16710 Prices

[BawlaDK]

Supply and demand - Simple as that. I dont see any pre-ceramic Rolexes decreasing in value anytime soon.... They might at somepoint stop increasing at the same pace, but they will most likely never depreciate.

[Vishy26]

GMT is a great watch, I recently bought a P series GMT and also have a Z series 16610 for some years. I think 16610 is just as good with a sturdier bracelet, rugged and a fantastic watch. How and why it fell off so far behind in comparison, don't known. Internet publicity I believe. Bright-coloured pictures of "Pepsi" everywhere.

[Loevhagen]

The second hand watch market floods with 16710s: http://www.watchrecon.com/?query=16710

Try the same search with the ultra common 16610 - and see for the same 14 day interval...

[The Libertine]

Originally Posted by Speed

My personal experience is that while I see plenty of these for sale...many are not in a condition I would pay a high price for. No provenance is also a deal breaker for me.

No kidding on the condition..... some are barely what I would describe as in "fair" condition but seeking the price for what a 16710 in excellent/mint list.

[jcd]

I bought my D 16710 from DavidSW about 2 years ago. I've wanted one since I was a kid. I'd been watching the asking prices climb for a while and figured I better get one while I can instead of wait before I thought the prices were too ridiculous. They just seemed to keep climbing and climbing.

[Chadridv]

Originally Posted by ronricks

They aren't hard to obtain though. There are thousands upon thousands of them out there and easily available. It is mostly an internet thing as locally the prices aren't what they are on here.

This is kind of a funny statement, because while I don't totally disagree with you my experience is not black and white in regards to the local vs internet demand. Yes they are relatively easy to obtain, however certain serial numbers especially in great condition with complete sets are harder to find, but with some patience can be found.

Locally speaking, I did notice that the pricing is slightly less than on the internet, mostly because the shop owners are just behind on market value. They're happy to sell it for more than they paid, and the person who they bought it from as well.

However, I've been asking around a few local places for several years to contact me if they got a good example in stock and never got one phone call.

So while local shop owners have provide lower estimates of cost than here on the internet, they also have very few passing through their hands.

Just my experience.

[ronricks]

Originally Posted by Chadridv

This is kind of a funny statement, because while I don't totally disagree with you my experience is not black and white in regards to the local vs internet demand. Yes they are relatively easy to obtain, however certain serial numbers especially in great condition with complete sets are harder to find, but with some patience can be found.

Locally speaking, I did notice that the pricing is slightly less than on the internet, mostly because the shop owners are just behind on market value. They're happy to sell it for more than they paid, and the person who they bought it from as well.

However, I've been asking around a few local places for several years to contact me if they got a good example in stock and never got one phone call.

So while local shop owners have provide lower estimates of cost than here on the internet, they also have very few passing through their hands.

Just my experience.

Here is another issue. Sellers aren't buying them for more than they were a year ago the are only charging more. Seems if it was really going up in value they would also be having to pay more to acquire them. They aren't. Which is why I said it is largely based on the internet market and hype. The 16710 was one of the most massed produced Rolex there is along with the 16610 which oddly are at the bottom of their price curve right now you can get one really cheap in very good to excellent condition.

I am not talking about the 16710 3186 models as yes those are in lower numbers and have a following (though I personally wouldn't pay a premium for one)

The 16710 is an excellent watch so I understand that but it is in no way rare or in limited numbers unless it is a 3186.

[Micha]

Originally Posted by THC

Got mine this year and really love it...

and a stick dial to boot...congrats

[Onikage]

Keep em minty.

[Speed]

Originally Posted by ronricks

Here is another issue. Sellers aren't buying them for more than they were a year ago the are only charging more. Seems if it was really going up in value they would also be having to pay more to acquire them. They aren't. Which is why I said it is largely based on the internet market and hype. The 16710 was one of the most massed produced Rolex there is along with the 16610 which oddly are at the bottom of their price curve right now you can get one really cheap in very good to excellent condition.



I am not talking about the 16710 3186 models as yes those are in lower numbers and have a following (though I personally wouldn't pay a premium for one)



The 16710 is an excellent watch so I understand that but it is in no way rare or in limited numbers unless it is a 3186.

Well...it may be hype driving up prices but again - I don't see a) local sellers bursting with mint Pepsis and b) selling them for cheap.

I submit you can sell them for more than a few years ago. Not that I am selling...

And today I think you'll just see more online than in brick & mortar stores. That's just my opinion.

[HeartRolex]

Originally Posted by Lemieux66

I think the ceramic steel Pepsi/Coke not materialising after much expectation may have affected the price of the 16710 in recent times. With no steel version available, just the BLRO, the old models become the only place to go and as they're in finite supply the price goes up.

My thoughts exactly.

[THC]

Originally Posted by Micha

and a stick dial to boot...congrats

Thanks Michael.. just came that way and was not looking for one with it.

[Alasdair]

Three of mine! Of course then there's the debate between 16710 and 116710!

[Reno_1ted]

Very interesting thread.

I bought my Z series Pepsi last year. Full set. I bought it because I loved it, but sounds like a good investment too. Always nice to hear. :)

Question (and apologies if this is a noob question, im still learning) but what's the difference between 3185 and 3186 models and how do you tell? They're movement differences right? What's the value difference?

