Rolex as an Investment

[Arclight]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

Maybe good for a long-term investment, but at the moment, BNIB five-digit watches seem to be severely overpriced compared to lightly worn w/full set. I'd go lightly worn, and enjoy wearing them, and hope for a similar return, in the short, medium and long term.

I concur.

[Case61]

Originally Posted by Ckci

I'm with you. I like many on here have ample assets. I see it as an asset on the balance sheet. I like assets I can enjoy. When gas prices started going up in 2007 you could feel the gloom in the air. I sold stocks and bought 1000 acres of land. My son was interested in hunting and we could touch, feel, see, smell, and as you say enjoy it. I didn't see the value fall like I did in stocks. I do the same thing with houses. I can enjoy them and they don't loose there value. To me these watches are like that as well. To me this is big picture investing. It's a living investment. I've also done some venture capital investing and to me that's also more fun because you get to be a part of it. It has also been significantly more profitable than individual stocks. Don't knock it until you try it.
Attachment 691681

This is one of the most enjoyable posts I've ever read on TRF.

And grats to you, Seth, on your purchases.

[Girkmonster]

I think it's a great idea. Tie up your money an an illiquid item that is mass produced, doesn't earn interest or pay dividends in the hopes that you end up after an apocalypse with the only one and find someone willing to pay you more for it! Then again, if you consider the lost opportunity cost of your money, inflation and the potential for significant maintenance expense or even risk of loss then maybe it seems like a foolish "investment"

But that's me.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Girkmonster

I think it's a great idea. Tie up your money an an illiquid item that is mass produced, doesn't earn interest or pay dividends in the hopes that you end up after an apocalypse with the only one and find someone willing to pay you more for it! Then again, if you consider the lost opportunity cost of your money, inflation and the potential for significant maintenance expense or even risk of loss then maybe it seems like a foolish "investment"

But that's me.

part of your post makes sense and has merit. and i can see that perspective.

but lets be real, the 20 or so thousand i spent is not going to adversely or positively effect my investment portfolio in a manner that is going to make any kind of large difference. my guess is you did not read the whole thread.

and you ruined an otherwise worthwhile argument by adding hyperbole and therefore negated any value whatsoever.



too bad.

[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by Ckci

I'm with you. I like many on here have ample assets. I see it as an asset on the balance sheet. I like assets I can enjoy. When gas prices started going up in 2007 you could feel the gloom in the air. I sold stocks and bought 1000 acres of land. My son was interested in hunting and we could touch, feel, see, smell, and as you say enjoy it. I didn't see the value fall like I did in stocks. I do the same thing with houses. I can enjoy them and they don't loose there value. To me these watches are like that as well. To me this is big picture investing. It's a living investment. I've also done some venture capital investing and to me that's also more fun because you get to be a part of it. It has also been significantly more profitable than individual stocks. Don't knock it until you try it.
Attachment 691681

1000 acres?!

How do you control so much land, intruders, ... what else?

[Etschell]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

1000 acres?!

How do you control so much land, intruders, ... what else?

its probably in the middle of nowhere.

[Scoobs]

Originally Posted by superdog

part of your post makes sense and has merit. And i can see that perspective.

But lets be real, the 20 or so thousand i spent is not going to adversely or positively effect my investment portfolio in a manner that is going to make any kind of large difference. My guess is you did not read the whole thread.

And you ruined an otherwise worthwhile argument by adding hyperbole and therefore negated any value whatsoever.



Too bad.

x 2

[Etschell]

Originally Posted by superdog

part of your post makes sense and has merit. and i can see that perspective.

but lets be real, the 20 or so thousand i spent is not going to adversely or positively effect my investment portfolio in a manner that is going to make any kind of large difference. my guess is you did not read the whole thread.

and you ruined an otherwise worthwhile argument by adding hyperbole and therefore negated any value whatsoever.



too bad.

i think it is a fun game to play. just look at the price of a bnib 2 liner 14060 now versus years ago. it has gone up even adjusted for inflation. from 3,800 in 2006 to over $5k now. that is some serious ROI. no one would call that rare or small batch produced.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Etschell

i think it is a fun game to play. just look at the price of a bnib 2 liner 14060 now versus years ago. it has gone up even adjusted for inflation. from 3,800 in 2006 to over $5k now. that is some serious ROI. no one would call that rare or small batch produced.

indeed. and you said the magic world. "fun".

