Uggh — self-inflicted wound on my Calatrava. Help!!!

[mafoofan]

I was taking photos of my 5296 recently and noticed an area of the bezel (between 12 and 3 o’clock) that I had previously hand-polished to get rid of some minor scratches now appears slightly rounded-off at the edges and maybe even lower in height as well. I used a Sunshine cloth (less abrasive than Cape Cod), so I’m shocked that this could happen.

Note that the bezel and mid case are one piece.

I have an appointment next week at HSWA to see what Patek can do. However, from my understanding, historically, they do not laser weld to rebuild softened edges. Does anyone know if that has changed? Would they potentially offer a case replacement? My fear is they will insist on polishing down the whole case or refuse to touch it at all.

I know they’ll come back to me with some answers over the next few weeks, but I want to figure out how to navigate the situation with them and open up the best options possible.

I’ve also reached out to some of the well-known independents to ask if they can help. So far, they are concerned about working on a bezel that cannot be removed from the mid case. One or two are thinking about it. The last photo shows how much clearance there is between the bezel angle and the lugs.

Any answers or suggestions? Want to do whatever it takes to fix this 100%. Thanks all. Broken-hearted and feeling like an idiot.

[PPcollector]

Sorry to see that happen. I guess the lesson is never use any type of polishing cloth on a valuable watch, like a Patek. I was in HSWA before and asked them what I could use to wipe/clean my watches. They recommended to use a soft cloth. Actually received one as a souvenir after the visit! Never use abrasive cloths on any watches... when you polish it actually “removes” material in order to make it smooth. I would let the experts do that at the watch maintenance when I send mine in to HSWA. Of course, in the past I have always asked them not to polish because I prefer the “used” look.

[214270Explorer]

Talk to Rolliworks (send photos too) and see what they say.

[mafoofan]

Originally Posted by 214270Explorer

Talk to Rolliworks (send photos too) and see what they say.

I asked—the say they will only work on Rolexes.

[cascavel]

If Henri Stern can't fix your Patek, it can't be fixed. Additionally, I think you're making more out of this than it warrants. Also, I think it's impossible to wipe away much metal with a Sunshine cloth.

[ts3]

I don't think Henri Stern will offer to rebuild the bezel to like new condition. They might be able to recreate a sharper edge all around, at cost of a slightly more angled bezel top surface. I am sure you could also buy a new case but it might be cheaper to sell the watch and buy another one if you can't live with the damage or a polish. I have had the case replaced on an IWC beater after an climbing accident had resulted in several, literally 1mm deep scars. Despite the minimal cost there I'd just learn to live with the damage if it happened today.

[fsprow]

Originally Posted by cascavel

If Henri Stern can't fix your Patek, it can't be fixed. Additionally, I think you're making more out of this than it warrants. Also, I think it's impossible to wipe away much metal with a Sunshine cloth.

Agree 100%. I personally would do nothing and wear the watch.

[mafoofan]

Originally Posted by cascavel

If Henri Stern can't fix your Patek, it can't be fixed. Additionally, I think you're making more out of this than it warrants. Also, I think it's impossible to wipe away much metal with a Sunshine cloth.

Originally Posted by fsprow

Agree 100%. I personally would do nothing and wear the watch.

I bet Patek can fix it to 100%, but they won’t—as far as I know. Last I spoke to HSWA about a different watch, they explained that Patek will never use laser welding to re-build a rounded-off edge. Something about respecting unpolished pieces owned by their collectors and not trying to counterfeit a new-looking case.

If you guys have heard different, let me know!

[mafoofan]

Originally Posted by ts3

I don't think Henri Stern will offer to rebuild the bezel to like new condition. They might be able to recreate a sharper edge all around, at cost of a slightly more angled bezel top surface. I am sure you could also buy a new case but it might be cheaper to sell the watch and buy another one if you can't live with the damage or a polish. I have had the case replaced on an IWC beater after an climbing accident had resulted in several, literally 1mm deep scars. Despite the minimal cost there I'd just learn to live with the damage if it happened today.

I’d 100% be okay with a replacement case, but I don’t believe Patek will allow it—you can’t just ask for the option and pay up; they decide at their sole discretion.

[michaelodonnell123]

This might be a case of "leave well enough alone"...

By trying to fix it, they might make it worse. If this happens will you hold them liable?

[carterrolex]

i agree with you 100%. i've got no choice but to keep wearing the watch just like that.

[Benzsiam]

It's very hard to understand how the polish cloth can remove that much metal.

It would be better to leave it alone as is and learn how to get used to with it.

[PatekSF]

[QUOTE=Benzsiam;11396359]It's very hard to understand how the polish cloth can remove that much metal.

I agree completely. IMO, one would have to rub that same area for quite a long period to remove a visibly significant amount of metal.

I have hand polished many, many items and I’ve never removed a significant amount of metal, enough to notice the distortion.

I think there is more to this story that the forums are not being told. It just doesn’t make sense to me ...

My .02

[mafoofan]

Originally Posted by Benzsiam

It's very hard to understand how the polish cloth can remove that much metal.

It would be better to leave it alone as is and learn how to get used to with it.

Originally Posted by PatekSF

I agree completely. IMO, one would have to rub that same area for quite a long period to remove a visibly significant amount of metal.

I have hand polished many, many items and I’ve never removed a significant amount of metal, enough to notice the distortion.

I think there is more to this story that the forums are not being told. It just doesn’t make sense to me ...

My .02

Nope. Just used the cloth.

