Patek Philippe cashing out ??? Richemont/LVMH on high alert ?

[msolace]

Patek Philippe cashing out ?
This just in: Bloomberg reporting a sale offer might be lurking from the Patek Philippe camp.
A sign of the times?? Are we at the end of the boom cycle in the horological world?
If this is true, then my prediction is right: King Rolex will reign supreme in the watch arena.
Sad, sad news.. as we're seeing one of the last bastions of independent watchmakers succumbing to the will of yet another all-too-powerful conglomerate.
What do you think?

Bloomberg: Patek Philippe may come up for sale

[GK-]

There is another topic on this already on the forums with an active discussion.

[SDDS]

Wow that will be really bad news for collectors


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Russell996]

Don't buy into the rumour mill.

[msolace]

Originally Posted by Russell996

Don't buy into the rumour mill.

Bloomberg running around spreading rumors? What are the odds?

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by Russell996

Don't buy into the rumour mill.

there is some level of truth to most rumors. Why its being floated and to what end is anyones guess. Not saying they are selling but Patek has floated the possibility before. Something about when they built the new factory that it would ensure their independence for 20 years or something. Im paraphrasing but the fact they even said that, was a hint and that was a few years ago

[tom2517]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

there is some level of truth to most rumors. Why its being floated and to what end is anyones guess. Not saying they are selling but Patek has floated the possibility before. Something about when they built the new factory that it would ensure their independence for 20 years or something. Im paraphrasing but the fact they even said that, was a hint and that was a few years ago

James Dowling adding fuel to the fire...

misterrolex
BREAKING NEWS.....My understanding is that there are problems in the Stern family camp, and this may well be the reason that a sale is being discussed now. The statement by the Patek spokesperson that “deal speculation usually occurs during the annual watch fairs” might be correct. However, in the 20+ years that I have been attending them, this speculation has never previously involved Patek. Whilst some weight is being given to the possibility of either LMVH or Richemont making a bid, my bet is on the very dark horse of Hermès, who share a very similar philosophy of luxury regardless of cost. But, as they say, “fasten your seatbelts, it’s going to be a bumpy ride”. THIS WILL BE UPDATED WHENEVER I HEAR ANYTHING OF INTEREST

[Passionata]

"always look on the bright side"
the preR ,preL or preH models will be more valuable .


btw what camp JD is talking ?TS has a wife and two kids AFAIK what kind of problems floating around ?I d rather think (if really a problem around) that may the inventory reached a level what requires a serious funding.
would love to c their balance sheet

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by Passionata

"always look on the bright side"
the preR ,preL or preH models will be more valuable .


btw what camp JD is talking ?TS has a wife and two kids AFAIK what kind of problems floating around ?I d rather think (if really a problem around) that may the inventory reached a level what requires a serious funding.
would love to c their balance sheet

divorce is expensive, if that speculation is true that would be my bet.... or some family member minority shareholder wants more money

[tom2517]

Originally Posted by Passionata

"always look on the bright side"
the preR ,preL or preH models will be more valuable .


btw what camp JD is talking ?TS has a wife and two kids AFAIK what kind of problems floating around ?I d rather think (if really a problem around) that may the inventory reached a level what requires a serious funding.
would love to c their balance sheet

But is TS the sole beneficiary/heir of Philippe Stern? I don’t know the Henry Stern family tree so I am just guessing, all I know is Henry Stern > Philippe Stern > Thierry Stern, and they ran the company, but there might be other siblings or family members involved.

TS has two kids but I remember from somewhere Philippe Stern said he has four grandsons, so that meant two other kids is not from TS. Does TS have a brother or sister?

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

divorce is expensive, if that speculation is true that would be my bet.... or some family member minority shareholder wants more money

agree,life writes the most interesting scriptsbut i m sure sabrine signed a contract prior their marriage

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

divorce is expensive, if that speculation is true that would be my bet.... or some family member minority shareholder wants more money

Patek Philippe is, of course, atop everyone’s list of successful independent watch firms and is thus a luscious takeover target. On the subject of whether the family would ever sell the company, Stern recalls that when he built the new manufacture in Plan-les-Ouates in 1996, there were rumors that he wanted to sell the firm. The talk was that he opened the new factory to fatten the asking price. “Once in a while, you always have some smart people saying, ‘Well, Patek is not going to remain a family business, it’s going to be sold for I don’t know how many billions.’” (“I am asking for 20,” Thierry whispers in an aside, teasing his father.) But both Sterns make it clear that a sale is unthinkable. “It’s part of your family, really,” Philippe Stern says, “and if you sell it, you would feel completely alone.”

https://www.watchtime.com/featured/f...hilippe-stern/

[GreenLantern]

The article itself says it is rumors heard in hallways randomly.

I expected more from Bloomberg. Rumors are what sink ships. (Just watch Wall Street or Wall Street: Money Never Sleeps if you want simple examples.)

[onnomon]

Originally Posted by msolace

If this is true, then my prediction is right: King Rolex will reign supreme in the watch arena.

If Rolex bought Patek, Rolex would move from King to....God...or something like Zuul, the Gatekeeper of Gozer.

Question: If Rolex bought Patek, would you consider a future Patek purchase?

[AAP8]

Originally Posted by onnomon

If Rolex bought Patek, Rolex would move from King to....God...or something like Zuul, the Gatekeeper of Gozer.

Question: If Rolex bought Patek, would you consider a future Patek purchase?

I would - I think the 2 companies have a very similar mindset - they focus on what they are good at and just choose not to chase trends, but create them.

[enjoythemusic]

Have not bought any Pateks in many years, never planned to again. This could be a reeeeeally good thing for Patek if the new owners do it right.

