Flipping

[jstan9]

Originally Posted by Token74

Guys - ease off the OP, he messed up with the way the original post was written and should have made clear he got caught flipping the Daytona, but we all make mistakes. I believe his motives for the post were good, or at the very least he believed them to be good.

OP - stop blaming the masses and 'the internet' for their reaction, your initial post was poorly executed, this is on you my friend. In future, give the full context to avoid potential confusion.

I'm not sure we've yet heard the full story about what happened, and if you truly want people to consider their behaviours then giving them the full picture might help. I've read the thread and whilst their are some suggestions of what's happened from others, and some clues/hints from you, it isn't actually properly outlined.

- Who caught you and how?
- What did they do/say to you?
- What were the consequences for the AD/salesman?
- What was your response?

From my perspective, I've flipped many watches, but never 'unworn' and I've never bought with the intention of selling. I get on well with my AD and it meant I got the SD and the Daytona early on. I still have both of these watches. I wouldn't deliberately flip for a few quid, not because I think it's wrong, but because I value my AD relationship and want to make sure it stays good so that I can get new releases that I want in the future.

If others want to flip, then I wouldn't blame them.




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This is the problem. The op has plenty of time to disparage the forum but we still don’t know the full story. After all this time I think it’s been very clear that coming clean is the right path. As I said earlier, I feel like TRF is being trolled. The op’s comments and behavior are strange and don’t add up.

And, after over 100 posts, we don’t yet know what really happened.


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[pilotjim]

Originally Posted by Coop13

Stop it. Just stop. I'm speaking to those that are regular consumers like myself who are fortunate enough to have the opportunity to buy a "premium piece" aka hard-to-get piece at an AD for retail.

My advice to you if you fall into this category is to not flip the watch. Either pass, or keep.

There are unintended consequences of your decision to flip a watch. AD's could and will literally lose the Rolex line. It's happened, it will happen again, and we are responsible if we are part of this problem.

There are many, many negative outcomes that may play out as a result of flipping. For what? $5 grand? An easy $5 grand sounds nice, and while that may be on the higher end, it is possible. Looking at the big picture though, it's nothing and it's not worth it.

You're trying to guilt people about watch sales??

That's really weird.

[Chiboy]

Originally Posted by Coop13

Please explain, you believe I was trying to hide the fact I had a FS post? You HONESTLY believe that??

Originally Posted by Coop13

Once again though, I want to be clear that I 100% expected to discuss the fact I got busted. I’m 33 years old, for me to think you guys wouldn’t find my FS post is extremely naive.

This has been quite the initiation to this forum, I take full responsibility. I’ll try to provide one more post with better explanation later, to answer a post above (thanks btw for culling the sharks).

I think what you're saying is that you posted too quickly to bother mentioning the slightly material fact that you IN THE LAST WEEK indulged in the very behavior that you are now condemning. Seems like it might have been pretty relevant to the new topic you raised.

You are also saying, I guess, that since you are 33 and internet savvy, that you obviously knew that your "Daytona for sale for way more than I paid for it" post would be easily discovered by the masses here at TRF. I am curious why your FS post was deleted rather than you just leaving the thread there with a subsequent post saying, "I decided to keep it" or, "my AD busted me" or whatever. It appears that you buried your tracks as much as possible and didn't mention it in your very own thread despite it being incredibly on topic. And in fact changing the whole nature of the thread from "Don't do x" to "don't do what I did. I learned my lesson and perhaps you all can learn from my mistakes."

I'm not sure why you fail to see the not so subtle differences between the two.

[Etschell]

Originally Posted by Chiboy

I think what you're saying is that you posted too quickly to bother mentioning the slightly material fact that you IN THE LAST WEEK indulged in the very behavior that you are now condemning. Seems like it might have been pretty relevant to the new topic you raised.

You are also saying, I guess, that since you are 33 and internet savvy, that you obviously knew that your "Daytona for sale for way more than I paid for it" post would be easily discovered by the masses here at TRF. I am curious why your FS post was deleted rather than you just leaving the thread there with a subsequent post saying, "I decided to keep it" or, "my AD busted me" or whatever. It appears that you buried your tracks as much as possible and didn't mention it in your very own thread despite it being incredibly on topic. And in fact changing the whole nature of the thread from "Don't do x" to "don't do what I did. I learned my lesson and perhaps you all can learn from my mistakes."

I'm not sure why you fail to see the not so subtle differences between the two.

well he first tried to flip a platona and lost 20k on it.....

