eBay sale gone wrong

[RRsDJ]

I sold my DJ about 3 1/2 weeks ago and the buyer received the DJ last Monday. This past Monday the buyer filed a SNAD claim with Paypal stating "copy of original" and is asking for a partial $1,500.00 refund, which I declined. Hes claims to be a used watch dealer and "I do over 1 million a year just with paypal alone, and only with watches". Hes saying that the bracelet is real 18K. gold but a "fake" and not an authentic President bracelet. I find it strange he deals with Rolexes on a daily basis yet it took him a week to come to the conclusion that it was "fake". Hes given me no proof other than his word, which quite frankly doesnt mean a whole lot.

I took my DJ to a Rolex AD in Houston about 5yrs. ago and had them polish the watch & bracelet. While it was there they said I needed to have both of the spring bars replaced so I gave them the go ahead. They dealt directly with the bracelet and said nothing of it being a counterfeit when I picked it up. I can see an AD maybe working on some aftermarket parts but NOT a counterfeit part!

I was emailing with him back and forth non-stop from 9am - 6pm yesterday trying to come to some type of solution and nothing was accomplished. I dont need this headache so at about 8pm I sent him one last email and said to just return the watch and I'll give him a full refund, which he'll easily get because Paypal has put a "temporary hold" on my funds. I find it odd now all of the sudden hes a ghost. I have a feeling Im about to be scammed big time!


I know yall are experts, what do yall think? I have plenty more pictures at home if another angle will help or if I need to post larger pictures so you can see more detail.

[MonBK]

Name and shame the bastard.

[Tools]

Seems like the buyer is just trying to get a reduced price through a con with pay-pal..

[RRsDJ]

Originally Posted by MonBK

Name and shame the bastard.

Yes sir! :)

He purchased my DJ under the eBay user name: REARLUNGE

And heres a quote from one of his eBay messages: "LOOK AT MY FEEDBACK, READ IT!!! I'm REARLUNGE, K070792, 112668G and 225FOR35"


To his credit he has purchased ALOT of Rolexes as well as other very expensive watches so thats what has me scratching my head. Why me and why a bracelet of all things!??

Originally Posted by Tools

Seems like the buyer is just trying to get a reduced price through a con with pay-pal..

You know what, I think you hit the nail on the head. I told my wife I priced my DJ to others and he bought it for $6,400.00, which I never expected to get. I wondered how he is going to make a profit. 1980s DJs are not going for $7K+ but if he got a $1,500.00 refund, hed be getting it for $4,900.00, which he stands to make a profit.

[crowncollection]

Looks ok, I think you being scammed, pm me I have one question as you can't see one thing you look for in the photos

[Blong]

His name isn't Brad Wenzel is it? Usually he uses eBay name time4preston...I believe he is based somewhere in Texas and has been known to use his large number of purchases through eBay to take advantage of some honest sellers. If that is who you are dealing with, google his name or search it on this site and you will see what I am talking about.

[RRsDJ]

Originally Posted by crowncollection

Looks ok, I think you being scammed, pm me I have one question as you can't see one thing you look for in the photos

PM sent.

Originally Posted by Blong

His name isn't Brad Wenzel is it? Usually he uses eBay name time4preston...I believe he is based somewhere in Texas and has been known to use his large number of purchases through eBay to take advantage of some honest sellers. If that is who you are dealing with, google his name or search it on this site and you will see what I am talking about.

No its not Brad, its Chad. This guy is located in Glen Cove, New York 11542

[Monte Cristo]

Hope it gets sorted out soon and you get your money!

[financeman]

That sucks. I hope you can get all this worked out. You already offered him a full refund so if he is not willing t d that then it is pretty obvious he is just trying t get it at a discount.
Good luck

[ralpie]

It was very decent of you to offer a full refund. I think Chad will get back to you.

I have dealt with Chad, he bought a watch from me on eBay as 225for35 . I met him in person, he paid the agreed upon price and was very cordial. He is not great with answering emails.

I am actually about to sell him another.

Have you considered that it may be an Italian gold bracelet with the correct clasp?

I have seen that many many times without the seller even knowing.

[Kiyomikanai]

Im the buyer!! The bracelet is fake!! Fake!! Fake!! You schmucks obviously are not rolex buyers..he can cry, stomp his feet, pull his hair out and believe whatever he wants.......the band is fake!! I told him to either refund me $1500 or take the watch back, he refused both..and for u putz's who think u can tell a bracelet is real from pictures, good luck!!

[RRsDJ]

Originally Posted by ralpie

It was very decent of you to offer a full refund. I think Chad will get back to you.

I have dealt with Chad, he bought a watch from me on eBay as 225for35 . I met him in person, he paid the agreed upon price and was very cordial. He is not great with answering emails.

I am actually about to sell him another.

Have you considered that it may be an Italian gold bracelet with the correct clasp?

I have seen that many many times without the seller even knowing.

He told me the clasp had "fake" markings.

[77T]

Originally Posted by ralpie

It was very decent of you to offer a full refund. I think Chad will get back to you.

I have dealt with Chad, he bought a watch from me on eBay as 225for35 . I met him in person, he paid the agreed upon price and was very cordial. He is not great with answering emails.