Oh and a pic of course

[JP(Canada)]

I agree it's crazy. They are by no means scarce or rare either. But a watch is worth what someone will pay for it.

[SMD]

http://forums.watchnet.com/index.php...o=819122&rid=0

[Boaters]

Gotta love them here is my D serial with a few extra inserts

[Vintage12]

Reno_1ted - here's a picture of my 16710-3186 if that helps. Of course it doesn't really help you identify anything from a quick glance of the exterior. Some say the "stick dial" gives it away but that's not always correct. Others refer to the credit card warranty versus paper only but that doesn't seem 100% consistent in all global markets either. The serial # may give a clue, 3186 are M-series or late Z-series only. That doesn't confirm anything though so, aside from pulling the back, the easiest method to identify the movement is to pull the winder out to the GMT hour hand and see how many hours the hand moves with exactly one full turn of the winder, 8-9 hours = 3186, 5-6 hours = 3185. Generally, the 3186 movement is double the price or even more based on the previous poster (shocking). Regardless, both watches are great.

[douglasf13]

Originally Posted by Vishy26

GMT is a great watch, I recently bought a P series GMT and also have a Z series 16610 for some years. I think 16610 is just as good with a sturdier bracelet, rugged and a fantastic watch. How and why it fell off so far behind in comparison, don't known. Internet publicity I believe. Bright-coloured pictures of "Pepsi" everywhere.

The 16570 prices are even more of a mystery to me, considering the only difference is a bezel, although they seem to be on the rise.

[strafer_kid]

GMTmaster2 is a great watch in either 3185 or 3186 .....can't really go wrong with either! Brilliant all rounder that is versatile and does nearly everything the Sub does, at least for most people. 16700 is also up there with the quickset date being a bonus for many including myself, a fairly dyed in the wool Sub/SD guy! Serviced and looked after, these things look like they could go for ever!

[yjfang]

16570 are a great value proposition, especially the polar dial (not too many white dial Sports Rolexes). I got one recently (Z serial) which has the 3186 movement for much less than an average condition 16710.

Originally Posted by douglasf13

The 16570 prices are even more of a mystery to me, considering the only difference is a bezel, although they seem to be on the rise.

[Bigsykedaddy]

Originally Posted by ronricks

The 16710 was one of the most massed produced Rolex there is along with the 16610 which oddly are at the bottom of their price curve right now you can get one really cheap in very good to excellent condition.

What would be considered a really good deal on a 16610 in very good to excellent condition? Just curious because I just started looking around and I am finding differing prices (like always, but just curious where I should be for a great deal.) Thanks in advance

Also what makes the 3186 movement more sought after / expensive? Just curious. Is it just the fact that the hour hand moves more with one turn and the fact that it is rare?

[Vintage12]

Relative rarity, accuracy and a little mystique mixed in. While there are technical advances to the 3186 movement, the Parachrom Bleu hairspring for example, it was a surprise that after nearly 20 years Rolex introduced the new movement intended for the ceramics in to the final run of 16710 models. Plenty of material to search on but here's a useful explanation.

http://luxurytyme.com/en/rolex-relat...ii-16710-3186/

[HL65]

Originally Posted by Loevhagen

The second hand watch market floods with 16710s: http://www.watchrecon.com/?query=16710

Try the same search with the ultra common 16610 - and see for the same 14 day interval...

There are indeed but not one on there I would ever buy. Finding late model in pristine complete condition has become so much harder and prices for those have moved up quite a bit.

[alexxelor]

Originally Posted by SMD

http://forums.watchnet.com/index.php...o=819122&rid=0

http://www.chrono24.it/rolex/gmt-mas...-id5284642.htm

[socialpro]

Just started shopping around for one myself - and def noticed price increases from last time I looked at these (~1 year ago).

[mtgjr]

Originally Posted by Vintage12

Relative rarity, accuracy and a little mystique mixed in. While there are technical advances to the 3186 movement, the Parachrom Bleu hairspring for example, it was a surprise that after nearly 20 years Rolex introduced the new movement intended for the ceramics in to the final run of 16710 models. Plenty of material to search on but here's a useful explanation.

http://luxurytyme.com/en/rolex-relat...ii-16710-3186/

Well, they also put it into the last few years worth of 16570s....not merely the "final run". Not sure any of the "mystique" is really warranted.

[Volatile Agent]

I got an excellent condition D serial around 18 months ago. Kinda wished I would have bought two of them.

It is easily my favorite watch and it is getting more difficult to find later models in excellent condition.

[SMD]

Originally Posted by HL65

There are indeed but not one on there I would ever buy. Finding late model in pristine complete condition has become so much harder and prices for those have moved up quite a bit.

Would appreciate your expert opinion on something - I have a NOS Pepsi coming in on Monday. Wear it or keep in plastic and buy another for a travel beater. Have several other GMTs so not like it would be my only one.

Edit - D serial.

[HL65]

Originally Posted by SMD

Would appreciate your expert opinion on something - I have a NOS Pepsi coming in on Monday. Wear it or keep in plastic and buy another for a travel beater. Have several other GMTs so not like it would be my only one.

Edit - D serial.

Depends on what you want from it. For me I want to wear and enjoy so that's what I would do without worrying about price impact.