I weep for the future….

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by 330ci

https://www.explico.sg/blog/studying...her-countries/


Sounds nice, not sure if that 20% government budget goes towards education would transfer over too well. The child praise system over there seems pretty complimentary to growth.

What is the per pupil expenditure though. We pay a lot and get a lot of administration instead of education.

[Krash]

In the 2022 US Federal Budget, $90 billion was allocated towards education. We’re not getting our money’s worth. Period.


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[BLACKHORSE 6]

Originally Posted by EEpro

What is the per pupil expenditure though. We pay a lot and get a lot of administration instead of education.

This

[330ci]

Originally Posted by Krash

In the 2022 US Federal Budget, $90 billion was allocated towards education. We’re not getting our money’s worth. Period.


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Singapore spent $13 billion with a 5.5 million population
Half a million active students between primary and secondary school.

US spent $90 billion with a 333 million population
We have 49.5Million students in K-12 currently

Our fiscal deficit was $1.4 trillion last year, and our budget was approaching $3T


Proportionally we're not even close even if we cut budget waste down to 0.

Obviously ~$1.2T a year is unfeasible when you look at cost per student.

But with the 2023 $8?? Billion military budget compared to $3XX Billion we spent last year. I'd say we could balance our spending a little better.

[Krash]

Originally Posted by 330ci

Singapore spent $13 billion with a 5.5 million population
Half a million active students between primary and secondary school.

US spent $90 billion with a 333 million population
We have 49.5Million students in K-12 currently

Our fiscal deficit was $1.4 trillion last year, and our budget was approaching $3T


Proportionally we're not even close even if we cut budget waste down to 0.

Obviously ~$1.2T a year is unfeasible when you look at cost per student.

But with the 2023 $8?? Billion military budget compared to $3XX Billion we spent last year. I'd say we could balance our spending a little better.

I can't speak to Singapore, but that $90 billion at the Federal Level doesn't count the amount of spending at the state and local level on education. It's local taxes and funding that largely pays for our public education system.

The problem with this $90 billion at the Federal Level, is that nobody can ever explain where the money actually goes and if it's really needed at all.

[330ci]

Originally Posted by Krash

I can't speak to Singapore, but that $90 billion at the Federal Level doesn't count the amount of spending at the state and local level on education. It's local taxes and funding that largely pays for our public education system.

The problem with this $90 billion at the Federal Level, is that nobody can ever explain where the money actually goes and if it's really needed at all.

That state lottery money always seems to disappear too

Damn, just looked into the state budget. $22.2B a year here in Michigan. We're definitely getting screwed.


https://educationdata.org/public-edu...ing-statistics


This definitely helps paint a better picture. $762B between state and federal education budgets. Nowhere near as bad as I initially thought.

[Krash]

Originally Posted by 330ci

That state lottery money always seems to disappear too

Damn, just looked into the state budget. $22.2B a year here in Michigan. We're definitely getting screwed.


https://educationdata.org/public-edu...ing-statistics


This definitely helps paint a better picture. $762B between state and federal education budgets. Nowhere near as bad as I initially thought.

Yes, and to be clear, I don't have a problem with spending the money. I just think we need to make sure we're getting our money's worth. How's the money being spent, are we spending it wisely, can we do better?

It's no different than my daughter's wedding. LOL! I gave her a budget of $50,000 and now I'm asking for an itemized spreadsheet that summarizes how she's spending all the money. Honestly, I have no problem with the budget I gave her; I just want to make sure we're spending it wisely...

[enjoythemusic]

Agreed SG is an impressive system as have been (loosely) following it since ~1998. Wonderful diversity and global community. Another benefit is she seamlessly learned multiple languages.

And for timepiece lovers... we all know SG is amazing!

Maybe it's just me and feel blessed our family was raised more globally thinking, so ask yourself what's most important for your family's future.

“When planning for a year, plant corn.
When planning for a decade, plant trees.
When planning for life, train and educate people."

[Star Ferry]

Singapore is an awesome place. Friendly, intelligent, and welcoming population that genuinely embraces visitors. A staff member at the Four Seasons spent 5 minutes helping me find my way once, and I wasn’t even staying there.

Unfortunately, the USA will never be Singapore. We have way too many idiots and thugs that Singapore wouldn’t touch with a 39.5 foot pole. And our public schools won’t ever be that level, either, unless you’re talking about small enclaves like Scarsdale NY. At least half the people loitering on the streets in NYC would end up in a Singaporean jail within hours of their arrival.

[330ci]

Originally Posted by Krash

Yes, and to be clear, I don't have a problem with spending the money. I just think we need to make sure we're getting our money's worth. How's the money being spent, are we spending it wisely, can we do better?

It's no different than my daughter's wedding. LOL! I gave her a budget of $50,000 and now I'm asking for an itemized spreadsheet that summarizes how she's spending all the money. Honestly, I have no problem with the budget I gave her; I just want to make sure we're spending it wisely...

I wouldn't be opposed to spending more either if it provided an overhaul. Expecting the current system to become more efficient seems to have been a losing battle from my viewpoint. Federal funds definitely could be used to help level the playing field.

In Mi, the average student gets $12k/yr in NY $27K, some states are sub $10k/student. Increasing the federal education budget I believe would help raise the minimal education standards, it just wouldn't move the needle much at the top I imagine.

When our district went from having custodians we all knew by name to private cleaning companies coming in, I definitely noticed a shift in peoples behavior. When Mr.Chuck had to pick up after us, we were embarrassed, when the cleaning company came in, they were doing their job. I think we have to be careful where we save money as sometimes the move has unintended consequences.

