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Old 17 February 2020, 02:43 PM   #31
Acquisition40
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It seems that PP has very little control over to whom their watches are sold (with the exception of application pieces and perhaps unless the customer is black-listed). It's mostly the ADs making the decision, and since unlike AP, Patek is operating mostly on AD networks, it seems like it's not so much brand loyalty, but more so AD loyalty. ADs seem to open the door for Rolex sports models based on Patek purchase history, and it seems like the concept of loyalty is fluid across brands within an AD.

So as for Patek, I don't necessarily buy the argument that it's about "brand loyalty" as much as how much respect you have for an individual timepiece. Patek watches, especially the sports models, have always been available for purchase to anyone as long as in stock, so I don't think it suddenly became all about loyalty to Patek Philippe corporate with the Nautilus/Aquanaut popularity.

However, I do think they're trying to argue for/retain the idea of the importance of respect that people have for their watches, much like how they treat their very special application pieces. I think they acknowledge and understand that their watches can retain/increase/lose value, sharing characteristics from a range of more defined tradable commodities to more ambiguous ones like art. Yet, they don't want people to see it only as a "thing" of which value is mainly dictated by supply/demand, and especially flippers to speculate on their watches. They would rather be happy with customers that can form some sort of long(er) term bond with their watches, whether it's worn once a year or Mr. Stern's 5740-style.

I share the sentiment with many here that I think it's very unlikely that Patek will change how the watches are distributed. I honestly don't think there's a right/wrong answer, and it is the way it is, but I am curious to talk more about how they would approach this state philosophically, especially as a company that statedly values more than just profit.

For a brand like Patek, is it better if a one-time buyer of a Nautilus wears it everyday as his/her only watch (and therefore, should be given the opportunity to purchase), OR would Patek prefer it that it goes to a "loyal" collector (to reward loyalty and retain business), but it sits in a safe along with 15 other watches?

Different people enjoy their watches in different ways (whether daily wearer or safe queen), and no one can define that, but it seems like the economy of doing business is pushing this philosophy in a singular direction!

S
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Old 17 February 2020, 02:53 PM   #32
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Never have I read such unmitigated idiotic notions in all my life!
Talk about taking complete leave of ones’ senses…
I second that.

May as well not sell watches and find another business
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Old 17 February 2020, 03:03 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by chiscott_29 View Post
I think the jury is still out. Yeah it’s working now in the height of a 10 year worldwide economic expansion. I wouldn’t argue it’s not. What happens when we hit a snag? Personally, I don’t see this strategy holding at all once the economic conditions cool, or the “trend” cools (or maybe even changes). Even worse, what if both happen?

Obviously nobody knows, but who is going to buy massively inflated Complications and Grand Complications when they literally are bringing in very few new people to the brand? The entire system as it stands right now reeks of the 2008 financial crisis. Everyone is convinced that’s it’s fine and the way thing are and it’ll continue unfettered. Maybe it will, but it seems a bit of a house of cards to me.

To be clear I’m not suggesting Patek or others will fail. I just would be thinking of ways to bring new people into the brand. And nobody can say the 5212 was a solution...This just exacerbated the problem.
Well said Scott. I think you're absolutely right. This bubble will deflate. They all do. It's simply a question of how and when. The current grey situation is also unsustainable. Clearly, the Nauts/Aquas/Daytonas, etc., aren't selling for the current high prices, which I think have peaked and will come down this year. If they were, Greys would be selling them hand over fist, and we'd see larger volume turnover. We're not seeing that; we're seeing 1s and 2s selling but lots still available. This year will be an interesting one.
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Old 17 February 2020, 03:08 PM   #34
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For a brand like Patek, is it better if a one-time buyer of a Nautilus wears it everyday as his/her only watch (and therefore, should be given the opportunity to purchase), OR would Patek prefer it that it goes to a "loyal" collector (to reward loyalty and retain business), but it sits in a safe along with 15 other watches?

I think this is where the ADs are going, and they want to serve both groups.
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Old 17 February 2020, 03:18 PM   #35
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I think they do allocate fairly and recognise passion over cash. I have obtained many pieces ahead of people with significant collections and credit card power
So cool to hear!
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Old 17 February 2020, 03:37 PM   #36
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I think they do allocate fairly and recognise passion over cash. I have obtained many pieces ahead of people with significant collections and credit card power
Who is "they"? I assume you mean the AD as Patek does not control the allocation to you except for the rare pieces that require an application. So in this case, you just have a nice dealer.
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Old 17 February 2020, 04:49 PM   #37
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Maybe in USA....I am speaking about UK....many pieces that are hard to get are not allocation pieces.
May I politely ask what pieces would you consider "hard to get"?
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Old 17 February 2020, 06:23 PM   #38
cascavel
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Goes back to why did they discontinued the white dial 5711. PP is clearly not trying to make getting their hot timepieces easy. They like the scarcity and the status quo just fine.
PP discontinued the White 5711 so that everyone who passed on one in the hopes of getting a Blue 5711 would regret that decision.
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Old 18 February 2020, 12:55 AM   #39
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If you think that’s going to occur, then you’re predicting a corresponding death of social media.
How likely do you think that is, when brands have set up their own channels/account on the platforms?
Social Media, a scourge on society, may well remain forever. However, I think posts will change - as people change, as society changes.
I bet you, a time will come when posting a pic of your Rolex sat at wheel of your Bentley, flexing your tatoo-ed muscles, will be so passe, so excruciatingly embarrassing, so meaningless, people will stop doing it.
Maybe signalling status will be posts about people at their desks.
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Old 18 February 2020, 01:00 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by Murcielagoboy2 View Post

I bet you, a time will come when posting a pic of your Rolex sat at wheel of your Bentley, flexing your tatoo-ed muscles...
FYI. Before IG, and other social media sites took off...

This was already done via mediums such as TRF, TZ, TZ-UK, WUS and the likes...

Therefore, "flexing" isn't really a new phenomenon. It just became more "mainstream" due to IG, rather than a "WIS" only deal.
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Old 18 February 2020, 01:45 AM   #41
Acquisition40
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PP discontinued the White 5711 so that everyone who passed on one in the hopes of getting a Blue 5711 would regret that decision.
Sounds very passive aggressive and spiteful of Patek to do that...

S
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Old 18 February 2020, 02:33 AM   #42
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IG didn't do anything to push prices. Only thing IG has proven is that everyone wants to live a fake life except for the very few that puts their faces out there (Alec Monopoly/Dan Bilzerian and the likes who ACTUALLY do have $). The rest are still poor.
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