Are Panerai and Rolex in the same bracket?

[hutchman]

Originally Posted by mpkRolex

In my city both Rolex ADs carry PAMs. I think that are as easily available as Rolex. I dont know why are they called exclusive. They are just out numbered multiple times by Rolex due to the popularity.

Ok, please get me any of the following current models 292, 26, 317, 311, 322, 307

[toph]

Originally Posted by hutchman

Ok, please get me any of the following current models 292, 26, 317, 311, 322, 307

[Launch Mini]

Originally Posted by mpkRolex

In my city both Rolex ADs carry PAMs. I think that are as easily available as Rolex. I dont know why are they called exclusive. They are just out numbered multiple times by Rolex due to the popularity.

Not even close.
I have been patiently waiting for a couple of Pannies to make it to my AD. I know they are coming, but while I have been waiting, numerous SS Daytona's , GMT's, All 3 Milgauses and others have been offered to me.

[dman]

Originally Posted by Launch Mini

Not even close.
I have been patiently waiting for a couple of Pannies to make it to my AD. I know they are coming, but while I have been waiting, numerous SS Daytona's , GMT's, All 3 Milgauses and others have been offered to me.

Too right! Not even close to as available.

In the same class is up to the buyer....for me Rolex isn't close, YMMV!

[JJ Irani]

Completely different brackets, guys......here ya go!!

{ROLEX}

[PANERAI]

End of story!!

[dman]

Originally Posted by JJ Irani

Completely different brackets, guys......here ya go!!

{ROLEX}

[PANERAI]

End of story!!

[Trurolexer]

Originally Posted by JJ Irani

Completely different brackets, guys......here ya go!!

{ROLEX}

[PANERAI]

End of story!!

Hear what Mr. TRF said.

[leopardprey]

AS much as I like Panerais, I would have to say they are not in the same class. Why? Because all the world over most people know of Rolex, as a high end well made watch. Most people have never heard of Panerai, out of WIS circles, and big cities. Also, Rolex has a much more solid and diverse history than Panerai, and has been associated with many military units/operations, expeditions, research, humanitarian and art endeavors. Panerai has a very small history compartively. I do not think Panerai will ever get close to the class and reputation that Rolex has, as the leader in the Watch world and in the general public's perception.

Now in terms of quality, there are some Panerai that equal or exceed that of Rolex and many other Panerais that lag behind Rolex. In terms of price, yes Panerai are roughly in the same class. But overall, even though I prefer wearing a Panerai over a Rolex for several reasons, I would say they will not get to that point that Rolex has acheived overall.

[Trurolexer]

Originally Posted by leopardprey

AS much as I like Panerais, I would have to say they are not in the same class. Why? Because all the world over most people know of Rolex, as a high end well made watch. Most people have never heard of Panerai, out of WIS circles, and big cities. Also, Rolex has a much more solid and diverse history than Panerai, and has been associated with many military units/operations, expeditions, research, humanitarian and art endeavors. Panerai has a very small history compartively. I do not think Panerai will ever get close to the class and reputation that Rolex has, as the leader in the Watch world and in the general public's perception.

Now in terms of quality, there are some Panerai that equal or exceed that of Rolex and many other Panerais that lag behind Rolex. In terms of price, yes Panerai are roughly in the same class. But overall, even though I prefer wearing a Panerai over a Rolex for several reasons, I would say they will not get to that point that Rolex has acheived overall.

Good point, Chad!!!

[argee1977]

Originally Posted by leopardprey

AS much as I like Panerais, I would have to say they are not in the same class. Why? Because all the world over most people know of Rolex, as a high end well made watch. Most people have never heard of Panerai, out of WIS circles, and big cities. Also, Rolex has a much more solid and diverse history than Panerai, and has been associated with many military units/operations, expeditions, research, humanitarian and art endeavors. Panerai has a very small history compartively. I do not think Panerai will ever get close to the class and reputation that Rolex has, as the leader in the Watch world and in the general public's perception.

Now in terms of quality, there are some Panerai that equal or exceed that of Rolex and many other Panerais that lag behind Rolex. In terms of price, yes Panerai are roughly in the same class. But overall, even though I prefer wearing a Panerai over a Rolex for several reasons, I would say they will not get to that point that Rolex has acheived overall.

No watch company can reach the public perception that Rolex have achieved, it's impossible, if you asked most people in the streets to pick their idea of a luxury watch then more than half would say Rolex, if you made them pick between Patek, VC, AP, JLC and Rolex again i'd bet Rolex would end up in the number 1 position with most not knowing what Patek, Vacheron, Audemars or Jaeger were.

I think Panerai have put themselves into a place where they want to be, a limited number produced each year and using word of mouth and a few product placements to get their sales pitch across the WIS World.

As for quality, well at this price point all watches are quality, Rolex has a workmanlike appearance with the sports watches but everything about them are quality, the finish, the movement, the way it all goes together and then the rest of the Rolex collection again shows true quality with the finish and look. Panerai again have that quality finish, they rework the movement to get what they want and make sure the complete package is as good as they can make it.

