Pp 5968a

[danestaff]

If you were lucky enough would u flip this so quickly

https://www.watchfinder.co.uk/Patek%...31/item/122399

Discuss

[GB-man]

Lets not and say we did.

[RussW]

I wouldn’t buy to flip - too damaging to your relationship with your AD.

[V25V]

Someone had one for sale in FS section here with a very hefty premium, so clearly people are doing it.

[danestaff]

I'm due one from my ad, and I wouldn't personally do it, as u wont get another high end pp for a good few years

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by danestaff

I'm due one from my ad, and I wouldn't personally do it, as u wont get another high end pp for a good few years

its the low end ones you want to get anyway

The 5968 is still more or less in that area

[danestaff]

maybe i shouldn't have said high end , but im sure u get my drift

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by danestaff

maybe i shouldn't have said high end , but im sure u get my drift

yeah... i was commenting on the irony of what Pateks they will cut you off from

[vladamir15]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

yeah... i was commenting on the irony of what Pateks they will cut you off from

How would they find out?

[AK797]

What a monster price, orange is the new crack.

[Tsfc]

These are so cool, really like them!

[Sam Philip]

Originally Posted by vladamir15

How would they find out?

The AD registers the watch with Patek with the original owners details. If the new owner (the one who purchase it from Watchfinder) registers the watch with Patek they would find out that the watch had been sold buy the original owner.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by Sam Philip

The AD registers the watch with Patek with the original owners details. If the new owner (the one who purchase it from Watchfinder) registers the watch with Patek they would find out that the watch had been sold buy the original owner.

This would assume PP actually cares enough, I suspect they do not. But the consensus these days is to say and believe they do. I'm not really buying it however.


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[Oryx]

Originally Posted by V25V

This would assume PP actually cares enough, I suspect they do not. But the consensus these days is to say and believe they do. I'm not really buying it however.


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Patek do care. They are quite obsessive about this especially where the watch is new and in very high demand

[V25V]

Originally Posted by oryx

patek do care. They are quite obsessive about this especially where the watch is new and in very high demand

ok.

[remz07twos]

Originally Posted by V25V

This would assume PP actually cares enough, I suspect they do not. But the consensus these days is to say and believe they do. I'm not really buying it however.


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I sold PP for a few years and have had several clients be bounced by PP when inquiring about purchasing pieces. They care A LOT. Even if you flipped an aquanaut 3 years ago, they’d say no to anything today.

[Sam Philip]

Originally Posted by remz07twos

I sold PP for a few years and have had several clients be bounced by PP when inquiring about purchasing pieces. They care A LOT. Even if you flipped an aquanaut 3 years ago, they’d say no to anything today.

I am aware of some one who flipped a 5575G and a 5131R relatively soon after obtaining the watches and he still gets special pieces from Patek.

[remz07twos]

Originally Posted by Sam Philip

I am aware of some one who flipped a 5575G and a 5131R relatively soon after obtaining the watches and he still gets special pieces from Patek.

And I’m aware of someone who flipped a TCO stamped 5167 and was turned down to buy anything else. Or a client who wanted to buy a 6 figure piece who I was told to pass on as well. Some people get away with it. Some don’t. PP looks. And PP cares. It depends who you flip to and how you do it.

But thanks for letting me know it’s not like it was literally my job.

[tchaic]

I’ll chime in and agree they definitely care. I for one appreciate it. Gives me a chance at some cool pieces!

[V25V]

Originally Posted by remz07twos

I sold PP for a few years and have had several clients be bounced by PP when inquiring about purchasing pieces. They care A LOT. Even if you flipped an aquanaut 3 years ago, they’d say no to anything today.

Edit: Misread your 3 year part.

Gray dealers keep ending up with desirable models. So what you are saying is they are getting them from first time buyers who want to make a little money and be done with PP since they could never buy again. Or they buy from repeat buyers who have access to these models who seem to still be able to get them over and over (does not fit your theory). Or they get them direct from AD's somehow over and over? And this just continues with PP knowing about it and supposedly caring so much? Sorry, not buying it.


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[WatchLurv]

Originally Posted by V25V

Edit: Misread your 3 year part.

Gray dealers keep ending up with desirable models. So what you are saying is they are getting them from first time buyers who want to make a little money and be done with PP since they could never buy again. Or they buy from repeat buyers who have access to these models who seem to still be able to get them over and over (does not fit your theory). Or they get them direct from AD's somehow over and over? And this just continues with PP knowing about it and supposedly caring so much? Sorry, not buying it.


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Grey dealers obviously got the plugs. Grey dealers just didnt have someone walk into their store and offer the 5968 just like "that"

[V25V]

Originally Posted by WatchLurv

Grey dealers obviously got the plugs. Grey dealers just didnt have someone walk into their store and offer the 5968 just like "that"

Ok, so how do they get it? If poster I quoted is correct and a grey acquires one and sells it, wouldn't they then be black balled? Or if they bought from a reputable buyer, wouldn't that buyer then be black balled? So they either have a bench of people they cycle through who get these pieces (which are supposedly only available to buyers with "relationships"), they have a crap ton of one off buyers who don't give a crap and manage to get the hard to get pieces with no care for buying more (since they would supposedly be black balled after), or the greys themselves have a line to PP. No matter what you pick there, PP really giving a crap doesn't add up.


