Visit to Geneva Patek Salon - A Horological Journey

[Cru Jones]

[mario belgium]

Fantastic post,i learned through your post about these fantastic pieces especially one watch is outstanding:5074R

[joli160]

Thank you so much for bringing all of us on this fabulous journey.

[FlatlineEF9]

Originally Posted by texex91

I nominate for Best of 2014

I second this nomination.

[orangedial]

What a wonderful journey you have shared with us through such an engaging thread!
Really appreciate the effort, buddy

[ezinhk]

Here you go.

Originally Posted by benlee

Patek 5208P Triple Complication Grand Complication


The final piece that I will show here, is also Patek’s 2nd most complicated timepiece ever made. A piece so complicated to make and so rare, that they are almost never seen in any public setting until now at the Patek Geneva Salon. Even so, I had my reservations which I did not sound out that this is not a full fledge piece but a working prototype. Anyway, here you go, the watch that makes all PP Collectors drool, the ultimate grail watch, Patek Perpetual Calendar Chronograph Minute Repeater reference 5208P in platinum.




According to Mdm Marielle, the watch for security reasons had been “protected” by the watch maker to prevent any accidental adjustments that might damage to the movement so I can’t actually tried out the chronograph or test out the minute repeater. Quite a shame actually but I can understand the necessity for this course of action considering that this is a million dollar timepiece. However, I do get to see and try out the watch on the wrist and also peek at the gorgeously decorated movement.





The watch housed the ultra complicated Calibre R CH 27 PS QI ( even the naming sounds complicated ). It’s an automatic movement with minute repeater, single pushbutton chronograph and most impressively, a perpetual calendar with instantaneous display in three window apertures. What it means is that when the watch changes the date from say Monday August the 31st to Tuesday September the 1st, all three digits in the aperture display will jump instantaneously. Do take note that in a mechanical watch, any “instantaneous” movement is very hard to achieve because it means it will require the watch movement to be smart enough to calculate and store the energy necessary for this feat and to release them at the exact right moment.

Heres a picture of the movement. You can see the gongs of the minute repeater on the top right hand corner if you look closely.





As can be anticipated, adding a chronograph movement to a minute repeater does introduce added complication in the process and as a result, Patek, which usually goes for slimmer design whenever possible, saw the need to house this movement in a thicker case that’s 42mm wide and 15.7mm thick.




The case, while "chunky" looking due to it's thickness, is nevertheless very very well made. The perfectly polished platinum case is beautifully hand-crafted with smooth flowing seductive lines to lure the senses. It’s like caressing the body of a Supercar, only just more intimate and fullfilling. Even for a Grand Complication such as the 5208P, Patek still insist on keeping the dial neat and clean and legible with no extra gimmicks and I have to say they did a superb job. The sun-burst treatment of the dial gives off an elegant look.





Still, I had some reservations about the thickness. A 42mm case with a 15.7mm case thickness just doesn't sound proportional. Putting it on the wrist, the thickness is much more pronounced and no doubt it’s a power house of a watch that simply commands attention.

However, here is where personal discretion and taste come in for to me. I can’t help but say that the 5074R, while lacking the chronograph complication and lacks some of the bells and whistles of the 5208P, is nevertheless to me at least a much more beautiful piece compared to the 5208P. Shocking, as this conclusion might be to some, I actually think in this case, the law of diminishing returns applies. I think we are still several years or maybe a generation away yet before any brand can produce a perfectly wearable and well proportioned Super grand complication watch. Sure there are even more sophisticated Grand Complication watches from Lange and Vacheron that managed to squeeze in every imaginable complication out there, split second chrono, celestial map, minute repeater, tourbillon, perpetual calendar and more but at the expenses of a watch case that stretches credulity at 48mm or even 50mm or larger.

So is the 5208P worth a million quid that it’s astronomical price command? That’s subjective and depend on the individual buyer. I supposed Patek will only make this watch available to their most selected and treasured clients. Worth is or not, beautiful or not, it’s nevertheless remains a technical tour de force statement from Patek and a testimony of the brand's formidable watch-making skills that cements it's position as the pinnacle leader in the world of horology.

You might also want to view this youtube view which offers a bit more functionality display of the 5208P then what I can demonstrate here.






Sneak peek at The Patek Skymoon Tourbillon 6002


The Patek Skymoon Tourbillon is the most complicated timepiece Patek has produced till date. Not only the movement but the exquisitively hand crafted case that is a sheer work of art in it’s own right. The 6002 movement houses a minute repeater with two cathedral gongs and a tourbillon. The front dial indicates both the standard time and feature a perpetual calendar with a retrograde date and a moon-phase display. The rear dials set the stage for astronomical complication which shows a celestial map.

