Old Speedy (1863) vs New (3861)

[GSolo]

So I went to my local AD today, just to check in and strike up a friendly conversation and of course look at some watches.

At some point in the conversation the SA pulled out the new speedmaster and the old one, I'm intrigued to purchase either but I find it hard to make up my mind.

The pros of the old one is primarily legacy and the fact that it's a bit cheaper, also I like the old bracelet a lot more than the new tapered one (even though I'm probably the only one who thinks that )

Pros of the 3861 is the updated co-axial movement, metas and hacking seconds.

If it was just a matter of the bracelet I'd pick the old one any day, but the movement geek in me is gravitating towards the 3861... Of course I could find another bracelet or strap but given I primarily wear all my watches on bracelets I cant justify putting on a 3rd party bracelet :p ...


I don't really care for the "buy the 1863" and hope it goes up in price, maybe it will, maybe it wont, it's going to be discontinued but there's still plenty for sale here and there..

How do you guys handle dilemmas like these?

[Wahlberg]

Sounds like you already made up your mind, go for the old one. You prefer this bracelet and the price is better.

The new one has some issues with the movement but those will likely be solved within now and a couple of months.

[ap1]

I think you missed the main pro on the new one, that dial. New for me

[Soarer]

I handled it by sticking with my older classic one, 3570.50 (1861).


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[gnuyork]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

Sounds like you already made up your mind, go for the old one. You prefer this bracelet and the price is better.

The new one has some issues with the movement but those will likely be solved within now and a couple of months.

This is not the first time I have head this, can you point to a source? It seems like this is something that could be parroted or overblown (not saying it is). I have had the 3861 since January with zero issues, and the accuracy is near or better than quartz on mine.

[texasmade]

Originally Posted by gnuyork

This is not the first time I have head this, can you point to a source? It seems like this is something that could be parroted or overblown (not saying it is). I have had the 3861 since January with zero issues, and the accuracy is near or better than quartz on mine.

There's a long thread about this on omegaforums along with the technical bulletins Omega issued to have this corrected.

[gnuyork]

Originally Posted by texasmade

There's a long thread about this on omegaforums along with the technical bulletins Omega issued to have this corrected.

Right, I think I came across that, but if I recall it wasn't these new moon watches, wasn't it the early Apollo 11 watches that exhibited issues?

[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by gnuyork

Right, I think I came across that, but if I recall it wasn't these new moon watches, wasn't it the early Apollo 11 watches that exhibited issues?

It was the regular/new speedmaster professional.

Omega has made a modification to the 3861 movement by changing a bushing in the movement to a replacement made of a different material, and has also altered the recommended oiling procedure to remedy the issue. Within a short period of time all new 3861 movements should have that change implemented from the factory and any that do have issues should be covered under warranty and will likely be upgraded at the time of their first service.

https://omegaforums.net/threads/3861...t-post.120071/

[AEC]

Originally Posted by Soarer

I handled it by sticking with my older classic one, 3570.50 (1861).


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This is what I'm doing for now, too.

At some point I'll probably pick up a new Speedmaster Pro and keep both until I know my preference.

Also, my 3570.50 just happens to operate really nicely; winds smoothly, chrono operates crisply, and it keeps great time. I'm reluctant to let go of such a prime example.

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by GSolo

So I went to my local AD today, just to check in and strike up a friendly conversation and of course look at some watches.

At some point in the conversation the SA pulled out the new speedmaster and the old one, I'm intrigued to purchase either but I find it hard to make up my mind.

The pros of the old one is primarily legacy and the fact that it's a bit cheaper, also I like the old bracelet a lot more than the new tapered one (even though I'm probably the only one who thinks that )

Pros of the 3861 is the updated co-axial movement, metas and hacking seconds.

If it was just a matter of the bracelet I'd pick the old one any day, but the movement geek in me is gravitating towards the 3861... Of course I could find another bracelet or strap but given I primarily wear all my watches on bracelets I cant justify putting on a 3rd party bracelet :p ...


I don't really care for the "buy the 1863" and hope it goes up in price, maybe it will, maybe it wont, it's going to be discontinued but there's still plenty for sale here and there..

How do you guys handle dilemmas like these?

I had the 1861 and foolishy sold it years ago.

I recently went through the same expeirence.

I bought the 3861, the improvements to the movement and the bracelet were brilliant and I am very pleased.

I buy to wear so I cannot help you with other questions, this was a great add back to my collection and in fact this is the first watch I have ever sold and then rebought

[stratguy]

A few months ago, I did the exact same thing. In the end, I bought the old version because to my eyes, it has a better lug design and I like the dial better. I wear it only on a strap so the bracelet was not a factor. This watch has become my daily and I don't wear any of my Rolex watches anymore.

