Investment Type of Car

[superdog]

Originally Posted by GoingPlaces

Or SLS GT or Black Series. Values are exploding.

GT is really where my head is at. The Black Series is just bonkers.

[DLRIDES]

Originally Posted by superdog

I know what many of you will say, cars and watches are not investments.

I agree with watches, respectfully disagree on cars. And no, I would never buy a new car today figuring that it is an investment.

However, there are certainly cars out there that will likely retain their value and potentially appreciate.

No, it will not be a garage queen. But no, it won't see the track either. This car will likely just be for fun Sunday drives and different events.

And for the sake of clarity, I am not expecting or even hoping to make money. I am not doing this in the traditional sense of having an investment. I am doing this for something to enjoy with the hopes that it can also retain much of its value. I do realize I will lose money for every mile, and other costs such as insurance and gas will likely mean I am losing money in the long run. Thats okay. I realize all of this..

I just like cars and this will be more fun that having it sit in a bank.

Okay, now that this is out of the way....

I was looking at the Ford GT. But that is really a tough car in a lot of ways. It would likely be painful to drive because of how much I would lose with each mile. And considering how expensive it is, I just don't see it ever going up at all. I simply think it is too high and has no room.

I am really looking at a Ferrari. F430 Scuderia. Beautiful car. Relatively rare, and not terribly priced. Also had great reviews is apparently pretty reliable.

Curious what other suggestions some of you car guys might have. Mostly a sports car guy, but I am open to different options. I realize no one has a crystal ball. So just checking out your thoughts and having a discussion.

Thanks in advance.

Ask ten industry specialists and get ten different answers !


Some constants seem to be :

‘96 Dodge Viper blue w/white stripes
Early SUV category, FJ, Bronco, Defender, etc
BMW 2002
Mercedes 560 SL

[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by V25V

430 scud is an awesome car. But certainly not going to hold its value tremendously well. All of these types are tech revolutions and short of an F40, Enzo, etc the next one comes out and its predecessor tanks. So unless you want to drop 1MM+, just buy the car you want and enjoy it.

Hmm, the F430 (scud) is one of the latest 'real' ones in my opinion. Same with the 360 stradale, they went up. 996 GT3 RS as well. Buying it you'll barely lose money on it.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by DLRIDES

Ask ten industry specialists and get ten different answers !


Some constants seem to be :

‘96 Dodge Viper blue w/white stripes
Early SUV category, FJ, Bronco, Defender, etc
BMW 2002
Mercedes 560 SL

Truer words have never been spoken. I read up on all this, and opinions are all over.

That’s one of the reasons I really like this discussion and posted here. I like to get all the ideas.

That said, the Viper certainly peaks my interest. Ty

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

Hmm, the F430 (scud) is one of the latest 'real' ones in my opinion. Same with the 360 stradale, they went up. 996 GT3 RS as well. Buying it you'll barely lose money on it.

I’m of a similar opinion on the Scud. I looked at the 16M version, but it’s just too much for me to justify the cost.

[bondtoys]

Keep in mind that I was the first to mention the Targa back then

[Xelorpepsi]

Not sure whether that's the case in the US or not, but in Europe a collector usually has a manual gearbox - that would also be my preference, because the driving exprience is 10x more enjoyable.

A few ideas:

Porsche: 911 GT3 (997 1st generation), 911 GT2 RS, 911 Turbo (930 & 933 generations), 911 Turbo S (964)
Ferrari: 458 Speciale, 430 Scuderia, 599 GTO (if still in your budget)
Lamborghini: SV and Superleggera models
Lotus: Esprit, Elise II

[superdog]

Originally Posted by bondtoys

Keep in mind that I was the first to mention the Targa back then

Best car!!!

It’s amazing. And I do remember. Thank you.

[DLRIDES]

Originally Posted by superdog

Truer words have never been spoken. I read up on all this, and opinions are all over.


That said, the Viper certainly peaks my interest. Ty

A premier example blue/white GTS has become collectible with low production, non-electronic, three pedals, PYP driving experience, low cost of maintenance, and it is appreciating quickly.


Most collector car experts seem to all agree that most electronically controlled cars will be a collectors nightmare in the future due to software access, extensive maintenance requirements, etc. Their upkeep costs could be greater than their appreciation.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

Hmm, the F430 (scud) is one of the latest 'real' ones in my opinion. Same with the 360 stradale, they went up. 996 GT3 RS as well. Buying it you'll barely lose money on it.

I love the car, dont get me wrong. But the earlier models are already going down. I think you have far less true car guys within the Ferrari world than say Porsche or BMW. The F car guys generally want the latest and greatest, technology and to tell their buddies "it has 10000000hp". Those two went up but they are going down and we all knew it was going to happen. Any collector who would want to buy that model down the road would want one parked in a garage with 1000 miles on it, not one that was actually driven. So not only will it depreciate, but even more so if actually sat in on a regular basis.

