’t have started this thread. Lange watches are lovely and while I have never handled a 1815, having handled Lange 1 and Saxonia, I definitely would like to add a Lange to my collection at some point.

However, between the two, I think the CdV has so much more charm and classic look with that awesome dial, and it would fit better for you given that you already have a 5172G.

I may also have a strange suggestion.

Just from looking at the pictures since I’ve never handled a 1815, I found the 1815 dial design much more similar to the now discontinued VC Patrimony Traditionnelle Chronograph 47192. From the straight lugs, squared pushers, the case shape and the hands, there seems to have quite a bit of similarities. I would argue that the VC 47192 is even better with a more balanced dial and applied markers that won’t have those cut off numerals. It is a bigger watch at 42mm in diameter but with a 10.5mm thickness and given your wrist size, it would fit your requirements. It can be had for well less than $30k these days, so obviously a lot cheaper than the Lange or even the stainless CdV and some would say it’s not even a comparable. But if you don’t look at the prices and just the watches, maybe it’s a much greater value.

[pdnb]

IMO the VDC sub dials are too close the center of the dial; this implies that VDC is using a larger case than the original movement “intended”.

Some don’t like that the 1815 sub dials are below the center line… but I chose Datograph. As I love the outsized date and the geometry that forms within the dial design





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[ButtButt]

Originally Posted by gliazzurri

I'll have a go with it. All of this comes down to personal preferences and style preferences.

For me, I don't like the teardrop look on the VC. I'll admit it is unique and has a French-esque design element. I think it makes it look more feminine, though this is not a slight. Just saying it is like how a Ferrari looks feminine compared to say a Lamborghini. It's very appealing but in a different way.

But for me I like the linear components of the other style and maybe on a different dial/watch I could go with the teardrop style much more--maybe on a Journe for example with the other romantic elements associated with it.

Secondly on the dial on the VC, to my eye it feels like a target--and I feel that it is pulled to the center more like a bullseye almost. The racetrack on the 1815 I love which is both historic and romantic to pocket watch era as well, which I find appealing. There is a form to that which is "linear" in some manner which I like. It's very structured I feel. I also feel the VC is much more busy just by looking at it, but that again is because I don't like jammed up dials with too much info crammed (i.e. some perpetual calendar designs how they are implemented).

I do not see any issue with the fact the subdials are lower. I don't see why a watch needs to be symmetrical vertically and horizontally (and I'd say many many are certainly not. Again the 1815 line has that design element and don't see any imbalance at least to me. I find my eye going to left-right symmetry substantially more than looking at a watch and thinking about up-down symmetry (which even usually can be offset by a brand on the top or a subdial seconds on the bottom in some cases.

Well said, my problem is I love and appreciate both styles and would be super happy with either of them. With the 1815 I don't mind the asymmetrical subdials, it's the cut off 3 and 9 that bother me more. I wonder if they would ever update it without the numbers being cut off.

Originally Posted by CFR

This resonates with me. I always liked the Journe Octa Calendrier because through its asymmetry, it reminded me of a whimsical take on a Lange design.

For me this is the warmest Lange ever made, a real treat.

That looks amazing, I also really love the Langematik Perpetual in WG with blue dial.

Originally Posted by Jmaster

Let me start of by saying I love Lange, and their movements are clear a mile ahead of anything based on Lemania. If that’s what you want, OP, than you wouldn’t have started this thread. Lange watches are lovely and while I have never handled a 1815, having handled Lange 1 and Saxonia, I definitely would like to add a Lange to my collection at some point.

However, between the two, I think the CdV has so much more charm and classic look with that awesome dial, and it would fit better for you given that you already have a 5172G.

I may also have a strange suggestion.

Just from looking at the pictures since I’ve never handled a 1815, I found the 1815 dial design much more similar to the now discontinued VC Patrimony Traditionnelle Chronograph 47192. From the straight lugs, squared pushers, the case shape and the hands, there seems to have quite a bit of similarities. I would argue that the VC 47192 is even better with a more balanced dial and applied markers that won’t have those cut off numerals. It is a bigger watch at 42mm in diameter but with a 10.5mm thickness and given your wrist size, it would fit your requirements. It can be had for well less than $30k these days, so obviously a lot cheaper than the Lange or even the stainless CdV and some would say it’s not even a comparable. But if you don’t look at the prices and just the watches, maybe it’s a much greater value.

Thanks for the suggestion and response. That Traditionelle is nice but to me looks like many other chronographs out there. The CdV oozes charm while being a very traditional/classic design which I love. It's really a tough choice.

Originally Posted by pdnb

IMO the VDC sub dials are too close the center of the dial; this implies that VDC is using a larger case than the original movement “intended”.

Some don’t like that the 1815 sub dials are below the center line… but I chose Datograph. As I love the outsized date and the geometry that forms within the dial design

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Very nice!

[ButtButt]

Just spoke to the Lange boutique, the WG black dial they are taking deposits on and the wait is about 1 year. All other 1815 chronograph models are closed for orders. Haven't heard back from VC yet.

[CFR]

Originally Posted by ButtButt

Just spoke to the Lange boutique, the WG black dial they are taking deposits on and the wait is about 1 year. All other 1815 chronograph models are closed for orders. Haven't heard back from VC yet.

These days, Lange frequently changes which models are open vs. closed for orders. If there's a different model you want (such as the Boutique edition of the 1815 Chrono) that's currently closed, it might be available to order later this year.

But if you like the dial side of the CdV better then I'd go with that, since that's what you'll be looking at most of the time.

Or -- maybe best-- do nothing for now. Just wait, since you're undecided. That's better than pulling the trigger and then getting something that always makes you say, "It's really nice, but if only..." every time you look at it.

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by ButtButt

Just spoke to the Lange boutique, the WG black dial they are taking deposits on and the wait is about 1 year. All other 1815 chronograph models are closed for orders. Haven't heard back from VC yet.

In USA my Richemont AD gets about 2 per year. I was offered CdV in steel two nights ago but am holding out for RG. Perhaps I should have got both.

I'm curious the story on your side of the globe.

[RaZCaL]

Originally Posted by EEpro

In USA my Richemont AD gets about 2 per year. I was offered CdV in steel two nights ago but am holding out for RG. Perhaps I should have got both.

I'm curious the story on your side of the globe.

The rose gold is stunning!




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[Gebbeth]

For me, it would be the 1815 and not even close.

I feel the ALS is a better proportioned with a better movement and better layout. The design has a more unified and coherent language and unique in that regard.

This screams "Lange," and while that might not be everyone's cup of tea, it does sing to me. If you were to hide the name of the brand for each watch, I would instantly recognize the Lange....I would have trouble with the Vacheron if not for the lugs...and to me, the lugs alone are not enough for me to like the overall aesthetic of a watch.