[starship33]

Originally Posted by tom2517

But is TS the sole beneficiary/heir of Philippe Stern? I don’t know the Henry Stern family tree so I am just guessing, all I know is Henry Stern > Philippe Stern > Thierry Stern, and they ran the company, but there might be other siblings or family members involved.

TS has two kids but I remember from somewhere Philippe Stern said he has four grandsons, so that meant two other kids is not from TS. Does TS have a brother or sister?

Thierry has an older sister.

[msolace]

My guess is they're struggling financially.. for the simple fact they have very strict production limits in that they would only make sports (eg. Nautilus, Aquanaut) models up to a maximum of 20% of all watches produced (read this somewhere). This inevitably constricts their income potential. Their neighbor, whose grass looks somewhat greener on the other side, Rolex isn't bound by the same restrictions. Being overly philosophical about your work is one thing, being hugely profitable is another. Moreover, have you guys looked at Lange lately? Their Datograph lines (Flyback, Perpetual) are nothing short of amazing. I wouldn't be the least surprised if they took a chunk out of Patek's market share, to be honest. And.. Rolex churning out their steel sports models at record pace isn't helping either (yes, there's still a shortage regardless, I know). Rumor or not, well you know what they say "Where there's smoke, there's fire."

[Calatrava r]

If the Company sells, products produced by the new company will not have the aftermarket value in the market place as people will just see yet another conglomerate watch company operating a unit under a brand name with several other units. No real cache there. Conglomerates have not been good for the watch brands. Most of the brands which are really struggling were bought up and combined under one roof. Richemont bought back millions of dollars of inventory and destroyed it.

I would not be a seller of PP watches at this point as they are pre-sale pieces, if the company is sold, and will command a premium as do the pre-sale Lange watches.

[ts3]

It would likely protect the brand if they were to sell to a top non-watch luxury player such as Hermes (or less likely Chanel) than to one of the watch conglomerates or even Rolex.

[Calatrava r]

Didn't they just build a large new factory which had to have cost an incredible amount of money when they should have seen the slowdown in the luxury PM strap watch market which was coming straight at them like a freight train. At the time I heard of the construction, I thought it was terrible timing and would be a financial disaster.

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by msolace

Moreover, have you guys looked at Lange lately? Their Datograph lines (Flyback, Perpetual) are nothing short of amazing. I wouldn't be the least surprised if they took a chunk out of Patek's market share, to be honest. And.. Rolex churning out their steel sports models at record pace isn't helping either (yes, there's still a shortage regardless, I know). Rumor or not, well you know what they say "Where there's smoke, there's fire."

have you checked ALS on the econdary market , a Dato for eur34ish , realy appreciate the brand but buy it one time and yours forever :-)

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

Didn't they just build a large new factory which had to have cost an incredible amount of money when they should have seen the slowdown in the luxury PM strap watch market which was coming straight at them like a freight train. At the time I heard of the construction, I thought it was terrible timing and would be a financial disaster.

moving the production under one roof in most cases very cost effective , building a factory when basically the money is for free also not a very bad idea , having a large inventory w/o any chance to move it quick that s baaaaaaaad....

[MILGAUSS88]

So if Parek sells out, and the new company cranks up production of Nautilus's using the same movement and case, the value of the old ones are going to go up?

I don't think so.
Maybe if they switched movements, but I would say that's a big if.

[RussW]

Originally Posted by tom2517

James Dowling adding fuel to the fire...

misterrolex
BREAKING NEWS.....My understanding is that there are problems in the Stern family camp, and this may well be the reason that a sale is being discussed now. The statement by the Patek spokesperson that “deal speculation usually occurs during the annual watch fairs” might be correct. However, in the 20+ years that I have been attending them, this speculation has never previously involved Patek. Whilst some weight is being given to the possibility of either LMVH or Richemont making a bid, my bet is on the very dark horse of Hermès, who share a very similar philosophy of luxury regardless of cost. But, as they say, “fasten your seatbelts, it’s going to be a bumpy ride”. THIS WILL BE UPDATED WHENEVER I HEAR ANYTHING OF INTEREST

If James is saying this, this rumour is a lot more credible.

[JR16]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by MILGAUSS88

So if Parek sells out, and the new company cranks up production of Nautilus's using the same movement and case, the value of the old ones are going to go up?

I don't think so.
Maybe if they switched movements, but I would say that's a big if.

in a Word where the top of the figure 4(flat four)on the bezel change the price of an otherwise totally identical watch with thousands or ten thousands , i m sure a preConglomrate piece will fetch totally different asking price then the newer ones.

[ts3]

Originally Posted by MILGAUSS88

So if Parek sells out, and the new company cranks up production of Nautilus's using the same movement and case, the value of the old ones are going to go up?

I don't think so.
Maybe if they switched movements, but I would say that's a big if.

+1

If a potential buyer were to crank up the Nautilus production it would IMHO not only damage the secondary market for the current models but over time also the primary market. Few people will pay 30+k for a new SS Nautilus if everybody can walk into the AD and just pick it up.

Tricky game which we hopefully won't see at all!

[onnomon]

and then there are the "Geneva $eal $eries"

[SMD]

My guess, if true it's because they are having financial difficulties. Ergo I would speculate on a PE acquisition, 5 years of painful financial medicine and then back on the market for a new owner. Not sure any large public company wants to take a huge flyer on this right now given the volatility in the market and the perceived slowing down of the global economy.

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by Russell996

Don't buy into the rumour mill.

This rumour is now on Bloomberg and Hodinkee. If there is no intent to sell at all, Thierry would be the first one to refute these rumours, given what this brand means to him?

I'm thinking this might be one approach for a private company like his to drum up interest to spark a bidding war?