The California dream is dying

[TheVTCGuy]

This is the title of a (long) article in the Atlantic. I’ll post the link but if anyone is interested and doesn’t want to click on it (I completely understand) just do a google search and I am sure you can find it.

I lived in SOCAL my whole life, with the exception of almost a year in Mexico, and a couple years at a military school in the midwest. Sadly, I see what the article is describing. Years ago, you could not do better (IMHO) then living in SOCAL, but that changed quite a bit. In my opinion, we did it to ourselves. Gone are the Orange groves in (you guessed it, Orange county), the beach communities have turned in to dangerous neighborhoods I won’t visit even in the day. It is sad, because I used to surf those beaches as a young kid, never felt uneasy or threatened. Today, I feel concerned driving by them. And don’t get me started on Los Angeles. I remember as a young kid, going for a day out up there with my parents for lunch and shopping. Of course there were bad parts, just like any city, but over-all it was a clean, happy, vibrant city; now it looks like…. Well, never mind. Our prices are higher then practically everywhere else in the country, we laughingly referred to it as the sunshine tax. Real estate, gasoline, you name it; costs are crazy. Now real-estate is still crazy, my place is now worth almost double what I paid for it
( ) but other areas have reached the bubble (again, this is all my opinion), and people are fed up. In 2020, the population of California DROPPED by almost 200,000 people. That is the first time EVER there was a reduction in population. I think people are fed up. Seeing how much equity they have in their home, and what would get them in other states, many have decided enough with this and leaving.

OK, I know this is a rant, but it makes me sad to see my home states degeneration. What does the future entail? Only time will tell. I am interested in my other California-brethren if they feel the same way, or are more optimistic. And any visitors, please give my your thoughts as well, I have spoken with some tourists that say they enjoyed the heck out of visiting California years ago, but now would not even consider coming here.

It is very sad, but may be the future. Please let me know what you think.

Here is the link https://apple.news/AX5N9BGsbRT-bgVgw3N-_fg

[M45]

My taxes are ridiculously high, I’m not really sure what they are going to because the roads are a disaster, as is the rest of the infrastructure.

Every year we have more and more devastating wildfires.

Homeless encampment caught fire 200 yards from my house and we almost had to evacuate, local police and government said they can do nothing about it.

Crime is rampant. The best part is is that politicians and district attorneys claim it’s actually down except vehicles are being broken into everywhere, people are stealing catalytic converters, stores are either shutting down or cutting their hours because of shoplifting.

Small businesses are dying from a perfect storm of increased rent prices and the illegal shutdown we had last year.

Everything is ridiculously expensive.

There’s also no water and they turn off the electricity when it gets too hot or too windy.

Truly a paradise on earth.

I forgot to mention that if you have a nice house, there is an increasing chance that they will build some wonderful low income housing in your backyard and completely devaluate it.

Also, since there was absolutely no recourse to the looting that happened during last year’s summer of love, it’s been going on nonstop for the last year. Every time we go out, there is a business with its windows smashed.

[JParm]

I'm a West Coaster, having spent most of my life in SoCal as well. While the last 3 years have seen us in FL due to my wife's job, we are moving back in the Fall and I cannot be more excited.

Paul, the Best Coast is still the place to be. You want to get away from the city? You've got Palm Springs, Big Bear, etc. in your backyard. While FL has been great for us, I just cannot deal with the humidity, the bugs, the humidity, the alligators, the humidity...and on top of that, it's so flat out here! I do love the beaches though.

The only thing that CA has against are the taxes and high cost of living, but my thoughts on it are that you have to pay if you want to play. I have many friends out here that have always said "I'd be in CA if it wasn't for the cost" - which to me goes to show you that it truly is paradise. I'd rather be in the place I actually want to be in than to look from afar yearning for it on the daily.

Also, the "exodus" is highly exaggerated. There was an article recently that showed the number of people moving out wasn't vastly different than before.

As a USC alum and someone that met my wife in SD and started our family there, it's a place that will always be in our hearts and we'll be retiring in CA, whether it be NorCal or SoCal.

Edit: Also, it isn't all blue skies and apple pie everywhere else...people will always have something to complain about; at least we'll be complaining about it in paradise.