Here’s a picture of Sky Moon Tourbillon 6002 I saw inside a display case that comes with a special box.



No, I couldn’t actually take a more detailed picture nor handled it close-up because the watch was shielded in a glass display under lock and key. It was also running late and I have perhaps extended my welcome having occupying Mdm Marielle’s time for a good 3.5 hours.

I will very much like to refer you to this excellent article from Hodinkee if you wanted to know more about the Skymoon 6002.

http://www.hodinkee.com/blog/introdu...urbillon-6002g


It was finally time to say Good Bye. Madam Marielle, ever the gracious host extended her warm farewell to me and that's after she took me for a short tour of the building after I was finally done previewing the watches. I took with me a few souvenirs from the Salon as well as a VIP invitation card to visit the Patek Museum.





Thus my journey and visit had finally come to an end. It’s has been a most enjoyable and memorable experience for me since I started falling in love with watches. Granted most of the final few pieces are possibly out of my reach ever but I count myself fortunate to preview them first hand. I hope you have enjoy reading these series of write-ups from me just as much as I enjoyed writing them and sharing with you all.

Thank you and Au Revoir. Till next time.

[lipjin]

Originally Posted by texex91

I nominate for Best of 2014

Was rereading a few of the reviews - I think it should be stickied:) friendly dec bump!

[SearChart]

How could I have missed this thread??!

Great pictures Ben

[BLACKHORSE 6]

This thread was so good, it deserves a bump.

[ptxl]

5280P costs around 850000 Sfr. and Thierry will check by himself if you are allowed to buy this watch or not. If you are a nouveau riche, then you can forget about this.

Very nice thread Benlee!!

[AckAck]

Brings back great memories from my Geneva trip! Thank you Ben!!!

[K2Luxury]

NEXT TIME ANYONE passes by Geneva, please don't hesitate to let us know we will gladly be your guide in our hometown

[Kittayos]

5208p is so difficult to find. Was put 1 year on a wait list. The price my AD quoted was 675k CHF after some discount and VAT refund. Not sure if anyone can hook me up with the piece. Looking for a brand new one only.

Interestingly, there was a Patek minute repeater event held at renowned French restaurant in Singapore last week. Not sure if anyone visited there. Basically you can do the sound testing on all minute repeaters plus a few limited edition pieces never before seen for the ladies. If you happened to be invited, u stand a chance to buy any minute repeater or split second pieces there. Price, however, was a bit high compared to Europe.

[rfatm3f]

Originally Posted by benlee

Patek 5216P Retrograde flyback Perpetual Calendar Tourbillon Minute Repeater Grand Complication

Hope you guys are enjoying this so far!

Now, we are moving on to the truely grail pieces, the highly desirable Patek Grand Complication application pieces that are so rare and exquisite, one can almost never see them in an AD for sale, except maybe during special exhibition by Patek. I now present to you the triple complication Patek 5216P-001 Retrograde Perpetual Calendar Tourbillon Minute Repeater.




I do not need by now to say how beautiful this piece is or how finely it is crafted etc… etc in case I bored you further. What’s interesting is the triple complication movement in this piece. Release first in 2013, the watch features the Caliber RTO-27PS QR ( why does Patek use such difficult to remember alphabets and numbers for their Caliber names? ) which incorporates within the 39.5mm case a retrograde perpetual calendar with day, month and lead year indicators in apertures and a retrograde date dial at the top centre of the watch. Retrograde is a very cool complication. How it works is that on reaching the last day of the month, ie 31st or 30th ( or 28th / 29th for Feburary ), the date hands swings back to 1st in one swift motion. This might sounds easy, but the mechanical ingenuity required to program such a complication is not easy as the calendar movement must determine what date the month will ends and accordingly store just sufficient energy to perform the feat.




The watch houses a tourbillon escapement as well. Typical of Patek’s design philosophy, Patek wants all watches to have a clean uncluttered dial and displaying the tourbillon in the front, while fanciful, ultimately distract from legibility. However, the Tourbillon is available for the owner’s viewing pleasure when flipped over in the Sapphire case back. The movement of the tourbillon is a sight to behold. Unique also to the higher grand complications is the Calatrava emblem at the 12 o’clock position which I think is where the balance-spring is. Goes without saying the movement is so exquisitely crafted that it’s just breath-taking to see, especially under a loupe.