[TswaneNguni]

Originally Posted by leopardprey

AS much as I like Panerais, I would have to say they are not in the same class. Why? Because all the world over most people know of Rolex, as a high end well made watch. Most people have never heard of Panerai, out of WIS circles, and big cities. Also, Rolex has a much more solid and diverse history than Panerai, and has been associated with many military units/operations, expeditions, research, humanitarian and art endeavors. Panerai has a very small history compartively. I do not think Panerai will ever get close to the class and reputation that Rolex has, as the leader in the Watch world and in the general public's perception.

Now in terms of quality, there are some Panerai that equal or exceed that of Rolex and many other Panerais that lag behind Rolex. In terms of price, yes Panerai are roughly in the same class. But overall, even though I prefer wearing a Panerai over a Rolex for several reasons, I would say they will not get to that point that Rolex has acheived overall.

May Panerai never reach where Rolex are.

[TswaneNguni]

Originally Posted by argee1977

No watch company can reach the public perception that Rolex have achieved, it's impossible, if you asked most people in the streets to pick their idea of a luxury watch then more than half would say Rolex, if you made them pick between Patek, VC, AP, JLC and Rolex again i'd bet Rolex would end up in the number 1 position with most not knowing what Patek, Vacheron, Audemars or Jaeger were.

I think Panerai have put themselves into a place where they want to be, a limited number produced each year and using word of mouth and a few product placements to get their sales pitch across the WIS World.

As for quality, well at this price point all watches are quality, Rolex has a workmanlike appearance with the sports watches but everything about them are quality, the finish, the movement, the way it all goes together and then the rest of the Rolex collection again shows true quality with the finish and look. Panerai again have that quality finish, they rework the movement to get what they want and make sure the complete package is as good as they can make it.

Spoke to the Panerai AD.They were thinking about getting the Rolex agency.They had pro's and con's and asked my opinion....

Knowing all the Rolex ADs in the area and the Rolex market in their area well,from my Rolex days ... My opinion:

Getting Rolex to sell,means you will sell watches.
Selling Rolex doesnt give you exclusivity,because you have to compete,with +10 ADs,in the same city.
So what happens ? Its a cut throat business.All ADs "out discount" each other to a very low profit margin.So,you sell,but at low profit.
Also,by getting Rolex as a brand,to sell,you open yourself to theft/robbery.The stores thats "hit" as a rule are the Rolex ADs.Period.

Is it worth it ,considering they carry all the Richemont brands ? That was the question.They thought along the same lines as I did.

[Tony-GB]

Originally Posted by TswaneNguni

Very simple ...

Take any Rolex,place it next to a PAM ..... and the Rolex looks lost.

With respect, this statement is totally inaccurate. 40mm Yacht Master can hold it's own against 44mm Panerai & I bet the 43mm Deep Sea can as well.

[Tony-GB]

Originally Posted by Bisquitlips

The quantity made per year is astonishing in that it will take Panerai about 23 years to make what Rolex produces in 1???

I don't know how they stay in business.

Richard, Panerai are not that exclusive. They use the trick of producing a watch where they "invent" a limited series. For example, they will make a Sub model. Panerai will produce the A series in a "limited" run of 1500, then a B series in a limited run of 1500, then a C series of 1500, etc. By the time you get to a J series, that's quite a few watches. There may be some minor changes, but will basically be the same. The genuine limited editions are models like the 203 & they really are limited (150)

[toph]

Tony you are right but Panerai produce 40000 watches worldwide, i have been told by what i would see as a, very reliable source. Rolex over 1,000,000. So that seems pretty exclusive to me.

Furthmore I have been informed that there are approx 1000 new Panerai's imported for sale in the UK each year. Probably 1000 a week with rolex.

And all this is from a manager of One of the top AD chains.

[Tony-GB]

Originally Posted by toph

Tony you are right but Panerai produce 40000 watches worldwide, i have been told by what i would see as a, very reliable source. Rolex over 1,000,000. So that seems pretty exclusive to me.

Furthmore I have been informed that there are approx 1000 new Panerai's imported for sale in the UK each year. Probably 1000 a week with rolex.

And all this is from a manager of One of the top AD chains.

Hi Christopher

To me, 40,000 isn't exclusive. Ennebi produce 200 - 300 per year. I would say that is exclusive. Bonati states he want to be as good as Rolex, so you can bet your fillings if he could sell a million a year he would.

Just to be clear: I'm not knocking Panerai at all. I had one but shifted it & got another Rolex. It wasn't for me for a couple of reasons that Paneristi's openly acknowledge. But I like to keep this invented Panerai vs Rolex battle into context.

There seems to be an antagonistic thought process on a Panerai site that loves to knock Rolex, mostly based on the sales figures. But when these people are reminded that Rolex is the Mother & Father of Panerai, strangely nobody replies...