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[WatchLurv]

Originally Posted by V25V

Ok, so how do they get it? If poster I quoted is correct and a grey acquires one and sells it, wouldn't they then be black balled? Or if they bought from a reputable buyer, wouldn't that buyer then be black balled? So they either have a bench of people they cycle through who get these pieces (which are supposedly only available to buyers with "relationships"), they have a crap ton of one off buyers who don't give a crap and manage to get the hard to get pieces with no care for buying more (since they would supposedly be black balled after), or the greys themselves have a line to PP. No matter what you pick there, PP really giving a crap doesn't add up.


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-Put a different name down on the warranty. Does Patek require photo ID of the guy who puts his name down on the warranty? Nope.
-Grey dealer has shopped there and picked up dead Patek pieces.

No AD will give up the grey dealer...It's a cornerstone of their business. Mr Smith isn't going to pick up all the left over stock that sits in the store for an extended amount of time. Mr Smith only wants a 5968, 5711 and 5712 (all steel)... Mr Smith can get in line like everyone else and wait for the next 10 years. Business first, relationship after.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by WatchLurv

-Put a different name down on the warranty. Does Patek require photo ID of the guy who puts his name down on the warranty? Nope.

-Grey dealer has shopped there and picked up dead Patek pieces.



No AD will give up the grey dealer...It's a cornerstone of their business. Mr Smith isn't going to pick up all the left over stock that sits in the store for an extended amount of time. Mr Smith only wants a 5968, 5711 and 5712 (all steel)... Mr Smith can get in line like everyone else and wait for the next 10 years. Business first, relationship after.

So you are saying bad AD's are to blame for selling to greys so they can get rid of inventory? These AD's have a bank of fictitious buyers (one grey dealer) with the same legit credit card (and receipts) and if PP really cared, they couldn't audit those transactions? Again, if they really wanted to stop it, I think they could. They may care but not enough to make it stop.


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[WatchLurv]

Originally Posted by V25V

So you are saying bad AD's are to blame for selling to greys so they can get rid of inventory? These AD's have a bank of fictitious buyers (one grey dealer) with the same legit credit card (and receipts) and if PP really cared, they couldn't audit those transactions? Again, if they really wanted to stop it, I think they could. They may care but not enough to make it stop.


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I wouldn't call them bad ADs...They're in this business to make a living, and Mr Smith isn't buying some dead piece that's been in the window for the past 24 months. The grey dealer will. You can't just keep a shop open by only selling your 2 nautilus and 2 aquanauts a year.

If PP puts a "gun" to their head and tell them to open their books or risk losing their license, I'm sure you can get forensic accountants to trace the money back to the origins. It depends how cunning the ADs are... Do they receive bankwires, cash, CC etc. and how do you prove that Mr X who purchased 3 watches in one day is a grey dealer? The point is, it is more effort and costly to do a witchhunt than to just "mind your own business" of who the AD sells to.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by WatchLurv

I wouldn't call them bad ADs...They're in this business to make a living, and Mr Smith isn't buying some dead piece that's been in the window for the past 24 months. The grey dealer will. You can't just keep a shop open by only selling your 2 nautilus and 2 aquanauts a year.

If PP puts a "gun" to their head and tell them to open their books or risk losing their license, I'm sure you can get forensic accountants to trace the money back to the origins. It depends how cunning the ADs are... Do they receive bankwires, cash, CC etc. and how do you prove that Mr X who purchased 3 watches in one day is a grey dealer? The point is, it is more effort and costly to do a witchhunt than to just "mind your own business" of who the AD sells to.

To be clear, I have no beef at all with greys or how it works, I get it. I am just disagreeing with the poster above and the general idea that PP (or others) really care that much about all of this.

If I'm PP/AP/Rolex, I'm loving this climate right now and I'll keep up the facade that I care about the sales process but I'm not gonna go out of my way either to screw over those who are moving my product. I just don't think they really care as much as some here wish to believe. Again, I get it.


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[WatchLurv]

Originally Posted by V25V

To be clear, I have no beef at all with greys or how it works, I get it. I am just disagreeing with the poster above and the general idea that PP (or others) really care that much about all of this.

If I'm PP/AP/Rolex, I'm loving this climate right now and I'll keep up the facade that I care about the sales process but I'm not gonna go out of my way either to screw over those who are moving my product. I just don't think they really care as much as some here wish to believe. Again, I get it.


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PP and Rolex seem to care less. AP is trying to setup a secondary market where theyll buy back their own watches ...wont work out. You need greys to do the same numbers they get in. It works in a cycle...if greys are eliminated, their numbers wouldnt hit nearly the same.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by WatchLurv

PP and Rolex seem to care less. AP is trying to setup a secondary market where theyll buy back their own watches ...wont work out. You need greys to do the same numbers they get in. It works in a cycle...if greys are eliminated, their numbers wouldnt hit nearly the same.

Not sure AP's intention is necessarily to cut out the secondary market to care about their customers. They will also make money on that, along with their no AD model they seem to be moving towards. Brilliant move to be honest, while the market is hot, will be interesting to see how that plays out.


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[WatchLurv]

Originally Posted by V25V

Not sure AP's intention is necessarily to cut out the secondary market to care about their customers. They will also make money on that, along with their no AD model they seem to be moving towards. Brilliant move to be honest, while the market is hot, will be interesting to see how that plays out.


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By the speed theyre doing, theyll have less shops than Patek. They're not RM, so not sure why they're moving towards this sort of market when they have models in the "lower range"

[kneedeep]

Doubt they have enough resources to audit AD sales effectively. PP don’t have enough watchmakers to provide reasonable service times for repairs, so which army of theirs is going to be charged with stopping the flipping of their hot watches? And I cannot believe PP will punish a major buyer/collector for flipping a watch. And I’m a PP fan, albeit with a suspicious mind.