Now the Minute Repeater complication. According to horological history, minute repeaters was invented for clocks and pocket watches back in those days where electrical lighting isn’t common and people need to tell the time in the dark. Of course, nowadays it’s just a fancy complication to have but the skills and technical expertise to incorporate a minute repeater mechanism into the wrist watch is by no means easy and few brands know how to do them well and make it sound good. Fortunately, Patek is one of few that can and upon activating the slide on the right hand side, the watch chimes the current time in hours, quarter hours and minutes with two gones of high and low pitch. Here’s a video of the minute repeater mechanism in action…. ( I hope it works... )




And yes, it is true. Mr Stearns personally listen to every single minute repeater himself. The watch only gets to be approved for release to the final customer if he is completely satisfied with the quality of the sound. If he isn’t, the watch will be sent back to the workshop for fine-tuning. Occasionally, Mr Stearns does not approve of the sound even after re-tuning and then the watch is then dis-assembled and re-build again from scratch. Just like music, listening to minute repeaters can be subjective and one may prefer one sound over another but while every minute repeater sounds can sound a little different, even within the same model, the richness, warmth and consistency of the chime is the defining characteristic of what all good minute repeaters share.





The Patek 5126P wears comfortably on the wrist and at first glance it has a rather elegant understated appearance and bears resemblance to some of the retrograde perpetual calendars in their product line. As an application high complication piece, it sadly commands a price that I doubt I will ever be able to afford anytime soon. Still I value the experience very much to be able to handle such a magnificent watch.


About Patek Application Pieces.

A note about so called Application Pieces from Patek that I learned during my visit. These are timepieces that are so exclusive and rare that usually they are made to order to a selected number of clienteles that wish to own it. The 5216P is one of them. When a potential customer wishes to own such a piece, it can applied for this piece ( hence the term “application pieces" ) through either the Salon directly ( if they are a Patek Salon customer ) or through their Patek authorized distributor.

Madam Marielle explained the process of acquiring an application piece to clear up some misconception. Usually, the customer has to work that thru their Point-Of-Sale ( ie POS ), which must be a Patek Salon or Patek Authorized dealer. It will be helpful if the potential customer currently owns several or many pieces of Patek watches but it is not a must. The AD has a big say on this so it certainly helps if a customer stays with a single POS consistently for their acquisition. Once the application is approved, it goes to a wait-list that can stretch for a few years on end depending on how complicated the piece is and the availability of watch makers for that particular application model.

Another key criteria is that Patek wishes all potential customers to treasure and keep the watch they bought. Patek do not like to sell their exclusive application pieces to individuals that are likely to resell the watch in a short time either for a quick profit or because they got bored with it easily ( Sorry Flippers! ). If this happened, and there isn’t a good reason to do so, the customer can be subsequently “black-listed” from being able to acquire future application pieces. Apparently this has happened on a regular basis from time to time from what I was told.

Next up, an even more grander Grand Complication and my #1 favourite of all the watches I previewed so far! So stay tuned!

To Be Continued!

One of these just popped up pre-owned at a local AD. Stunning piece.. stumbled upon this thread while looking for information on it.

Anyone know what the original retail was on a 5216p?

[Marciano490]

Local to NYC? Mind shooting me a PM to tell me where? Thanks!

[rfatm3f]

Originally Posted by Marciano490

Local to NYC? Mind shooting me a PM to tell me where? Thanks!

Not in NYC, but not too far. I'll send you a PM.

[xIZeitgeistIx]

Stupid question:
Any chance that rare models like 5711, 5712 be purchased in the Geneva boutique?

[goog53]

Originally Posted by xIZeitgeistIx

Stupid question:
Any chance that rare models like 5711, 5712 be purchased in the Geneva boutique?

Not a stupid question at all BUT unfortunately no chance of these being readily available. Best bet as many have said is to just get on a list with an AD you trust and wait. Putting money down before always helps.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by goog53

Not a stupid question at all BUT unfortunately no chance of these being readily available. Best bet as many have said is to just get on a list with an AD you trust and wait. Putting money down before always helps.

they do have all the models for display purposes there though so you can try them on and actually see one, i swear i heard that somewhere. Or was i misinformed as i haven't been to the Geneva salon before?

[benlee]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

they do have all the models for display purposes there though so you can try them on and actually see one, i swear i heard that somewhere. Or was i misinformed as i haven't been to the Geneva salon before?

This is correct. But only current production models. From simple Calatrava all the way to Grand Complication ( excluding Skymoon ).

[lapince]

Wow a new blast from the past, but a cool one

[lapince]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

they do have all the models for display purposes there though so you can try them on and actually see one, i swear i heard that somewhere. Or was i misinformed as i haven't been to the Geneva salon before?

Yes but, as far as I know non working models, read that fact a few times already here

[benlee]

Originally Posted by lapince

Yes but, as far as I know non working models, read that fact a few times already here

They are working models. The Sales Director at that time demonstrated their minute repeaters to me. ( video included in this thread ).

[Vaxe]

Great read!