[enjoythemusic]

Move to Texas or Florida like tens of thousands of other Californians have done over the past few years. Imagine the tax savings alone! ... let alone the better homes for the $ plus safer neighborhoods and beaches.

Come join us, you'll love living here.

siesta.jpg

siesta2.jpg

[Blansky]

I remember moving here in the middle 80s.

The mantra was then, well it's ok now but you should have been here 15 years ago when it was great. And you can trace that back 15 years ago and people said the same thing. But people forget the nasty smog in the 60 and 70s.

I think things just change and people don't like change. Almost every where you go people say, well it's ok now but man, 15 years ago it was paradise.

California has always been a state of mind. A place for innovation, has perhaps the most international cities in the country. It made way for people from all over the country to come to a place that accepted people who were different, that were ostracized in their home states.

There are 40 million people living here, it's very diverse, you can ski and you can surf on the same day. It grows food for the nation.

And the people that lived here and leave almost treat the place like they were a jilted lover.

I love it here and wouldn't live in any other place in the US.

[JParm]

Originally Posted by Blansky

I remember moving here in the middle 80s.

The mantra was then, well it's ok now but you should have been here 15 years ago when it was great. And you can trace that back 15 years ago and people said the same thing. But people forget the nasty smog in the 60 and 70s.

I think things just change and people don't like change. Almost every where you go people say, well it's ok now but man, 15 years ago it was paradise.

California has always been a state of mind. A place for innovation, perhaps the most international city in the country. It made way for people from all over the country to come to a place that accepted people who were different, that were ostracized in their home states.

There are 40 million people living here, it's very diverse, you can ski and you can surf on the same day. It grows food for the nation.

And the people that lived here and leave almost treat the place like they were a jilted lover.

I love it here and wouldn't live in any other place in the US.

You and I are very much alike, my friend.

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by jpeezy14@hotmail.com

You and I are very much alike, my friend.

Except for the camera crew following you around part. And the beautiful family.

[JParm]

Originally Posted by Blansky

Except for the camera crew following you around part. And the beautiful family.

I'm sure your family is just as grand!

[wesdaniel]

Originally Posted by Blansky

I remember moving here in the middle 80s.

The mantra was then, well it's ok now but you should have been here 15 years ago when it was great. And you can trace that back 15 years ago and people said the same thing. But people forget the nasty smog in the 60 and 70s.

I think things just change and people don't like change. Almost every where you go people say, well it's ok now but man, 15 years ago it was paradise.

California has always been a state of mind. A place for innovation, has perhaps the most international cities in the country. It made way for people from all over the country to come to a place that accepted people who were different, that were ostracized in their home states.

There are 40 million people living here, it's very diverse, you can ski and you can surf on the same day. It grows food for the nation.

And the people that lived here and leave almost treat the place like they were a jilted lover.

I love it here and wouldn't live in any other place in the US.

Same here. I arrived in 1989 and have left three times (work-related) - once to New Orleans, once to Denver, and once to Dallass. Ended up coming back every time.

I'd be hard-pressed to think of anywhere in the US that I would consider moving to until it's time to retire.

[mountainjogger]

Originally Posted by Blansky

Except for the camera crew following you around part. And the beautiful family.

Good point Blansky.

[Goin2drt]

Born and raised in CA. Lived my first 51 yrs there. Moved out 2 years ago and could not be happier. California is nothing of what it used to be and life is too short to be miserable living in that state. It is getting worse, has gotten worse and for those thinking a recall (which probably won't happen) is going to miraculously fix the state I can't help you. you are living in denial. Enjoy your weather before the politicians figure out how to tax you on that as well.

[turkeysub93]

As a Floridian, I've always wondered what life on the West Coast would be like in comparison. I've visited SF and LA and find it hard to really picture the day-to-day as an outsider. Interesting to hear CA perspectives of the state.

[swils8610]

Many people are leaving California for Texas.


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[Blansky]

Originally Posted by turkeysub93

As a Floridian, I've always wondered what life on the West Coast would be like in comparison. I've visited SF and LA and find it hard to really picture the day-to-day as an outsider. Interesting to hear CA perspectives of the state.

No bugs.

Seriously though, like Florida and Texas it's a massive state. And visiting almost anywhere doesn't really give you a very good picture of life there.