Good luck

[ommmjido]

The bracelet is one of the main upgrades on the new moon watch. If you prefer the old bracelet then I don’t see much point getting it.

[htc8p]

the new speedmaster 3861 looks to vintage for my tastes.

i chose to buy the 1863 before it got discontinued.

while the new movement is a good upgrade, the old one is well established and looks better

[1William]

I own both the 3861 on the bracelet and the 1861 on bracelet. Both are great watches and fun to wear. I have the 1861 on aftermarket straps and bracelets. The timing is fine on the 1861 but is perfect on the 3861 and the new dial and bracelet make it worth the price of admission. If I had to choose it would be the 3861 all day long and twice on Sunday. Not because the 1861 is deficient in any way but the improvements, especially the movement, are that significant for me. No wrong answer for you as both are great but if you are a movement and accuracy person the 3861 is the answer. Good luck and let us know what you decide.

[GSolo]

So I ended up settling on the 1863 and I do not regret it it's a beautiful piece and I'm already bonding with it haha.

Sometime in the future I might have to get the 3861 as well but we'll see :D

[Mjbull23]

Can’t go wrong with either! Nice pickup!


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[DD58]

Originally Posted by AEC

This is what I'm doing for now, too.

At some point I'll probably pick up a new Speedmaster Pro and keep both until I know my preference.

Also, my 3570.50 just happens to operate really nicely; winds smoothly, chrono operates crisply, and it keeps great time. I'm reluctant to let go of such a prime example.

What strap do you have on the speedy? I’m going to have to steal your idea!!!! Looks epic


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[train-time]

Originally Posted by AEC

This is what I'm doing for now, too.

At some point I'll probably pick up a new Speedmaster Pro and keep both until I know my preference.

Also, my 3570.50 just happens to operate really nicely; winds smoothly, chrono operates crisply, and it keeps great time. I'm reluctant to let go of such a prime example.

Love this picture Tony! It makes me miss the 1863 on a croco strap that I had and sold. Maybe it's time to find another one.

[AEC]

Originally Posted by DD58

What strap do you have on the speedy? I’m going to have to steal your idea!!!! Looks epic


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These are the strap and clasp that were original equipment on the previous generation Speedmaster Pro. The strap is black alligator and it's soft and comfy, and it's the one that tapers to 16mm at the clasp.

I'll see if I can find part numbers for the strap and clasp, but I can confirm these are the components that came standard on (discontinued) reference number 311.33.42.30.01.001

https://www.omegawatches.com/en-us/w...31133423001001

[Av8or3]

Originally Posted by GSolo

So I went to my local AD today, just to check in and strike up a friendly conversation and of course look at some watches.

At some point in the conversation the SA pulled out the new speedmaster and the old one, I'm intrigued to purchase either but I find it hard to make up my mind.

The pros of the old one is primarily legacy and the fact that it's a bit cheaper, also I like the old bracelet a lot more than the new tapered one (even though I'm probably the only one who thinks that )

Pros of the 3861 is the updated co-axial movement, metas and hacking seconds.

If it was just a matter of the bracelet I'd pick the old one any day, but the movement geek in me is gravitating towards the 3861... Of course I could find another bracelet or strap but given I primarily wear all my watches on bracelets I cant justify putting on a 3rd party bracelet :p ...


I don't really care for the "buy the 1863" and hope it goes up in price, maybe it will, maybe it wont, it's going to be discontinued but there's still plenty for sale here and there..

How do you guys handle dilemmas like these?

You and I might be in the minority when it comes to the bracelet. I tried it on while I was on a trip in Switzerland and wasn't a fan. Didn't feel as substantial as the bracelet on my 1863. I felt like it was lighter than what I'm used to and the clasp felt too dainty. I also prefer the dial on the previous generation. I will admit, I'm a fan of the new movement in the 3861, especially the ability to hack. I have a Seamster with the co-axial escapement and enjoy it's incredible accuracy. My 1863 gains roughly 5-6/day. Congratulations on the new piece, wear it in good health!

[nm4710]

The 1861 had become a classic. The 3861 is a cool watch but no longer a classic - too many new features and unnecessary details that just don’t jive with the speedmaster no-frills ethos IMO. The new bracelet is more comfortable but is so light it feels kind of cheap IMO. In 10-15 years I might change my tune and embrace the 3861. By that time the speedmaster will probably have an OLED display, Bluetooth tracking, and solar power.

N

[gnuyork]

Originally Posted by nm4710

The 1861 had become a classic. The 3861 is a cool watch but no longer a classic - too many new features and unnecessary details that just don’t jive with the speedmaster no-frills ethos IMO. The new bracelet is more comfortable but is so light it feels kind of cheap IMO. In 10-15 years I might change my tune and embrace the 3861. By that time the speedmaster will probably have an OLED display, Bluetooth tracking, and solar power.