[BNA/LION]

Seth, Go Electric!

https://www.caranddriver.com/tesla/roadster

[bondtoys]

Originally Posted by superdog

Best car!!!

It’s amazing. And I do remember. Thank you.

Totally off-topic: Try out the Mini Cooper SE!
It‘s addictive - I have immediately ordered one

[Andy0331]

As everyone has noted, there is no guarantee for investment or appreciation in "newer" cars, however in my opinion, these are suggested boxes to check.

• Naturally aspirated engine

• Predominantly "analog" dash (not full glass/tech)

• Manual transmission

• Low/limited production

• Unique style; first or last of it's kind

• Currently "aging well" & still turns heads

Certainly not my hard & fast rules, but for my imaginary collection, largely still under $200k (with some exceptions). Even if not "investments", all should hold their value well or appreciate.

• Ferrari 430 gated manual, coupe or roadster

• Ferrari 360 gated manual, coupe or roadster

• Ferrari 550 gated manual

• Ferrari 599 gated manual, but entry price is already high

• Ford GT, '04-'06, entry price is already high for no accident cars

• Lamborghini Gallardo gated manual, coupe or roadster

• Lamborghini Murcielago gated manual, coupe or roadster

• Mercedes SLS coupe, not roadster

• Mercedes CLK63 Black Series

• Porsche CGT, entry price is already high

For me, I want an SLS or gated 430, but still lack the cohones to do it as an investment, even though I'm 90% certain I would essentially have a car that I got to "drive for free" during the time of ownership.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by V25V

I love the car, dont get me wrong. But the earlier models are already going down. I think you have far less true car guys within the Ferrari world than say Porsche or BMW. The F car guys generally want the latest and greatest, technology and to tell their buddies "it has 10000000hp". Those two went up but they are going down and we all knew it was going to happen. Any collector who would want to buy that model down the road would want one parked in a garage with 1000 miles on it, not one that was actually driven. So not only will it depreciate, but even more so if actually sat in on a regular basis.

Thats good feedback.

And I don't disagree with your thoughts on the desire for the latest tech. Personally, that is why I went with the Evo.

It is still on the short list only because I keep comping back to it. I love lines and the look of the whole package.

I am not really looking to make money. But to have something that will always be something of a "classic" and hold value relatively well, that appeals to me.

Good food for thought.

[droptopman]

Do not follow exotics, but had a shop and restored muscle cars in the 80's and 90's. Do not follow as closely as I once did, but for sure there are still solid investments in certain muscle cars. Totally different driving experience, but much fun shifting a big block Vette or Camaro. Fairly low maintenance costs and will not take as big of a hit for driving one--well depending on the model.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by BNA/LION

Seth, Go Electric!

https://www.caranddriver.com/tesla/roadster

that is not even funny!!!!!

[superdog]

Originally Posted by droptopman

Do not follow exotics, but had a shop and restored muscle cars in the 80's and 90's. Do not follow as closely as I once did, but for sure there are still solid investments in certain muscle cars. Totally different driving experience, but much fun shifting a big block Vette or Camaro. Fairly low maintenance costs and will not take as big of a hit for driving one--well depending on the model.

I admit I would love to have Eleanor in my garage. that would be cool.

But again likely at the top of its range. And I would likely not loving driving it.

[droptopman]

Originally Posted by superdog

I admit I would love to have Eleanor in my garage. that would be cool.

But again likely at the top of its range. And I would likely not loving driving it.

True, need to jump one step down. Not a total collector/show car, but a sought after model in excellent condition. Generally will continue to appreciate with inflation, but you can drive it while it does. Obviously no big money here as the big money was in the late 80's early 90's on most of these.

[cornerstore]

My candidate is a low mileage 280sl post 1972. Pre72’ 280sl’s are nice but not a daily. This one is a verified preproduction model, one of only three assembled for the 1985 auto show. Five speed standard with a truck engine, four seats and 25k miles. MB calls it a unicorn as it was never intended to be licensed or sold, and was slated for demolition after the show. Rare gas powered low production cars will be highly collectable in the electric age. An SL of this era with no mileage sold in Europe for $150k last year. Like watches provenance and paper work are value added. This one has gone up 500% in ten years and very low maintenance costs.

[ruffa]

Originally Posted by bondtoys

Totally off-topic: Try out the Mini Cooper SE!