Even the little lever that keeps the crown in place is questionable by watch officianado's. Ennebi uses that same process but without the lever...

The main bugbear that comes across with Panerai fans is that Rolex aren't exclusive & they seem to be seeking a little exclusivity.

[toph]

I agree with you, I certainly am not knocking rolex at all. But Exclusive, i suppose is a matter of personal definition. Is Panerai exclusive compared to Ennebi , then no , but compared to rolex, with under 5% of the production then i would say yes.


The main bugbear that comes across with Panerai fans is that Rolex aren't exclusive & they seem to be seeking a little exclusivity.

That is probably true. Just because they say this does not mean it is true. I love rolex first and foremost but in my opinion Panerai is more exclusive by default due to production numbers (especially in the UK)

[Tony-GB]

Originally Posted by toph

I agree with you, I certainly am not knocking rolex at all. But Exclusive, i suppose is a matter of personal definition. Is Panerai exclusive compared to Ennebi , then no , but compared to rolex, with under 5% of the production then i would say yes.


The main bugbear that comes across with Panerai fans is that Rolex aren't exclusive & they seem to be seeking a little exclusivity.

That is probably true. Just because they say this does not mean it is true. I love rolex first and foremost but in my opinion Panerai is more exclusive by default due to production numbers (especially in the UK)

There's only way Panerai will ever become as reputable as Rolex- when JJ spends money on one!

[toph]

Originally Posted by Tony-GB

There's only way Panerai will ever become as reputable as Rolex- when JJ spends money on one!

that will be the day

[TswaneNguni]

Originally Posted by Tony-GB

With respect, this statement is totally inaccurate. 40mm Yacht Master can hold it's own against 44mm Panerai & I bet the 43mm Deep Sea can as well.

In a table shot the Rollies are always on the fringes, with the PAMs taking centre stage.

...as for the Deeper seas dweller ?...I say,awfully smallish dial for a larger, by Rolex standards,casing. I'm not going to say anything about the inscriptions .........

203 in this picture,unequal dial base and 195 too,127,two 249s,289,231,242,104 ... Yummy !!!

[Trurolexer]

Originally Posted by Tony-GB

With respect, this statement is totally inaccurate. 40mm Yacht Master can hold it's own against 44mm Panerai & I bet the 43mm Deep Sea can as well.

Your collection?

[Tony-GB]

Originally Posted by Trurolexer

Your collection?

I WISH!

[argee1977]

Originally Posted by Tony-GB

With respect, this statement is totally inaccurate. 40mm Yacht Master can hold it's own against 44mm Panerai & I bet the 43mm Deep Sea can as well.

Ah, i can't agree with this, i've got a 40mm PAM and a Sub LV, the PAM looks bigger and the dial is at least 2mm bigger as well, up against a 44mm PAM the 40mm Rolex models do look a bit lost. But the flip side to that is the size, a 44mm PAM makes my wrist look even smaller, so 40mm is as far as i go, and the Rolex looks good on my wrist.

[Trurolexer]

Originally Posted by Tony-GB

I WISH!

Me WISH too!!!

[brainbizz]

The reality is neither brand is "exclusive" however, certain Panerai models are definitely exclusive. A one year production run of 50, 100....500 world wide to me is exclusive. Rolex is less exclusive than Panerai and has more ADs, marketing, etc. therefore it would only seem logical that there would be a larger public perception that it is the watch to have. I also do not see where someone expects to pay a few thousand dollars for a watch that is not common. Now does it really mater? To some yes to others no. Some just want a good quality watch others want a more limited possibly collectable piece.

[Tony-GB]

Originally Posted by argee1977

Ah, i can't agree with this, i've got a 40mm PAM and a Sub LV, the PAM looks bigger and the dial is at least 2mm bigger as well, up against a 44mm PAM the 40mm Rolex models do look a bit lost. But the flip side to that is the size, a 44mm PAM makes my wrist look even smaller, so 40mm is as far as i go, and the Rolex looks good on my wrist.

Hi Ryan

Again, I have to respectfully disagree. Here are some comparison pics of my YM & ROO. The 40mm Yacht Master has great proportions and has as much presence as a 44mm ROO. This is true of all 40mm Sport Rolex's.

Apologies for the poor pics.

[Tony-GB]

Originally Posted by Trurolexer

Me WISH too!!!

[TswaneNguni]

Originally Posted by Tony-GB

Hi Ryan

Again, I have to respectfully disagree. Here are some comparison pics of my YM & ROO. The 40mm Yacht Master has great proportions and has as much presence as a 44mm ROO. This is true of all 40mm Sport Rolex's.

Apologies for the poor pics.

Look carefully.... the Rolex is on the far right >>>

[toph]

Originally Posted by TswaneNguni

Look carefully.... the Rolex is on the far right >>>

where?

[TswaneNguni]

Originally Posted by toph

where?

Loupe ?