GMT 16750 - Dial issue

[Baksken13]

All,

I have been eyeing a GMT 16750 (see the thread "Opinions on pepsi GMT 16750") and a question came back:

Do you know when the GMT 16750 came with a glossy dial (mentioning “oyster perpetual date”)?

I have seen in various threads including mine that certain members of this forum (orgi, etc.) say that it would be as from serial number 84xxxxx.

I have however been told by various vintage rolex specialists on other forums that certain 83xxxx originally came with glossy dials (I am not talking about the dials which Rolex replaced during their service as we know this is something which happened quite often), sometimes with or without the reference “date” and that it is difficult to say when this exactly started as rolex never kept written record as from which serial number they started as a general principle to switch to glossy dials. They further said a lot of this is pure guesswork from collectors around the world....


What are your views on this?

Thanks a lot

[sensui]

Originally Posted by Baksken13

All,
They further said a lot of this is pure guesswork from collectors around the world....

That about sums up reality. All this data are compiled by collectors and enthusiasts....production years and periods for certain attributes. There are no real cut dry facts when you're trying to pin exactly when transitions happen.

[MorningTundra]

Originally Posted by sensui

That about sums up reality. All this data are compiled by collectors and enthusiasts....production years and periods for certain attributes. There are no real cut dry facts when you're trying to pin exactly when transitions happen.

I agree. There is a lot of opinion and subjectivity. Transitional references in particular are controversial.

I believe there to be a big difference between an “enthusiast” and an “expert” when it comes to dating and authenticating.


Sent from my cracked, broken hand wound phone. IG @morning_tundra

[PVR]

My cut off point from matte to gloss is 8 million.

Anything higher than 8 mil should be gloss and anything under 8 mil matte.

As far as 1675's..

Anything under 6 mil should be 1675 and over 6 mil should be 16750.

SO..

6mil -7.99m are matte dial 16750's.

[Baksken13]

Thanks, so this one being 83xxxx should have the correct dial?

[springer]

Originally Posted by PVR

My cut off point from matte to gloss is 8 million.

Anything higher than 8 mil should be gloss and anything under 8 mil matte.

As far as 1675's..

Anything under 6 mil should be 1675 and over 6 mil should be 16750.

SO..

6mil -7.99m are matte dial 16750's.

I've owned several (11 to be exact) matte-dialed 16750s with serial numbers higher than 8.0 million

As far as whether an 8.3 million could have originally had a glossy dial, I would never say never since it is a transition era to the glossy dials - although I would expect the early 16750 gloss dials would read OYSTER PERPETUAL not OYSTER PERPETUAL DATE.

[lee fowler]

Originally Posted by Baksken13

Thanks, so this one being 83xxxx should have the correct dial?

If the overlap for gloss dials is around 8.4M this would still be wrong as the first gloss dials would be No Date dials.

[Baksken13]

Originally Posted by lee fowler

If the overlap for gloss dials is around 8.4M this would still be wrong as the first gloss dials would be No Date dials.

Thanks, on which info or materials are you basing this conclusion? Not that i do not want to believe you but I had been told the date/no date was not something that Rolex consistently used in the transition period. Thanks

[lee fowler]

Originally Posted by Baksken13

Thanks, on which info or materials are you basing this conclusion? Not that i do not want to believe you but I had been told the date/no date was not something that Rolex consistently used in the transition period. Thanks

Just a quick Google search or indeed a search on here and you will find great info. The first gloss dials on the 16750 were all No Date dials with the Date ones being used as service replacements and then full time in all.

[Baksken13]

Thanks Lee. Guess i will have to let this watch go as I would like to have something fully original

So if anyone has or know a nice period correct 16750 glossy dial for sale, please let me know��

[alwayshere]

my 16750 is 8.0m serial as another reference point