N

too many "new features unnecessary details" like a new movement?

[AlTinkster92]

Still happy with my ole 861 movement, :)

[AdamW]

Still in love with my 1861! Can't ever see wanting to change. It works just fine and is and will forever be a classic!

[7enderbender]

I’m desperately hoping to still find a brand new 1861 early next year at a reasonable price. I compared old vs new and very much disliked the new one. The band looks and feels cheap, the dial color is too dark for my taste, don’t like the stepped dial, don’t like that it’s so far not used by NASA and accordingly has the new legaleese wording on the back.
The new movement is probably technically better but that’s not why I want a Speedmaster of that kind of caliber (I still have my 1989 Speedy reduced which is extremely accurate and beats my Rolex in that regard). The cheapened out on the new packaging and case candy also.

[gnuyork]

Originally Posted by 7enderbender

don’t like that it’s so far not used by NASA

I always find this argument peculiar. The watch is so new. Of course it hasn't been used yet. Who's to say that it won't be used in the future?

[logo]

Originally Posted by gnuyork

I always find this argument peculiar. The watch is so new. Of course it hasn't been used yet. Who's to say that it won't be used in the future?

Realistically NASA has not used speedmasters for EVAs for a long time - best photos I’ve seen have it up to the early shuttle missions. The Russians have used the 1861 a lot - still part of their EVA wear and worn for launch/return for ANYONE launching on Soyuz, regardless of nationality. With SpaceX now launching Americans, I don’t think they have a set watch requirement, but believe I saw one of the crew 1 astronauts wearing a X33. I think Bezos must have an agreement with omega for the 3861 (Bezos is known to previously wear an 1861), as all the Blue Origin “astronauts” can be seen outfitted with a speedmaster over their suit.

Me personally, I just liked that the 861/1861 was tested by NASA themselves and was at one point part of their official gear - a piece of space history, that remains officially certified by NASA, while the 3861 is not officially certified for all manned space missions and EVA. My suspicion is that NASAs lack of use lately, and lack of certification of the 3861 indicates they have a different plan in mind for moon and Mars missions (earth time mechanical watches won’t work on mars). That said, I’m sure omega would pay an incredible amount of money to get back to the moon. I just don’t know if it’ll be a speedmaster professional, or an X33 variant.

[drjrhc]

Originally Posted by 1William

I own both the 3861 on the bracelet and the 1861 on bracelet. Both are great watches and fun to wear. I have the 1861 on aftermarket straps and bracelets. The timing is fine on the 1861 but is perfect on the 3861 and the new dial and bracelet make it worth the price of admission. If I had to choose it would be the 3861 all day long and twice on Sunday. Not because the 1861 is deficient in any way but the improvements, especially the movement, are that significant for me. No wrong answer for you as both are great but if you are a movement and accuracy person the 3861 is the answer. Good luck and let us know what you decide.

LOVE that black strap on the 1861. Care to PM me where you found that?

Thanks, and lovely pieces both!

J

[1William]

Originally Posted by drjrhc

LOVE that black strap on the 1861. Care to PM me where you found that?

Thanks, and lovely pieces both!

J

PM sent.

[Sandpit]

Originally Posted by logo

Realistically NASA has not used speedmasters for EVAs for a long time - best photos I’ve seen have it up to the early shuttle missions. The Russians have used the 1861 a lot - still part of their EVA wear and worn for launch/return for ANYONE launching on Soyuz, regardless of nationality. With SpaceX now launching Americans, I don’t think they have a set watch requirement, but believe I saw one of the crew 1 astronauts wearing a X33. I think Bezos must have an agreement with omega for the 3861 (Bezos is known to previously wear an 1861), as all the Blue Origin “astronauts” can be seen outfitted with a speedmaster over their suit.

Me personally, I just liked that the 861/1861 was tested by NASA themselves and was at one point part of their official gear - a piece of space history, that remains officially certified by NASA, while the 3861 is not officially certified for all manned space missions and EVA. My suspicion is that NASAs lack of use lately, and lack of certification of the 3861 indicates they have a different plan in mind for moon and Mars missions (earth time mechanical watches won’t work on mars). That said, I’m sure omega would pay an incredible amount of money to get back to the moon. I just don’t know if it’ll be a speedmaster professional, or an X33 variant.

My thoughts exactly on the 1861. I bought mine early last year kinda knowing there would be an update and I’m glad I went for it. It isn’t perfect and I do struggle with the OEM bracelet, however after I picked it up I ordered the black snoopy strap and deployant which are fantastic.




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