[lovetherolex]

Originally Posted by Chiboy

I think what you're saying is that you posted too quickly to bother mentioning the slightly material fact that you IN THE LAST WEEK indulged in the very behavior that you are now condemning. Seems like it might have been pretty relevant to the new topic you raised.

You are also saying, I guess, that since you are 33 and internet savvy, that you obviously knew that your "Daytona for sale for way more than I paid for it" post would be easily discovered by the masses here at TRF. I am curious why your FS post was deleted rather than you just leaving the thread there with a subsequent post saying, "I decided to keep it" or, "my AD busted me" or whatever. It appears that you buried your tracks as much as possible and didn't mention it in your very own thread despite it being incredibly on topic. And in fact changing the whole nature of the thread from "Don't do x" to "don't do what I did. I learned my lesson and perhaps you all can learn from my mistakes."

I'm not sure why you fail to see the not so subtle differences between the two.

Thank you

[Coop13]

Originally Posted by Chiboy

I think what you're saying is that you posted too quickly to bother mentioning the slightly material fact that you IN THE LAST WEEK indulged in the very behavior that you are now condemning. Seems like it might have been pretty relevant to the new topic you raised.

You are also saying, I guess, that since you are 33 and internet savvy, that you obviously knew that your "Daytona for sale for way more than I paid for it" post would be easily discovered by the masses here at TRF. I am curious why your FS post was deleted rather than you just leaving the thread there with a subsequent post saying, "I decided to keep it" or, "my AD busted me" or whatever. It appears that you buried your tracks as much as possible and didn't mention it in your very own thread despite it being incredibly on topic. And in fact changing the whole nature of the thread from "Don't do x" to "don't do what I did. I learned my lesson and perhaps you all can learn from my mistakes."

I'm not sure why you fail to see the not so subtle differences between the two.

I do in deed see the difference.

As for deleting the FS thread, after what occurred with the owner of the AD calling my cell phone and the conversation we had, I wanted to make sure I did everything in my power to correct the problem, including deleting the FS post. It would be unlikely that the FS post would have cause any problems, I simply wanted it to be gone and for the whole situation to be over and done with.
I created this post to discuss the lesson I had just learned. Once again I should have provided more detail up front. I think I’ve admitted to this fact multiple times and I’ve taken full responsibility.

[Coop13]

I got a call that a 116500LN was available. I knew it’s an awesome watch and decided I could make money if I got the watch and sold it for a profit, or I could keep the watch. After about a week I put it for sale.
Then, last Wednesday I get a voicemail from the owner of the AD, I called him back knowing what to expect and I just told him the truth from the start. He said he could lose the Rolex line and told me I could keep the watch, sell it to a friend at MSRP, or simply return it to him. I told him I’d take care of it.
When I got back home I peeled the stickers off, then the next day got the bracelet sized. While at the AD I spoke with my sales person. All I can honestly say is that this entire situation can’t possibly help her employment, and it’s my fault.
Also, I was told that a customer had seen my watch for sale and figured out it was from this AD where he was on the list. Imagine how he would have felt! What would a customer realistically do in the future in this situation, bottom line is this hurt the customers trust in the AD, it hurt the sale person, if it got back to Rolex it could hurt the AD’s ability to get the premium pieces, and it could ultimately cause the AD to have more serious consequences from Rolex.

[rexG]

Originally Posted by Coop13

I got a call that a 116500LN was available. I knew it’s an awesome watch and decided I could make money if I got the watch and sold it for a profit, or I could keep the watch. After about a week I put it for sale.
Then, last Wednesday I get a voicemail from the owner of the AD, I called him back knowing what to expect and I just told him the truth from the start. He said he could lose the Rolex line and told me I could keep the watch, sell it to a friend at MSRP, or simply return it to him. I told him I’d take care of it.
When I got back home I peeled the stickers off, then the next day got the bracelet sized. While at the AD I spoke with my sales person. All I can honestly say is that this entire situation can’t possibly help her employment, and it’s my fault.
Also, I was told that a customer had seen my watch for sale and figured out it was from this AD where he was on the list. Imagine how he would have felt! What would a customer realistically do in the future in this situation, bottom line is this hurt the customers trust in the AD, it hurt the sale person, if it got back to Rolex it could hurt the AD’s ability to get the premium pieces, and it could ultimately cause the AD to have more serious consequences from Rolex.

Finally! So how did the AD trace the FS ad to you?? How could a customer trace a watch for sale to a particular AD? How much longer till Baselworld????