LA and SF are pretty large urban areas although SF is more bay area, as SF itself is pretty small. But there are so many other parts of the state. Wine country, Central Valley, Santa Barbara and San Diego coastal paradises. But tons of medium and small towns with varying lifestyles and climate. And due to the ocean there are micro climates that within few miles can produce different kind of wines.

It would be like saying Florida is Miami and Disney World.

[Nikrnic]

California dreamn' has been dead for many years. I've always wanted to move there and did so in the early 80s. LA then Orange county. I left in the latter 80s and returned to MI and now spend a lot of time in FL. My relatives also left for FL as well. Still have a few friends there but mostly everyone I know say they were fortunate enough to afford to be able to escape. We spend a lot of time in the Sarasota and Siesta Key area and are contemplating a move once I sell my business.

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[Doc Savage]

I've lived and worked in Monterey and San Francisco. Monterey was 6 months while I was attending DLI (language school) in the military, but it was a lovely area.

I began my civilian government career in San Francisco in the mid-90s, and I like the Bay Area. The cost of living is what drove me out, and it is ridiculously more expensive there now. If not for that crazy cost of living, I might consider moving back (if the state wasn't on fire every summer).

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by Doc Savage

...... I might consider moving back (if the state wasn't on fire every summer).

Good news. They've extended the fires to year round. And Oregon too.

[TheVTCGuy]

Originally Posted by jpeezy14@hotmail.com

As a USC alum

Oh…. You’re a USC alum Jesse? OK, NOW I understand…


By the way, here is me singlehandedly kicking your team’s A$$ in a PAC-10 playoff game. This picture is from 19 blah de blah, but I remember it well. Look at those legs!!!

[TheVTCGuy]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Move to Texas or Florida like tens of thousands of other Californians have done over the past few years. Imagine the tax savings alone! ... let alone the better homes for the $ plus safer neighborhoods and beaches.

Come join us, you'll love living here.

Is my room ready Steven?

[JParm]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

Oh…. You’re a USC alum Jesse? OK, NOW I understand…


By the way, here is me singlehandedly kicking your team’s A$$ in a PAC-10 playoff game. This picture is from 19 blah de blah, but I remember it well. Look at those legs!!!

And here we are, thinking we were friends...

I'm an Academy guy 1st, 'SC guy 2nd!

[Cru Jones]

If California were a separate country, it would have the fifth largest economy in the world ahead of India and just behind Germany. It’s the center of global tech and pop culture. Its universities are world class. The weather and beaches are nice.

No place is perfect, but I think California will be just fine.

[ashbaug2]

My parents were both born and raised in the Central Valley wine region, and I was born there in the mid-80s. We moved to Oregon in 1991, but still visited multiple times a year, and eventually my parents moved back while my sister and I both moved to Reno (just a hop, skip, and a jump from them). That was 2002 when I moved, and this place has seen a fairly steady stream of Californians coming over because of increased taxes, population growth, and terrible infrastructure management. That's almost 20 years here, but that California exodus started even before that with people leaving for Oregon in the 80s and 90s (not a good omen for Nevada looking at how that turned out, IMO...). While I was born there, I don't consider myself a Californian. I've been all over the state, and I used to love visiting SF or Monterey or LA or SD... but the last few times we went were terrible experiences. So we stopped visiting. We still go to Napa, and went to Palm Springs earlier this year, but any of the more populated areas are out of the question.

Here in Reno, we are seeing a massive influx of both businesses and people flocking across the border to live and set up shop. Sure, it's bolstering our economy, but at what price? The housing market is insane and impossible to buy in right now, with so many California cash buyers getting out of their overpriced homes and driving up the prices here. They're already bringing their politics with them, turning the "Wild West" of Nevada into a mini-California. I've spent the entirety of my adult life (minus a few years deployed in the Army to places that make me very thankful to be an American...) here in Reno, and I can't imagine living anywhere else... until they start raising my taxes more for things that have no clear benefit or identifiable improvement (I'm looking at you, CAL Trans and your highway improvements...).

Someone said the people leaving California dislike change and are therefore leaving because it's evolved too much... I think that everyone is naturally hesitant to change, and that's OK. I'll just say, don't Californicate my Nevada.