I am having a blast.

[Duey]

Seth,
With stickers you're going to win. It's that simple. With most stocks it's just a crap roll

Go back to the end of 2003 to today -
Intel - INTC is up 8.13% over the last 12 years. That's it guy
GE is up 0% over the last 12 years. That's it guy
Bank of America - BAC is down <58.42%> over the last 12 years. Big time loss guy
Goldcorp Inc - GG is down <23.38%> over the last 12 years. Big time loss guy

and the list goes on, and yes there are dividends but you still loose 35% of that too

Don't let anybody say that a stickered SS sports model Rolex isn't a good investment if you buy it right

[Narbeh]

safe purchase always. investment in the sense that you can always get your money back, not sure about increases in value though.

[Wahlberg]

I would love to see some pics! Was it a ND 14060?

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Duey

Seth,
With stickers you're going to win. It's that simple. With most stocks it's just a crap roll

Go back to the end of 2003 to today -
Intel - INTC is up 8.13% over the last 12 years. That's it guy
GE is up 0% over the last 12 years. That's it guy
Bank of America - BAC is down <58.42%> over the last 12 years. Big time loss guy
Goldcorp Inc - GG is down <23.38%> over the last 12 years. Big time loss guy

and the list goes on, and yes there are dividends but you still loose 35% of that too

Don't let anybody say that a stickered SS sports model Rolex isn't a good investment if you buy it right

Duey, that is where my logic is at. And David was very fair, especially considering the quantity I bought. That said, not only how I buy, but how long I keep it for.

In 15 years, if I really can not wear them for that long, I have to imagine they will appreciate quite a bit.

[tomchicago]

Unless you catch something that becomes highly collectible (SS Pepsi, Paul Newman Daytona, Red Sub), Rollies are simply balance sheet items with a very wide bid-ask spread, so, as a rule, not a great investment.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

I would love to see some pics! Was it a ND 14060?

Pics tonight, for sure. Well, it has been a good few weeks and it depends how much the better half and I celebrate tonight.

So it might be tomorrow.

[Etschell]

Originally Posted by superdog

Duey, that is where my logic is at. And David was very fair, especially considering the quantity I bought. That said, not only how I buy, but how long I keep it for.

In 15 years, if I really can not wear them for that long, I have to imagine they will appreciate quite a bit.

if you want something that will never go down buy manhattan real estate.

[Micha]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

I would love to see some pics! Was it a ND 14060?

google is your friend...

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Etschell

if you want something that will never go down buy manhattan real estate.

ha. i have thought about that many many times.

anything that i would want to purchase is out of my league.

and that negates the fun for me. i have been a landlord before. i do not like it at all.

i might someday buy a nice one bed for my wife and i to spend weekends in. but considering i only pay cash for things, i really can't afford anything i would want without taking too big a hit.

[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by Micha

google is your friend...

You could shut down a lot of forums if that was the answer to it all. =)

[BLAUR]

I'm not overly keen of Rolex's as an investment piece. Unless you're going after some of the "one of a kind" items (i.g. first dual colored bezel, magnetic technology, new model, etc.) the return will not be greater than any other traditional investment. However, buying a Rolex to enjoy holds many benefits that other luxury watch makers do not have. Rolex's hold their value better in the long term when compared to many other brands. As such, the resale value will limit the total cost of ownership. For example, an Omega will lose much of it's initial value the minute in becomes worn, making the total cost of ownership much higher (though the initial outlay may be less). There's a reason why Rolex is the most famous and recognizable watch maker in the world :)

[jrs146]

How much of a premium are you paying for the stickers? I wonder if you would be better off spending less upfront, wearing and enjoying them and still have some appreciation in the future. I personally would go nuts knowing that I have those bad boys in a safe and unable to be worn!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[superdog]

Originally Posted by jrs146

How much of a premium are you paying for the stickers? I wonder if you would be better off spending less upfront, wearing and enjoying them and still have some appreciation in the future. I personally would go nuts knowing that I have those bad boys in a safe and unable to be worn!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You know what? I'm already having issues as I am really enjoying the used LV that came along with the group. I'm glad I got it.

I'm guessing I'll eventually wear the 16570. The other two? I imagine I'll they will keep their stickers for quite some time.

[Ckci]

Pictures please!