I am actually about to sell him another.

That is encouraging.

To the OP, yes accept the return and do a refund. It is best path.

Make sure eBay & PayPal know you have offered that and will not accept discounting the sale. And explain buyer has not answered your emails to that effect.

Send him daily messages via eBay messaging with a reasonable deadline to act.

[crowncollection]

Originally Posted by RRsDJ

He told me the clasp had "fake" markings.

if he says its the clasp only, we really need to see a real close up of the ladies head and a screw head and thread some of this info you will find here at this link some you won't Pm there is one more check still
heres a link they may help you,

http://www.lockmaker.com.au/watchmak...ebracelet.html

[TPLGT]

OP, I hope it works out....this stuff is stressful!

[RRsDJ]

Originally Posted by crowncollection

if he says its the clasp only, we really need to see a real close up of the ladies head and a screw head and thread some of this info you will find here at this link some you won't Pm there is one more check still
heres a link they may help you,

http://www.clockmaker.com.au/watchma...ebracelet.html

I have that same link bookmarked but just like in that picture, there's no G on the lady head? He only mentions the G on the Saint Bernard.

Ill post up a large picture tomorrow of the clasp from my work computer. I've had a bad day and now a bad night. My directv modem isn't getting any power so no wifi and while messing with my laptop and connecting the modem directly to my laptop I cracked the screen while sitting it down on the floor next to the modem!!!

HPs coming out Monday to fix it and I got a modem being delivered tomorrow. Gotta love amazon prime! :)




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[RRsDJ]

Originally Posted by ralpie

It was very decent of you to offer a full refund. I think Chad will get back to you.

I have dealt with Chad, he bought a watch from me on eBay as 225for35 . I met him in person, he paid the agreed upon price and was very cordial. He is not great with answering emails.

I am actually about to sell him another.

If you speak / see him ask him why he won't show me any proof of it being "fake". All he has ever said is trust him its "fake".

That's pretty hard to do when I've never met him NOR have ever done business with him before.


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[crowncollection]

G on the queens head on her neck is harder to see, always has been their, it is a legal requirement, queens head means the gold was formed (not literally dug up from swiss ground necesary) but shaped in switzerland and 18k gold, other metals and purities had other hallmarks in the old days see below. More recently the dogs head from approx 1995 onwards, the G is for the geneve assay office which rolex use, counterfieters are getting pretty good at the queens head and st bernard's head especially a certain hong kong seller, i have not seen a fakey for while in the flesh where i can get a good look with a loupe, so i am unsure if they have corrected this absent G. There are also two more ways to tell if its original, i do not want to give away all the tricks on a open forum, i have PM you requesting specific photos, which will absolutely tell if its real or fake regards


straight from wiki no huge research done, i am sure most probably know all this, as of 1995 all precious metals use the st bernards head regardless of wether its gold, or platnuim regardless of purity 18k, 14k etc.

The st bernards head below is the Swiss hallmark used since 1995 for all metals and all fineness
The Swiss hallmarks used on the watch cases. Although hallmarking in the Swiss territories dates back to Geneva in the 15th century there was no uniform system of hallmarking in Switzerland until 1881. Before that time, hallmarking was undertaken at the local level by the Swiss cantons. With the introduction of the Swiss system of hallmarking in 1881, there was uniformity throughout the nation.

Distinctive symbol:
other swiss assay offices and symbols below

Biel / Bienne B
Basel *
Chiasso T
Geneva G
La Chaux-de-Fonds C
Le Noirmont J
Zurich Z


These symbols will appear in place of the "X" on the ear of the St. Bernard dog. Under the current law, on all gold, silver, platinum or palladium watches cases made in Switzerland or imported into Switzerland, (Fr.) there shall be affixed, near the Maker's Responsibility Mark and his indication of purity, the official Hallmark, the head of a Saint-Bernard dog (illustrated below). Only precious metal watch cases must be hallmarked.

[RRsDJ]

Just received this reply. I wonder why "GOD" won't post any proof!????

"wow!! just recieved 2 phone calls about u posting on rolex forum...listen, IM A GOD IN THIS BUSINESS..THE BRACELET IS FAKE!!IF IT WAS REAL, YES, I CAN SELL IT FOR A PROFIT, THATS WHAT I DO. KARMA IS A WONDERFUL THING, THE MORE YOU GIVE, THE MORE YOU GET..I GET THE FEELING, THINGS HAVE NOT GONE SO WELL FOR YOU. EITHER WAY, YOU NEED TO START WRAPPING UR HEAD AROUND THE FACT THAT THE BRACELET IS FAKE."


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[crowncollection]

here's the st bernard up close, i am at work, i have perfect close up of the older hallmark the helvetia at home, but i am at work, i better do some soon

i will post it tonight

[ralpie]

OP, Sorry if I came off as doubting your story, I don't know Chad other than our one transaction and one pending. Just sold him a watch. I felt I should mention my story to alleviate your concerns and give him a fair shake, as my transaction with him was good. You and him should both go thorough all the necessary motions to resolve this to your satisfaction.

