Water resistance question

[shaunnnn]

Hello experts!

Obviously more of a lurker than a forum participant. I very fortunately own both the 5712 and 5711 (managed to purchase them before all the hype). They are around 5 years of age. Patek has recommended servicing and maintenance every 5 years which includes oiling and checking/replacing water resistance bands etc.

As such, is it not advisable for the watch to touch water between now till I send the watch in for a service? I am not referring to bringing the watch for swims/dives etc, but rather, just running it under tap water for a rinse. This is so as I live in a hot/sunny/humid tropical climate and the watches do occasionally come into contact with some sweat/ sunscreen etc. Hence, a rinse would be cool to remove the sweat/marks etc, but am afraid of the integrity of the water resistance seal.

Looking forward to your inputs! Thank you!

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by shaunnnn

Hello experts!

Obviously more of a lurker than a forum participant. I very fortunately own both the 5712 and 5711 (managed to purchase them before all the hype). They are around 5 years of age. Patek has recommended servicing and maintenance every 5 years which includes oiling and checking/replacing water resistance bands etc.

As such, is it not advisable for the watch to touch water between now till I send the watch in for a service? I am not referring to bringing the watch for swims/dives etc, but rather, just running it under tap water for a rinse. This is so as I live in a hot/sunny/humid tropical climate and the watches do occasionally come into contact with some sweat/ sunscreen etc. Hence, a rinse would be cool to remove the sweat/marks etc, but am afraid of the integrity of the water resistance seal.

Looking forward to your inputs! Thank you!

actually i m a pro in that
Rolex oversized gaskets are fine for 10yrs(or even more), however Patek is different , all thin and delicate. It works flawless but not overprotected(single gasaket on crown, snapback on 5712,etc).I ve seen ppl reporting water damage on 3-4years old watches, so I m extra cautious with my 5712.It was serviced in 2016 and I bring for pressure test yearly.Also please do not put the watch direct under the faucet the tap water pressure could be easily 4-6atm(60-88psi) which may exceed the limits of a used gasket .

[Andad]

Originally Posted by Passionata

actually i m a pro in that
Rolex oversized gaskets are fine for 10yrs(or even more), however Patek is different , all thin and delicate. It works flawless but not overprotected(single gasaket on crown, snapback on 5712,etc).I ve seen ppl reporting water damage on 3-4years old watches, so I m extra cautious with my 5712.It was serviced in 2016 and I bring for pressure test yearly.Also please do not put the watch direct under the faucet the tap water pressure could be easily 4-6atm(60-88psi) which may exceed the limits of a used gasket .

Citation?

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by Andad

Citation?

Seiko GS manual

"Residential water pressure tends to range between 45 and 80 psi (pounds per square inch). "
https://www.plumbingsupply.com/resid...explained.html

[77T]

If you have any concerns about the 5 y.o. gaskets, then have each watch pressure checked by a watchmaker.

3ATM should be sufficient (equivalent to 42 PSI). If they pass then no worries about the water taps in your home.

The PSI of washing under a normal water tap will actually be quite low. Normal homes have a water pressure generally between 40 and 60 PSI. While you could live in a home as high as 80 PSI, you’d have to spray at highest setting with a high pressure nozzle to achieve that.

Most washing is done at about 28 PSI. Anything higher would be uncomfortable against your skin.


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[Calatrava r]

Originally Posted by Passionata

actually i m a pro in that
Rolex oversized gaskets are fine for 10yrs(or even more), however Patek is different , all thin and delicate. It works flawless but not overprotected(single gasaket on crown, snapback on 5712,etc).I ve seen ppl reporting water damage on 3-4years old watches, so I m extra cautious with my 5712.It was serviced in 2016 and I bring for pressure test yearly.Also please do not put the watch direct under the faucet the tap water pressure could be easily 4-6atm(60-88psi) which may exceed the limits of a used gasket .

What your describing, with the "thin and delicate seals", is a watch which is not water resistant. Patek does recommend yearly pressure testing. Now we know why. I never submerge any Patek in water.

[Lindhuirst]

Originally Posted by 77T

If you have any concerns about the 5 y.o. gaskets, then have each watch pressure checked by a watchmaker.

3ATM should be sufficient (equivalent to 42 PSI). If they pass then no worries about the water taps in your home.

The PSI of washing under a normal water tap will actually be quite low. Normal homes have a water pressure generally between 40 and 60 PSI. While you could live in a home as high as 80 PSI, you’d have to spray at highest setting with a high pressure nozzle to achieve that.

Most washing is done at about 28 PSI. Anything higher would be uncomfortable against your skin.


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Now you teached me something very good.

So you are saying that a 3 ATM watch (head only in my cases) can be washed under water no problem?

I heard a big no no for all types of water contact on a 3 ATM.
Like even rain is bad news...

