What's your take on this RPR controversy?

[FTX I]

Came to this side of the board because I believe we can have a nice conversation in a lighter way here and also breathe between phrases.

I've always had big respect for Philipp (RPR) and I enjoy most of his articles concerning vintage Rolex. In fact many of them I have among my favorite at the browser and I revisit some of them from time to time. However, all this battle happening on new social platforms (I don't have any, so I have no clue how the whole thing works) seems to hurt the guy's image that once was so respectable at least for me. So basically that's what I'm asking you guys, if you think this new shallow world of social media and silly disputes can damage his reputation.

[River]

I don't know about you but I wouldn't trust an expert who posts a pic of a GMT MASTER with no GMT hand. That's ignoring the other false claims like a new bi colour GMT watch and complete BLNR discontinuation not incremental update.


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[FTX I]

One thing is his work with vintage Rolex, other thing is his role as the one who leaks new watches before Basel. Young people and new watch enthusiasts (if we can call that way) only know one side of the story.

[dhknola]

I am glad someone brought this up bc RPR's cred went WAY up in my book this year.
I am not saying I am a 'fan' per se of him or his agenda in vintage, but, he did correctly identify the entire Oyster line up a day early. That is something as no one else did.

[mrs_LA]

Wei Koh seems to think it's a dick move, a hit to the company and to fellow press companies. I think it was an ego move, to prove his superiority or insider contacts. I think this violates the trust that Rolex has with people within its operations.

[Juhuatai]

I'm personally not that impressed that he somehow managed to get grainy catalogue photos the day before Basel. All his predictions prior to that were completely wrong. I really appreciate his enthusiasm for vintage but I wish he would lay off all the predictions and other stuff that I suspect he uses to get attention.

[dhknola]

Considering how bad the line up was this year, I think it was the exact opposite of a dick move, I think he deserves credit and accolades for providing an early update.

He doesn't owe Rolex anything.

I am VERY glad he leaked the photos and hope he or someone else does next year and the year after and every year after that; this degree of secrecy surrounding releases is annoying to me so I am glad they were leaked. If Rolex does not want leaks, it is their job to stop them from leaking in the first place.

[SunTzu]

What's the difference between this and the car magazine spy shots of cars in concept phase?

[dhknola]

Thank SunTzu, because in my opinion, nothing. Car magazines look for concept cars in field testing because car people want "preview" or before hand look content.
I don't think it is in any way 'dick' for RPR to do the exact same with a watch preview. Huzzah to RPR!

[77T]

Originally Posted by SunTzu

What's the difference between this and the car magazine spy shots of cars in concept phase?

If he paid a Rolex insider, or offered other consideration, suborning industrial espionage perhaps.

But not a huge issue.

The car photogs just hang out and see/shoot new models in a public venue. Totally different.

I don’t condemn anyone on this matter.


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[FTX I]

Thanks for the replies, gentlemen. To be honest I'm not concerned about the leak, if it's right or wrong, accurate or not etc. I'm more interested in your opinion if you think the repercussion and controversy on the modern side will affect his credibility here on the vintage side in the future.

[JBZ]

When I first got into watches, I found his website to be very informative. He clearly has a lot of knowledge on the subject, and the RPR GTG's looked really nice with tons of great pictures of vintage Rolex, among others.

He has a history of making predictions on new releases, a lot of which have been wrong. And he kind of presents them like he's got some sort of inside track. I think this rubs some people the wrong way.

He got it right this time because he somehow got ahold of a catalogue prior to the official release. How he did so is anybody's guess, but if he did it without official Rolex/Tudor permission, I'm sure they're not happy about it.

Bottomline, I think it's a tempest in a teapot, but it gives people in our little part of the world something to talk about.

[SunTzu]

Originally Posted by 77T

If he paid a Rolex insider, or offered other consideration, suborning industrial espionage perhaps.

But not a huge issue.

The car photogs just hang out and see/shoot new models in a public venue. Totally different.

I don’t condemn anyone on this matter.


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Gotcha.

I haven't picked up a car mag in a while but remember always reading them and it would show them camouflaged on a track not open to the public.

[FTX I]

Originally Posted by JBZ

When I first got into watches, I found his website to be very informative. He clearly has a lot of knowledge on the subject, and the RPR GTG's looked really nice with tons of great pictures of vintage Rolex, among others.

He has a history of making predictions on new releases, a lot of which have been wrong. And he kind of presents them like he's got some sort of inside track. I think this rubs some people the wrong way.

He got it right this time because he somehow got ahold of a catalogue prior to the official release. How he did so is anybody's guess, but if he did it without official Rolex/Tudor permission, I'm sure they're not happy about it.

Bottomline, I think it's a tempest in a teapot, but it gives people in our little part of the world something to talk about.

Yes the GTGs look really amazing. But I'm not sure this is just a tempest in a teapot, JBZ. The temperature raised this year as far as I know and some attitudes were a bit distant of what you'd expect from a gentleman.

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by FTX I

Thanks for the replies, gentlemen. To be honest I'm not concerned about the leak, if it's right or wrong, accurate or not etc. I'm more interested in your opinion if you think the repercussion and controversy on the modern side will affect his credibility here on the vintage side in the future.

My own opinion is that he should stick to his knitting.

I like you, have enjoyed some of his vintage reviews etc., but this latest ... yes it hurts his image if not his credibility.

They both behave like douche bags if you ask me.

[FTX I]

Originally Posted by brandrea

My own opinion is that he should stick to his knitting.

I like you, have enjoyed some of his vintage reviews etc., but this latest ... yes it hurts his image if not his credibility.