It‘s addictive - I have immediately ordered one

Not quite an investment car. I have nothing against the Minis (I owned a FAST modded one a decade ago) but given Seths current car collection, I would imagine a Mini would be slightly embarrassing. It’s a fun little toy to drive but it’s not everyone’s cup of tea.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SpeakWithMichael]

Originally Posted by cornerstore

My candidate is a low mileage 280sl post 1972. Pre72’ 280sl’s are nice but not a daily. This one is a verified preproduction model, one of only three assembled for the 1985 auto show. Five speed standard with a truck engine, four seats and 25k miles. MB calls it a unicorn as it was never intended to be licensed or sold, and was slated for demolition after the show. Rare gas powered low production cars will be highly collectable in the electric age. An SL of this era with no mileage sold in Europe for $150k last year. Like watches provenance and paper work are value added. This one has gone up 500% in ten years and very low maintenance costs.

Similarly, the 1990-1991 560 SEC’s are going to rise quite well.

[mailman]

1970 Chevelle with an LS6 package.

[jltait]

Originally Posted by Chewbacca

Love it.

I’m starting to warm up to you, Chewy.

[Johndong888]

Damn Seth. Just won’t slow down huh lol

These are what I had considered at the <500k price point
1. SLS Black Series (this is probably my all time favorite just too expensive compared to MSRP)
2. SLR Mclaren
3. Murci SV tho they’re probably over 500
4. Ferrari 430 6mt/Scud
5. And my choice for long term keeps, aventador SV.

I’m looking into the 720s just to get it out of the way but they’re in the “throw away your money” grade. Then hopefully SV


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SBR]

Originally Posted by mailman

1970 Chevelle with an LS6 package.

Now your talking...
I love the 60s muscle cars. Very easy to work on and fun to drive if you want a visceral driving experience. I collect 1967 big block corvettes and love them. The only caveat with these and muscle cars in general is that you must have first hand knowledge with these cars as most are fakes. This is where having an expert perform a PPI is key. I have been laser focused on those cars for decades so I have a pretty good handle on them.

[JakeK]

I'd go with any one of the muscle cars from the mid 60s through the early 70s, or a Ford Bronco from the same time period. Doesn't have to be an after-market tuned model, a regular Camaro SS big block will do. Find one that needs a little bit of work and new paint and either do it yourself or pay someone to restore. Demand far outweighs supply of those vehicles right now and will probably continue to rise for the foreseeable future.

[rolexest]

Originally Posted by SBR

Now your talking...
I love the 60s muscle cars. Very easy to work on and fun to drive if you want a visceral driving experience. I collect 1967 big block corvettes and love them. The only caveat with these and muscle cars in general is that you must have first hand knowledge with these cars as most are fakes. This is where having an expert perform a PPI is key. I have been laser focused on those cars for decades so I have a pretty good handle on them.

My guy! I also have a 67 427 big block vette. Convertible, black with red stinger. Currently looking for a 63 split window to restore. They don't make cars like these anymore.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Johndong888

Damn Seth. Just won’t slow down huh lol

These are what I had considered at the <500k price point
1. SLS Black Series (this is probably my all time favorite just too expensive compared to MSRP)
2. SLR Mclaren
3. Murci SV tho they’re probably over 500
4. Ferrari 430 6mt/Scud
5. And my choice for long term keeps, aventador SV.

I’m looking into the 720s just to get it out of the way but they’re in the “throw away your money” grade. Then hopefully SV


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Listen....

ADD isn’t all bad.

Hard for me to stop the brain. Cars are a good outlet for me. I feel most alive while driving and I just love being around them.

Your comment about the 720 is appropriate. I actually want a 600LT spider. I just prefer the lines. The reviews are also incredible.

It’s just hard to justify at this point without selling the Targa. My wife can’t drive the Targa being that it’s manual, so trust me, I’m thinking about it.

But really hoping to diversify and the SLS and the SLR are great options. I think my only hesitation is the realization that they will likely sit more than move. I’m not actually overly comfortable with that. They are just priced so high at this point, it’s tough to justify. So maybe, I should shift gears. (Pun intended).

Just having some fun for now. Keeping my mind games at bay for the time being.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by SBR

Now your talking...
I love the 60s muscle cars. Very easy to work on and fun to drive if you want a visceral driving experience. I collect 1967 big block corvettes and love them. The only caveat with these and muscle cars in general is that you must have first hand knowledge with these cars as most are fakes. This is where having an expert perform a PPI is key. I have been laser focused on those cars for decades so I have a pretty good handle on them.

This is great advice. Thank you.

I do like resto mods. A lot. But I for this, I’d want everything matching.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by rolexest

My guy! I also have a 67 427 big block vette. Convertible, black with red stinger. Currently looking for a 63 split window to restore. They don't make cars like these anymore.

Two sexy beasts there. The split window project would be awesome.