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by Lindhuirst

Now you teached me something very good.

So you are saying that a 3 ATM watch (head only in my cases) can be washed under water no problem?

I heard a big no no for all types of water contact on a 3 ATM.
Like even rain is bad news...

3ATM fine against splashing water, accidental quick submerge maybe ok(personally wouldn t recommend) but i wouldn t keep it there long.You can always keep it clean with a wet tissue.

[77T]

Both of your watches are are claimed to be water-resistant; 5711 to 120m, 5712 to 60m.

Patek Philippe states: ”The water-resistance of watches is assured with seals that protect them against the ingress of moisture and dust. We recommend having the water-resistance of your watch checked once a year by an authorized Service Center or a Quick Service dealer. The check takes only a few minutes.”


https://www.patek.com/en/collection/...us/5711-1A-010

https://www.patek.com/en/collection/...us/5712-1A-001



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[77T]

Originally Posted by Passionata

3ATM fine against splashing water, accidental quick submerge maybe ok(personally wouldn t recommend) but i wouldn t keep it there long.You can always keep it clean with a wet tissue.

I think you are welcome to treat your PP’s as you wish, but you are sharing misinformation.

You can safely submerge any watch that has passed a pressure test. Patek states 60m & 120m respectively for the OP’s models - why the scare tactics?


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[shaunnnn]

Wow thanks for all the inputs. Guess the best course of action would then be a quick pressure test at my local SC. (Would not prefer a service considering cost, turnaround time and the fact that the watches are not worn very frequently and not kept on winder)

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by 77T

I think you are welcome to treat your PP’s as you wish, but you are sharing misinformation.

You can safely submerge any watch that has passed a pressure test. Patek states 60m & 120m respectively for the OP’s models - why the scare tactics?


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You may can read what I wrote ,3ATM=30m WR I ve reacted to an other post.I ve already replied to the OP in a previous post.

[77T]

Originally Posted by Passionata

You may can read what I wrote ,3ATM=30m WR I ve reacted to an other post.I ve already replied to the OP in a previous post.

Regardless of why you reacted, so you agree your information is incorrect for the OP’s watches? All one has to do is read PP’s own statements which are provided above in post #9


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[shaunnnn]

And do pardon me for my apparent ignorance! The 5712 and 5711 are incidentally my 1st and 2nd pateks respectively. More used to wearing datejusts, which are daily beaters going without service for > 10 years, and run just fine. (Albeit less accurate time keeping) But no major mechanical issues.

[77T]

Originally Posted by shaunnnn

And do pardon me for my apparent ignorance! The 5712 and 5711 are incidentally my 1st and 2nd pateks respectively. More used to wearing datejusts, which are daily beaters going without service for > 10 years, and run just fine. (Albeit less accurate time keeping) But no major mechanical issues.

No need to feel ignorant. You now know what Patek has stated and that’s an advantage of posting a question on TRF!


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[fsprow]

Engineer here. Once water leaves the tap, it very quickly expands from the pipe diameter and pressure quickly falls to atmospheric (14.7psi). No problem holding under a tap.

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by 77T

Regardless of why you reacted, so you agree your information is incorrect for the OP’s watches? All one has to do is read PP’s own statements which are provided above in post #9


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Actually the post answers to OP s question is #2 ,#9 is obviously fine too but it wasn t more than a common knowledge you can get from the user manual.Also I think it s a watch forum where ppl come to acquire new/more information about their hobby not an academic competition or an interrogation room.BTW I think a friendly manner suits better to this place.

[Tools]

Originally Posted by shaunnnn

Wow thanks for all the inputs. Guess the best course of action would then be a quick pressure test at my local SC. (Would not prefer a service considering cost, turnaround time and the fact that the watches are not worn very frequently and not kept on winder)

Correct. You don't know what you don't know. 5 years is not a magic time-line where things work on one side of that line, then suddenly stop working on the other side.

A well taken care of time piece can have seals that last for many years, but other times they fail quickly for no known reason.

[supernova]

Originally Posted by fsprow

Engineer here. Once water leaves the tap, it very quickly expands from the pipe diameter and pressure quickly falls to atmospheric (14.7psi). No problem holding under a tap.

This. The 4-6 atm is the pressure in the pipes, not when out of taps flowing, therefore any 3 atm water resistant watch should ok under a normal running tap. It also means the watch should be safe to submerge stationary up to 3atm (30m).

The modern PPs you noted, which are rated more than 3 atms, I personally would have no problem having under a tap or shower.

[Pim]

As it seems we have experts in the house so here is a related question

My 5524G has a WP rating of 60m. I e-mailed Patek asking if I could go for a swim with this watch and they answered 'yes'. Obviously the watch should be tested first before even thinking of that but I keep reading that 50m (or 60m) is NOT enough to go swimming. At the moment i'm scared as *** to submerge the watch.