[Calatrava r]

I thought they could remove and replace the bezel as it is a separate part. Not sure on that. This is a good lesson to never try to remove any scratch from a watch. A job for Patek at a service.

[mafoofan]

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

I thought they could remove and replace the bezel as it is a separate part. Not sure on that. This is a good lesson to never try to remove any scratch from a watch. A job for Patek at a service.

No, the bezel and middle case are one piece together—the bezel does not come off.

[ts3]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

No, the bezel and middle case are one piece together—the bezel does not come off.

Do you know what they charge for a new case if you were to go down that route assuming they'd agree? 10k?

[mafoofan]

Originally Posted by ts3

Do you know what they charge for a new case if you were to go down that route assuming they'd agree? 10k?

No idea—don’t think that high, though. More critically, I don’t they they’ll open the option to me. In the past, with worse damage on a different watch, they would not even laser weld and insisted on only a standard polish. Patek, as far as I understand, prefers to be as non-invasive as possible.

Anyway, the more I think about it, I would not want a case replacement. The current case has sentimental value to me.

Anyone know what Patek’s approach is to future servicing of watches polished or serviced by third parties?

[mafoofan]

Also, anyone heard of RO&RO in Austria? I’ve been advised that they are one of the best when it comes to laser repair and refinishing.

[77T]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

Also, anyone heard of RO&RO in Austria? I’ve been advised that they are one of the best when it comes to laser repair and refinishing.

I have not heard of that firm, but my input is this: you couldn’t rub hard enough with that simple cloth to wear away an amount of metal worth laser welding. Banish the thought.

If you’d like to balance the edges, then have the case lapped to re-establish the symmetry you are seeking. You could start with Patek as part of your next overhaul. Or seek out an indie watchmaker with mad finishing skills.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[nhk]

Have you had the watch since new?
1. If not, could the previous owner have had the case polished at a service?
2. If you are the first owner, have you considered it came like that from the factory? I’ve been to the Patek factory in Geneva and the movements, cases and dials are hand finished.

I agree that it’s unlikely for a polish cloth to have removed so much material.

[bob101]

I would leave as it is as hardly notice it. You can get it valeted during service time later on if it really annoys you.
Polishing it however will likely decrease the resale value vs leaving it as is.
Getting case replaced wouldn’t be worth the hassle or expense in my opinion better to sell if don’t want to keep in current condition.

[mafoofan]

Originally Posted by nhk

Have you had the watch since new?
1. If not, could the previous owner have had the case polished at a service?
2. If you are the first owner, have you considered it came like that from the factory? I’ve been to the Patek factory in Geneva and the movements, cases and dials are hand finished.

I agree that it’s unlikely for a polish cloth to have removed so much material.

I am the first owner, yes.

I guess it is possible that it came this way from the factory, but I remember the way it looked prior to hand polishing and it not have this rounded-off edge.

[mafoofan]

Originally Posted by bob101

I would leave as it is as hardly notice it. You can get it valeted during service time later on if it really annoys you.
Polishing it however will likely decrease the resale value vs leaving it as is.
Getting case replaced wouldn’t be worth the hassle or expense in my opinion better to sell if don’t want to keep in current condition.

I’m sure Patek would offer to polish down the whole watch, but I don’t want to further lose material and shape.

Currently, I’m speaking with a few independents about laser welding and rebuilding the lost edge. Patek, as far as I’ve experienced, would not do this unless the damage were much worse.

[MCMartiny]

If you decide to go for laser filling via an independent specialist, you need to ensure they precisely know the particular white gold alloy used by Patek for your watch. White golds are not created the same (since late 200Xs Patek has AFAIK used a "grey gold" to avoid having to rhodium plate their watch cases) and laser filling with even a slightly different WG alloy might (or might not) lead to visibly different colour / hue of the restored area over time. Just something to be aware of.

[David001]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

I bet Patek can fix it to 100%, but they won’t—as far as I know. Last I spoke to HSWA about a different watch, they explained that Patek will never use laser welding to re-build a rounded-off edge. Something about respecting unpolished pieces owned by their collectors and not trying to counterfeit a new-looking case.

If you guys have heard different, let me know!

I haven't heard different but if true then it's disappointing. I really believed their marketing that the watch should be passed down through the generations and if they're now saying they won't repair a damaged watch to make it like new for you to pass it on then it's hugely disappointing.

I look after my PP watches but I also felt assured that they could be made like new if something unfortunate happened. Imagine if you bought a Porsche and accidently dented the wing and Porsche refused to repair it saying that it must stay like that forever to protect the integrity of other Porsches.

[Woody]

I think your options are live with it or sell it and find a replacement. Not sure there is much PP could do to resolve the problem. Personally I couldn't live with that and so the watch would be on its way and I would have learned a painful lesson......but it is not the end of the world and we all make mistakes.

[azizu]

If anyone can fix it, it would be patek philippe service center. i believe they might offer to re-case your watch if it had a noticeable defect. my friend dropped his 3710 and the case got dammaged and they offered to re-case his watch. I also recall Jason Singer who appeared on Hodinkee talking watches had a re-cased 1463 chrono.
but for a slight cloth polish i wouldn't vote for re-casing. keeping the original case has higher value for me even if it had an area of over polish

[GoingPlaces]

I'd leave it alone, if you can't live with that re-case or sell it.

[EEpro]

I would leave it alone. The smallest any blemish will ever be is when it is first made.

I'm also of the opinion your cloth didn't do that but maybe you really rubbed on it 10,000 times or so to get 100 um off of it.