[faz]

Originally Posted by Coop13

I got a call that a 116500LN was available. I knew it’s an awesome watch and decided I could make money if I got the watch and sold it for a profit, or I could keep the watch. After about a week I put it for sale.
Then, last Wednesday I get a voicemail from the owner of the AD, I called him back knowing what to expect and I just told him the truth from the start. He said he could lose the Rolex line and told me I could keep the watch, sell it to a friend at MSRP, or simply return it to him. I told him I’d take care of it.
When I got back home I peeled the stickers off, then the next day got the bracelet sized. While at the AD I spoke with my sales person. All I can honestly say is that this entire situation can’t possibly help her employment, and it’s my fault.
Also, I was told that a customer had seen my watch for sale and figured out it was from this AD where he was on the list. Imagine how he would have felt! What would a customer realistically do in the future in this situation, bottom line is this hurt the customers trust in the AD, it hurt the sale person, if it got back to Rolex it could hurt the AD’s ability to get the premium pieces, and it could ultimately cause the AD to have more serious consequences from Rolex.

Originally Posted by Coop13

Stop it. Just stop. I'm speaking to those that are regular consumers like myself who are fortunate enough to have the opportunity to buy a "premium piece" aka hard-to-get piece at an AD for retail.

My advice to you if you fall into this category is to not flip the watch. Either pass, or keep.

There are unintended consequences of your decision to flip a watch. AD's could and will literally lose the Rolex line. It's happened, it will happen again, and we are responsible if we are part of this problem.

There are many, many negative outcomes that may play out as a result of flipping. For what? $5 grand? An easy $5 grand sounds nice, and while that may be on the higher end, it is possible. Looking at the big picture though, it's nothing and it's not worth it.

The above together would have made an awesome first post in this thread, with a large number of forum readers coming in to support your point of view and would agree wholeheartedly with your lesson learned.

Thanks for sharing your story, I for one would not flip and even discouraged a friend who while visiting Canada came across a 116500 and who was thinking about bringing to US to sell here. I kinda convinced him to let it go if he wasn't interested for himself and let the next lucky buyer to get the call.

[Token74]

Fair play OP, must have been an awkward situation. I get it.

My view on it though...

If I was the customer, I would be miffed but not upset with the AD, it's just the way it works. I want a Nautilus but can't get one because I've not earned my stripes with a PP AD. I don't like this, but it's the way it works with premium products so I accept it. I also accept there will be some PP customers who can get a Nautilus and will then flip it for a profit.

If I was the sales-person, I wouldn't care. I sold to someone I thought was genuine, nothing I can do.

If I was the AD, I got my 40% mark-up, so I'm all good.


If I was Rolex, then I'd be over the moon that people are flipping for way above Retail!! PP recently put a big price increase on the Nautilus, you think they'd have been able to do that if they weren't selling for massive premiums on the grey market??

So all should have been good.


Is there perhaps a missing piece to this jigsaw?

Did the sales-person by any chance bump you up the list because you know them?

Is this why they are in trouble and why the AD was upset? If not, this is the weirdest behaviour from an AD ever.




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[ap1]

Lol to that owner. You can either, this or that. Ah, no thanks.

I literally was one of (if not ) the first (7am basel release day 2016) to call my AD for the D5. This is in a large market where many shop here. Tons of people got theirs I suspect from my shop and posted them here and I’m still waiting (for that AD to call). I’ve since acquired both with a new AD, that apparently values me more. No way Id do that original AD any favors. I’d probably list it here for 22k and list their stamped card.. payment for my wait.

[pilotjim]

Originally Posted by rexG

Finally! So how did the AD trace the FS ad to you?? How could a customer trace a watch for sale to a particular AD? How much longer till Baselworld????

Good questions!

[Old Expat Beast]

Originally Posted by Coop13

I got a call that a 116500LN was available. I knew it’s an awesome watch and decided I could make money if I got the watch and sold it for a profit, or I could keep the watch. After about a week I put it for sale.
Then, last Wednesday I get a voicemail from the owner of the AD, I called him back knowing what to expect and I just told him the truth from the start. He said he could lose the Rolex line and told me I could keep the watch, sell it to a friend at MSRP, or simply return it to him. I told him I’d take care of it.
When I got back home I peeled the stickers off, then the next day got the bracelet sized. While at the AD I spoke with my sales person. All I can honestly say is that this entire situation can’t possibly help her employment, and it’s my fault.
Also, I was told that a customer had seen my watch for sale and figured out it was from this AD where he was on the list. Imagine how he would have felt! What would a customer realistically do in the future in this situation, bottom line is this hurt the customers trust in the AD, it hurt the sale person, if it got back to Rolex it could hurt the AD’s ability to get the premium pieces, and it could ultimately cause the AD to have more serious consequences from Rolex.

It took you till 157 posts to finally give the full story. And one that's not very believable.