What is your opinion ??

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by Pim

As it seems we have experts in the house so here is a related question

My 5524G has a WP rating of 60m. I e-mailed Patek asking if I could go for a swim with this watch and they answered 'yes'. Obviously the watch should be tested first before even thinking of that but I keep reading that 50m (or 60m) is NOT enough to go swimming. At the moment i'm scared as *** to submerge the watch.

What is your opinion ??

I did contact with Patek regarding 60m WR(5712)used to be , the answer was , watch is fine for swimming but no springboards due to the extra pressure it may builds up when you hit the water.
So i think the 60WR is fine,you got two pushers at 8 and 10 which could be locked (unlocked pushers under water act like a pump if you push it accidentaly)
that s fine too , the only weak point is the crown since 5524 has no screwdown crown , the screw in crown minimise the movement of the crown stem and prevent the crown from being accidentally pulled out underwater .
I think you can bring the watch into water (with a waterproof strap) w/o too much concerns however a G shock maybe a better alternative than a 50grand pilot watch.

[Humble michael]

I have & Pateks and several Rollexes and the ones w waterproof straps or bracelets I put in jewelry cleaner completely submerged and then rinse under cold tap water - never had a problem. I do like to loosen the stem and then tighten to make sure seal is tight- also on occasion will submerge in pool - never had a problem. OP I would not and I don’t send any timepiece in for service unless there is a problem. Just what works for me. :-))

[supernova]

If Patek tell you it’s ok to swim in and you don’t trust them, then why bother asking? Do you think you know something they don’t about the watch they created?


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[Andad]

Originally Posted by Passionata

Seiko GS manual

"Residential water pressure tends to range between 45 and 80 psi (pounds per square inch). "
https://www.plumbingsupply.com/resid...explained.html

So Seiko’s can’t handle a sprinkle of water.

Watch out for the garden hose when wearing one.

The level of misinformation is now becoming laughable.

Seriously let’s list some facts:

1) Don’t move your hand too quickly or swim fast when wearing your a Rolex under water.
The extra speed will breach the seals.

2) Don’t dive into water when wearing your Rolex.
The water will rush in past the seals.

Feel free to add some more facts.

[Pim]

Originally Posted by supernova

If Patek tell you it’s ok to swim in and you don’t trust them, then why bother asking? Do you think you know something they don’t about the watch they created?


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It is still possible to have irrational fears, isn't it?
Like I said, i'm no expert on the subject so the best I can do is ask experiences from other forum members

Glad I could clear that up for you

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by Andad

So Seiko’s can’t handle a sprinkle of water.

Watch out for the garden hose when wearing one.

The level of misinformation is now becoming laughable.

Seriously let’s list some facts:

1) Don’t move your hand too quickly or swim fast when wearing your a Rolex under water.
The extra speed will breach the seals.

2) Don’t dive into water when wearing your Rolex.
The water will rush in past the seals.

Feel free to add some more facts.

No misinformation here (if someone read the details with interest)rather ignorance,misreading compensated with a nice chunk of arrogance . HAGWE

Originally Posted by Pim

It is still possible to have irrational fears, isn't it?
Like I said, i'm no expert on the subject so the best I can do is ask experiences from other forum members

Glad I could clear that up for you

no worry , your question was valid ,"There is no such thing as a dumb question"

[Andad]

Originally Posted by Passionata

No misinformation here (if someone read the details with interest)rather ignorance,misreading compensated with a nice chunk of arrogance . HAGWE




no worry , your question was valid ,"There is no such thing as a dumb question"

After 9 years on the Forum I expected more?

A recognised watch manufactured specifies 3 Bar but you would clean it with a wet tissue?

[eanzenberg]

End of day, Patek’s require yearly inspection to safely bring to the pool while Rolex can go 10 years without bother to bring into the pool.

[Andad]

In most discussions related to watch water resistance it is a given that the seals are up to the manufacturers specs otherwise there would be no guarantee of water resistance.

If I checked one of my watches (any brand any price point) and it held the crystal deflection at 6 Bar then I would wear it swimming, diving and snorkelling to that tested depth.

Manufacturers mostly stay on the safe conservative side of performance - even Rolex.

I gave up scuba diving many years ago.

E.

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by Andad

After 9 years on the Forum I expected more?

A recognised watch manufactured specifies 3 Bar but you would clean it with a wet tissue?

Exactly that what I do ,the SA at Patek Geneve Salon advised the same ,and he is fully trained watchmaker with 10years manufacturing experience from the Manufacture.I have a PP collector friend he does the same with all his watches rated 3ATM or less.I know technically and theoretically it can withstand to submerge for a couple of seconds but better safe than sorry