[caryyee]

If the buyer isn't satisfied, then why doesn't he just say 'ok, I'd like to return the watch for a full refund'. It's as simple as that ... you get your watch back, and the buyer is none the worse off.

[crowncollection]

Originally Posted by caryyee

If the buyer isn't satisfied, then why doesn't he just say 'ok, I'd like to return the watch for a full refund'. It's as simple as that ... you get your watch back, and the buyer is none the worse off.

i agree with Cary, no discount, return the whole watch, especially if you believe the band to be original as per info provided when you get home and look under a loupe

[sleddog]

Originally Posted by Kiyomikanai

Im the buyer!! The bracelet is fake!! Fake!! Fake!! You schmucks obviously are not rolex buyers..he can cry, stomp his feet, pull his hair out and believe whatever he wants.......the band is fake!! I told him to either refund me $1500 or take the watch back, he refused both..and for u putz's who think u can tell a bracelet is real from pictures, good luck!!

Always happy to hear the 'other side' of the story.
Or, should I say, completely ignorant and baseless.

Now, all you've done is say it's fake.
How about, you show some proof, to, at the very least, gain a little credibility!!

However. If you wish to continue on these boards with the condescending attitude you portray, your time here will be short lived!

There are some people here that have, undoubtedly, a far greater knowledge than yourself.
Not to mention a superior grasp of manners!

Tread carefully!

[FeelingTheBlues]

Originally Posted by Kiyomikanai

Im the buyer!! The bracelet is fake!! Fake!! Fake!! You schmucks obviously are not rolex buyers..he can cry, stomp his feet, pull his hair out and believe whatever he wants.......the band is fake!! I told him to either refund me $1500 or take the watch back, he refused both..and for u putz's who think u can tell a bracelet is real from pictures, good luck!!

This is, hands down, the worst way I've ever seen somebody introducing himself, let alone trying to prove to a whole lot of people on a watch enthusiasts (and connoisseurs) forum they're wrong. There's absolutely nothing constructive or even useful in your post...

[financeman]

Originally Posted by FeelingTheBlues

This is, hands down, the worst way I've ever seen somebody introducing himself, let alone trying to prove to a whole lot of people on a watch enthusiasts (and connoisseurs) forum they're wrong. There's absolutely nothing constructive or even useful in your post...

I agree. He is definitely coming across as a big D-bag.
Give us some proof on why it is a fake. I know we aren't worthy to hear from your wealth of knowledge. Us commoners and lowly watch guys would be honored to learn from you.



Anyone else since my sarcasm because I paid it on a tad thick. Lol

[cajunron]

Originally Posted by sleddog

Always happy to hear the 'other side' of the story.
Or, should I say, completely ignorant and baseless.

Now, all you've done is say it's fake.
How about, you show some proof, to, at the very least, gain a little credibility!!

However. If you wish to continue on these boards with the condescending attitude you portray, your time here will be short lived!

There are some people here that have, undoubtedly, a far greater knowledge than yourself.
Not to mention a superior grasp of manners!

Tread carefully!

VERY well said, Rob! Couldn't have said it better myself.

[RRsDJ]

Originally Posted by Kiyomikanai

Im the buyer!! The bracelet is fake!! Fake!! Fake!! You schmucks obviously are not rolex buyers..he can cry, stomp his feet, pull his hair out and believe whatever he wants.......the band is fake!! I told him to either refund me $1500 or take the watch back, he refused both..and for u putz's who think u can tell a bracelet is real from pictures, good luck!!

I just saw this.

You keep saying I'm mad, I'm crying etc. not one time have I been rude to you. Not one time have I done any name calling as you like to do. All I've ever asked for was proof yet you refuse to? You keep saying I should trust you. Look at how you respond on here. How in the world are you a business man?

Instead of name calling how about you post up some proof. And from Rolex not your buddy with a corner jewelry shop that will write whatever you tell him to!


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[crowncollection]

I have no interest in defaming anyone or in this sale financially, and have not directed anything towards this Brad guy. However, this guy has annoyed me now, he should at least acknowledge members of this forum also have good knowledege, not just him. I do not appreciate being called smuck or a putz. I am just clarifying authenticity for a member who has asked for help, that is what we do here in this community as he has been brought to question by a buyer, I do not expect to be abused because of it. So i offer a chance for you Brad to make some comments on the topics below, so this smuck can understand why you think it's fake. Is the G their ? the photos are not close up enough, I grant you that for us to tell 100%, but you have the band in your hands I believe so you can answer If the answer is yes, lets move on to a few more things I know we can check that are not general knowledge or found on the net. Weight of the link ?, screw head and thread, any problems you would like to mention ?, examine the link screw hole on the main part of the link (the hole itself), any comments ? and the welds on the clasp, any comments ?. Care to make a comment ? so all us putz's on the forum can share in your wealth of knowledge, educate me please, as you can see i know nothing or do you not know what I am talking about ?.

[Nikos5559]

he was out of nyc area? he bought a DJ off me on ebay and tried the same thing with me saying the band was after market this guy is the worst of the worst, finds ebay sellers with good feedback but not to many high end sales and over pays for the watch then pulls this crap!!!