Had we negotiated better software contracts, not decked out multiple computer labs in Herman Miller(majority of which saw use but a few times a year if at all), introduced smart boards in every classroom, bought new textbooks every few years, and focused less on sports programs and more on higher education. I know full well my district would be better off.
Unfortunately it seems like everyone is searching for easier ways to educate, when education itself should be pushing everyone's capabilities.

Would be nice to know where all this money is going. We might not be Singapore, but we shouldn't be doing this poorly given the amount invested.
Expecting the government to stop wasting tax money just seems like an unlikely solution at this point.

[330ci]

Originally Posted by Star Ferry

Singapore is an awesome place. Friendly, intelligent, and welcoming population that genuinely embraces visitors. A staff member at the Four Seasons spent 5 minutes helping me find my way once, and I wasn’t even staying there.

Unfortunately, the USA will never be Singapore. We have way too many idiots and thugs that Singapore wouldn’t touch with a 39.5 foot pole. And our public schools won’t ever be that level, either, unless you’re talking about small enclaves like Scarsdale NY. At least half the people loitering on the streets in NYC would end up in a Singaporean jail within hours of their arrival.

I would likely be one of them

Too much civil disobedience in my blood

[RHJ]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

Name the movie…. OK, that is not what this is about.

I have a small side business, I contract doing FAA training and tests. To accept business shipments, mail, etc. I have a box at the local UPS store. The guys in there are a great bunch, all young but intelligent kids, well, I thought so. I think they are 20? 22? ish?

This morning I am in there (shipping a watch) and strike up a conversation with him about watches. He commented on my GMT, I let him try it on, he said it was “cool.” I asked why he didn’t wear a watch. He said he looked at his Iphone for the time. This seems more and more prevalent amongst the young, but what he said next floored me.

Quote: “I can’t tell the time unless it’s Digital”

I was astounded. Pointing at my watch I said: “So you can’t tell the time on this?” He said he could not, then called over the other worker. Also a nice kid and (seemingly) intelligent. He asked the question was he able to read a watch (analogue) time… To my horror…. The SECOND young person also said he could not, he checked his phone to see the time.

I…. I…..


I weep for the future.

terrible ... we'll come in the situation that we won't have anymore people knowing how things work, power stations without staff ...
here in germany the need of MINT studied people is very high but the number of students doing it is always decreasing ...

[golftime]

Watching one of the financial shows this morning the guest speaker noted we are producing too many graduates with useless degrees and not enough plumbers, welders, electricians, carpenters, etc. Kind of goes along with those grads who can't read an analog clock.

[michaelmclees]

I think there needs to be a list of mandatory items that boys need to learn to do before being able to be considered an adult.

Tell the time on an analog clock would be near the top of the list.

Change a tire and oil would be on there. Drive a stick would be on there. Ride a motorcycle would be on there. Riding a horse should be on there, but then I'd fail.

[Maleg]

Originally Posted by golftime

Watching one of the financial shows this morning the guest speaker noted we are producing too many graduates with useless degrees and not enough plumbers, welders, electricians, carpenters, etc. Kind of goes along with those grads who can't read an analog clock.

There have always been useless degrees. Unfortunately, today’s economy no longer has enough lumber yards to employ all those useless degree holders.

[904VT]

If one can’t read an analog clock to be honest not sure I’d trust them understanding anything of importance. You could read an article on the web nowadays and understand within seconds. I think it’s more “cool” among some of the younger generation to pretend and or not desire to learn something so “analog”.

[DD58]

It’s funny you say this. I saw my niece last weekend. I had my watch to my ear and she saw me doing this. She asked my I had my watch there I told her it’s to hear the time ticking. She laughed and said you read time not hear it. I hold here that my watch doesn’t use a battery like her phone and she argued all things use batteries. I held it to here hear and she couldn’t believe it. I then sat down with here and pulled up some pictures of how a mechanical watch works. At that point I was called old. Lol. I’m 35 I guess that’s the new old to a 12 year old. She was in even more dismay when she found out I don’t own an apple wrist computer. I’ll just let the professionals tell the time for me lol


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[Watch-Geek]

Originally Posted by golftime

Watching one of the financial shows this morning the guest speaker noted we are producing too many graduates with useless degrees and not enough plumbers, welders, electricians, carpenters, etc. Kind of goes along with those grads who can't read an analog clock.

That will self rectify.
In my country (Croatia) where skilled workers you mentioned (plumbers, welders, etc.) have gone abroad for better pay, has caused the ones who stayed so rare, they make more money than any higher end management.

One of my colleagues who is a plumber/contractor had a guy pay him equivalent of $2.000 just to jump ahead in line and have his work done earlier than planned.

It made my colleague realize he can raise the prices of his work by quite a margin, which he did, and has not seen any decline in business, only increase in profit.
It has made people talk their kids into going into those kind of schools instead of colleges as college graduates usually have hard time finding work work after they finish school, whereas skilled workers have jobs while still in school!

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[Cambo]

It’s the total disdain that many young people show for anything analog that floors me
I’m streaking to antiquity and it doesn’t look half bad

[Maleg]

Originally Posted by Watch-Geek

That will self rectify.
In my country (Croatia) where skilled workers you mentioned (plumbers, welders, etc.) have gone abroad for better pay, has caused the ones who stayed so rare, they make more money than any higher end management.

One of my colleagues who is a plumber/contractor had a guy pay him equivalent of $2.000 just to jump ahead in line and have his work done earlier than planned.

It made my colleague realize he can raise the prices of his work by quite a margin, which he did, and has not seen any decline in business, only increase in profit.
It has made people talk their kids into going into those kind of schools instead of colleges as college graduates usually have hard time finding work work after they finish school, whereas skilled workers have jobs while still in school!

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You are correct. It’s happening here. Kids right out of trade school are making more than experienced middle managers with a degree.