[JParm]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

Oh…. You’re a USC alum Jesse? OK, NOW I understand…


By the way, here is me singlehandedly kicking your team’s A$$ in a PAC-10 playoff game. This picture is from 19 blah de blah, but I remember it well. Look at those legs!!!

Originally Posted by jpeezy14@hotmail.com

And here we are, thinking we were friends...

I'm an Academy guy 1st, 'SC guy 2nd!

Also - THIS is what California / USC is really about.

[Speedbird-1]

[QUOTE No place is perfect, but I think California will be just fine.[/QUOTE]

They probably said similar things about Rome,......around 478AD.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

Is my room ready Steven?

Sure ;-)

Btw, I lived in Napa in the 1970s.... I would not live there today.

jmho

Cali lost it's cool vibe and casualness years ago. You can't just walk around at night, beautiful scenery is now home developments with little boxes on the hillside, little boxes made of ticky-tacky.....

Of course that can be said for many places. I remember SoBe when it was run down retirement apts.

I remember ATL.......

But today, Cali has two worlds it seems. So perhaps it depends on the one you live in?

Like NYC, I love visiting Cali and some fun places and experiences, sure, yet the overhead cost are not commiserate with the experience. Florida and Texas offer excellent alternatives.

[ashbaug2]

They probably said similar things about Rome,......around 478AD.[/QUOTE]

Yup.

[M45]

Originally Posted by ashbaug2

My parents were both born and raised in the Central Valley wine region, and I was born there in the mid-80s. We moved to Oregon in 1991, but still visited multiple times a year, and eventually my parents moved back while my sister and I both moved to Reno (just a hop, skip, and a jump from them). That was 2002 when I moved, and this place has seen a fairly steady stream of Californians coming over because of increased taxes, population growth, and terrible infrastructure management. That's almost 20 years here, but that California exodus started even before that with people leaving for Oregon in the 80s and 90s (not a good omen for Nevada looking at how that turned out, IMO...). While I was born there, I don't consider myself a Californian. I've been all over the state, and I used to love visiting SF or Monterey or LA or SD... but the last few times we went were terrible experiences. So we stopped visiting. We still go to Napa, and went to Palm Springs earlier this year, but any of the more populated areas are out of the question.

Here in Reno, we are seeing a massive influx of both businesses and people flocking across the border to live and set up shop. Sure, it's bolstering our economy, but at what price? The housing market is insane and impossible to buy in right now, with so many California cash buyers getting out of their overpriced homes and driving up the prices here. They're already bringing their politics with them, turning the "Wild West" of Nevada into a mini-California. I've spent the entirety of my adult life (minus a few years deployed in the Army to places that make me very thankful to be an American...) here in Reno, and I can't imagine living anywhere else... until they start raising my taxes more for things that have no clear benefit or identifiable improvement (I'm looking at you, CAL Trans and your highway improvements...).

Someone said the people leaving California dislike change and are therefore leaving because it's evolved too much... I think that everyone is naturally hesitant to change, and that's OK. I'll just say, don't Californicate my Nevada.

I have spoken to people who have left San Francisco because it’s just too damn expensive and too dangerous and when I confronted them that this is what they voted for, they just have a blank look on their faces and say that “it’s more complicated than that.”

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by M45

I have spoken to people who have left San Francisco because it’s just too damn expensive and too dangerous and when I confronted them that this is what they voted for, they just have a blank look on their faces and say that “it’s more complicated than that.”

FL Sheriff said the same thing to...

https://www.newsweek.com/florida-she...-north-1584798

So if you do move to FL, please don't screw things up here as you did over there. Thank you.

PS.... Ok, to be fair this week in Florida you can come home to a naked woman in your pool. Alas CA fans, think her body parts were 100% natural.

skinny.jpg

[Speedbird-1]

Originally Posted by M45

I have spoken to people who have left San Francisco because it’s just too damn expensive and too dangerous and when I confronted them that this is what they voted for, they just have a blank look on their faces and say that “it’s more complicated than that.”

I get the distinct feeling, that there's an elephant in the room.

What exactly is spoiling California?

[pickettt]

There are worse places to live. I know because I’ve lived in some of them.