[Tseg]

As with any investment, risk=reward. If it was a sure thing everybody would be doing it. In 20 years you may get a nice return...or very limited return. In 5 years more likely a very limited return if that. So while the investment is liquid in that you likely will get your investment back at any point you sell it, upfront you know your money must be tied up for decades in hopes of any reasonable return. Of course, that is the risk. I would consider it more of an experiment than an investment strategy... as mentioned, a diversified portfolio likely should include a small % of long-shot investments. On the flip side, you could consider it money under the mattress.

[Copasetic]

I think whenever someone on the forum uses the word "investment", it conjures up many strong opinions.

And here's one of them: you didn't really consider this an investment, per se, like your "normal" investments. You just put a small percentage of your assets into a (hopefully) non-depreciating, potentially minimally appreciating asset that you can also enjoy.

I, for one, agree with the strategy. I have a hot rod sitting in the garage that I hopefully bought right for the same reason. And some watches as well....

Happy Holidays everyone!

[landroverking]

Vintage yes. 16xxx and beyond, modern Rolexes IMHO NO.

[ap1]

Did this even happen, where are the pics - lol

[Hotrod297]

Like Seth, I also (in the past couple of years) started collecting discontinued NOS. I already have a decent amount of watches in my "wear" collection, and I've
always wanted to start a "Safe Queen/No-Wear" collection. I initially looked in vintage watches, but was fearful of not knowing the watch's true history. A
friend recommended collecting discontinued NOS, and just grow old with it. This will at least give me a better knowledge of the watch's history.

I question myself on occasion why I'm doing this. But it's a "Collectors Bug" or a "Tick" as John Mayer said in an interview with Hodinkee. It's very
difficult to explain why people collect certain things (Cars, Painting, Coins, etc...). But what is certain, they/we "Enjoy" it.

Obviously the investment factor cannot be ignored. I guess it depends on what your long term vision is (keeping it or flipping it)? But personally speaking,
it's secondary. The enjoyment of discontinued NOS ownership is what matters to me. The knowledge of the watch potential future value is an added comfort & justification for collecting it. Bottom line, this not a cheap hobby. If you can financially afford it, than enjoy it for whatever reason you desire.

Again, I understand it's very difficult for a lot of members to comprehend buying an expensive watch/paying a premium for discontinued NOS and not
wearing it. But for some of us watch collectors we see things differently, a piece of art in pristine condition, a piece of Rolex history unspoiled, and
the pure enjoyment of ownership to show it off to friends and guest.

In the end, regardless if you wear it, just collect it, or both. We all love & enjoy Rolex Watches.

Happy Holiday to all!!

[Speed]

Originally Posted by Hotrod297

Like Seth, I also (in the past couple of years) started collecting discontinued NOS. I already have a decent amount of watches in my "wear" collection, and I've

always wanted to start a "Safe Queen/No-Wear" collection. I initially looked in vintage watches, but was fearful of not knowing the watch's true history. A

friend recommended collecting discontinued NOS, and just grow old with it. This will at least give me a better knowledge of the watch's history.



I question myself on occasion why I'm doing this. But it's a "Collectors Bug" or a "Tick" as John Mayer said in an interview with Hodinkee. It's very

difficult to explain why people collect certain things (Cars, Painting, Coins, etc...). But what is certain, they/we "Enjoy" it.



Obviously the investment factor cannot be ignored. I guess it depends on what your long term vision is (keeping it or flipping it)? But personally speaking,

it's secondary. The enjoyment of discontinued NOS ownership is what matters to me. The knowledge of the watch potential future value is an added comfort & justification for collecting it. Bottom line, this not a cheap hobby. If you can financially afford it, than enjoy it for whatever reason you desire.



Again, I understand it's very difficult for a lot of members to comprehend buying an expensive watch/paying a premium for discontinued NOS and not

wearing it. But for some of us watch collectors we see things differently, a piece of art in pristine condition, a piece of Rolex history unspoiled, and

the pure enjoyment of ownership to show it off to friends and guest.



In the end, regardless if you wear it, just collect it, or both. We all love & enjoy Rolex Watches.



Happy Holiday to all!!

So what is the typical guest / friend reaction when you "show off" a NOS watch from your safe?

Do they tip toe / run for the door? What sort of questions do you get?

[superdog]

And finally some pics. Sorry for the delay. This has been a busy few days. Pics as promised. I included one of Sport, our Jewish Christmas at a Chinese restaurant and of the current collection as well.