They both behave like douche bags if you ask me.

Have to agree. Not pleasant to watch that's for sure.

[enjoythemusic]

It's like Kim Kardashian having a little spat with little Kim. It's good for both of them because they get their name out there and thereby get clicks, and isn't that the whole point of being internet famous is getting clicks and followers.

There's no such thing as bad publicity they say!

[henrylee]

More respect for the RPR if he can get us new information faster. I just think Wei Koh was butt hurt that he didn’t have the info first.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by mrs_LA

Wei Koh seems to think it's a dick move, a hit to the company and to fellow press companies. I think it was an ego move, to prove his superiority or insider contacts. I think this violates the trust that Rolex has with people within its operations.

thats where i disagree. RRP is not a fellow press operation like the others. Its a gossip site.

That is a fair assessment and there is nothing inherently wrong with that.

comparing revolution and hodinkee with RPR elevates RPR like its the same level... it isn't. They also dont play by the same rules because they are not a fellow press company. No way Hodinkee releases an unauthorized leak. wouldn't happen

there are insiders and outsiders. RRP is an outsider with connections by association. I would count the others as insiders as much as one can be an insider in regard to Rolex. Insiders want to stay insiders and outsiders dont care and have nothing to lose.

Maybe thats not what you are saying? Anyway. thats my assessment of what's, what.

[TK-710]

I think no one would be talking about this if Rolex had given us something to talk about. It’s Basel, it’s the super bowl of watches, and this what there is to talk about.

Making predictions whether they’re right or wrong is entertaining. Releasing known information prior to its release date for bragging rights is immature. Since he did it in a slow year and nothing else’s is generating much excitement he is now the topic of conversation and it seems not necessarily in a good way. He did it to himself.

I really had not heard of him before. As a result of his actions here, once this “controversy” blows over I hope not to hear about it again. I like my watch news without the side of drama. Someone mentioned the Kardashians. They nailed it. Fake internet celebrities desperate for any attention good or bad. My five year old grew out of that stage two years ago. Right or wrong based on his 15 minutes of fame this week that is now my opinion of him.

[FTX I]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

It's like Kim Kardashian having a little spat with little Kim. It's good for both of them because they get their name out there and thereby get clicks, and isn't that the whole point of being internet famous is getting clicks and followers.

There's no such thing as bad publicity they say!

I thought about that of course, but among old timers and vintage collectors that's not how it works I suppose. One must behave and show some class. That's why I believe if things keep going that way there will be negative repercussions for him or his work with auctions and vintage pieces in the long run, but I hope it was just an exception what happened this year.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by FTX I

I thought about that of course, but among old timers and vintage collectors that's not how it works I suppose. One must behave and show some class. That's why I believe if things keep going that way there will be negative repercussions for him or his work with auctions and vintage pieces in the long run, but I hope it was just an exception what happened this year.

Excellent reply, and if this was 10 or 15 years ago when I was also collecting, would agree.

20 to 25 years ago when there was so little information online it was really interesting and many people were professionals back then.

Today, it seems it's starting to turn into a certain type of, how shall we say, excrement show. While I agree there should be certain quality given to high end luxury goods, the world has changed a bit.

Am not saying I'm happy with the direction of some things, it is the current state of the world we live in it seems.

Rolex obviously would have journalists agreeing to certain embargoes. If the journalist broke the Embargo agreement obviously there are legal repercussions. If a journalist happened to somehow get ahold of information and is able to distribute it then that might be considered fair game.

How many journalists would love to know what's Samsung's next edge-of-tech phone is, Apple's next rehashed unimaginative device, Microsoft's next virtual and augmented reality, and on and on and on. Part of the point of being a journalist is to get the information in a legal way ahead of your colleagues and distribute it as quickly as possible. Again, if laws were indeed broken Rolex can do what it needs to do.

As for the tit-for-tat sideshow, never knew about either and still don't care, but I did watch the Youtube video so he did get a click out of me. Bravo, well played!

[Jojoshop]

For me it is simple, he interfered with the company marketing plan He even drove price changes in the gray market. He needs to chose which camp he wants to serve, focus on the vintage watches and show some classes as mentioned above. Or became a paparazzi and look for that second of fame. But certainly can’t have both!

[Fat_ninja]

whats really really important with this little internet spat is that i learned a new way to insult people.




POOOLLLL SHIIIITTTEEEERRR!!!!!!




Lol

[FTX I]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Today, it seems it's starting to turn into a certain type of, how shall we say, excrement show. While I agree there should be certain quality given to high end luxury goods, the world has changed a bit.

Yes. Unfortunately.

[Etschell]

wei forgot it is about the watches not him. he basically did this to show rolex he was sticking up for them and on their side. but the true motive is he increases his standing with rolex.

it really did not need to be said. not as if the RPR guy showed up at basel and was standing behind the cameraman. if rolex wants a pat on the back for it's releases there is a simple solution - be better.

[Wesley Crusher]

I must really be out of the loop as I have no idea what’s going on.

[tudorbaja27]

Chi ca**o se ne frega

[FTX I]

Originally Posted by tudorbaja27

Chi ca**o se ne frega

Everyone that politely replied on this thread, apparently.

[Miguel Alvarez 2.0]

I'm really meh about the whole thing. If anything a few catalogue pics the day before isn't that impressive. I don't think I'd be impressed if he had called it a few months before either. I'd not heard of him before this as I don't have instagram. He's got some nice vintage pics by the looks of it though. if it drives more traffic to his page and he can capitalise off that fair play to him. I'm just meh.