Rafal Zebrowski - Francis Jewellers 617 Broughton St, Victoria BC Canada V8W 1C9

[oysterquartz17000]

Rafal Zebrowski - Francis Jewellers have sold a rolex to me with a fake bezel and a reshaped bezel insert to fit this fake watch.

I lodged a dispute with paypal who closed the case in Rafal Zebrowski - Francis Jewellers favour stating the bezel was materially similar to a vintage bezel.

Rafal Zebrowski - Francis Jewellers have dropped off the radar in terms of communication, so not much more can be done now from my end.

Just a warning here to anyone who has thoughts of dealing with them, as they do sell vintage watches, including rolex's.

[oysterquartz17000]

Also, an interesting resolution from paypal there, so if a part is materially similar the seller has the right to sell it as an geunine item? Paypal logic is terrifying and has put me off buying anything again.

[thesharkfactor]

Can you post a picture of the watch?

[77T]

Originally Posted by thesharkfactor

Can you post a picture of the watch?

+1

Why not just do a return using PayPal Purchase Protection? Or does the seller state “no returns”?

Also would like to see the listing if this was an online sale.

A claim such as this one needs more documentation than a posted warning without ocular proof.

PayPal almost always sides with the buyer - it’s a constant complaint of honest sellers. For PP to side with the seller is quite unusual.



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[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by 77T

+1

Why not just do a return using PayPal Purchase Protection? Or does the seller state “no returns”?

Also would like to see the listing if this was an online sale.

A claim such as this one needs more documentation than a posted warning without ocular proof.

PayPal almost always sides with the buyer - it’s a constant complaint of honest sellers. For PP to side with the seller is quite unusual.



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Hi guys, this was the original listing. You can see the bezel in the photos. This listing was discussed here on TRF on another thread and spans two pages. No one else noticed the bezel either.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Rolex-Re...72.m2750.l2649

Paypal have reopened the case as I complained to them that closing a case in favour of the seller as the part in question was materially similar to a genuine part is ludicrous.

[oysterquartz17000]

Also, I have a feeling the bezel itself, albeit not correct for a 1680, is off a vintage dive watch. I am still narrowing down exactly which watch, but I did find a photo of a bezel which looks very similar on an old tudor.

[77T]

Originally Posted by oysterquartz17000

Hi guys, this was the original listing. You can see the bezel in the photos. This listing was discussed here on TRF on another thread and spans two pages. No one else noticed the bezel either.



https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Rolex-Re...72.m2750.l2649



Paypal have reopened the case as I complained to them that closing a case in favour of the seller as the part in question was materially similar to a genuine part is ludicrous.

Now I am really baffled...

In that other thread you said someone paid $7,000 for this watch in an incredulous post. You didn’t tell us you bought it.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=694434

And everyone warned in that thread: it was only good for for parts.

Now you’re crying foul even after knowing there was a “no return” policy...


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[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by 77T

Now I am really baffled...

In that other thread you said someone paid $7,000 for this watch in an incredulous post. You didn’t tell us you bought it.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=694434

And everyone warned in that thread: it was only good for for parts.

Now you’re crying foul even after knowing there was a “no return” policy...


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The point of my post was to warn others that this seller flogs watches with incorrect parts.

[101031-28]

Originally Posted by 77T

Now I am really baffled...

In that other thread you said someone paid $7,000 for this watch in an incredulous post. You didn’t tell us you bought it.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=694434

And everyone warned in that thread: it was only good for for parts.

Now you’re crying foul even after knowing there was a “no return” policy...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

This.

[101031-28]

OP you knew what you were getting. Get the watch fixed and enjoy! Seller was upfront with the watch and its condition. I spoke with them prior to placing my bid (you won) and they were very professional and honest about the watch being a project/for parts only type deal.

[77T]

Originally Posted by oysterquartz17000

The point of my post was to warn others that this seller flogs watches with incorrect parts.

OK - but he was selling parts.




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[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by 101031-28

OP you knew what you were getting. Get the watch fixed and enjoy! Seller was upfront with the watch and its condition. I spoke with them prior to placing my bid (you won) and they were very professional and honest about the watch being a project/for parts only type deal.

A fake bezel and a bezel insert which has been shaved down in order to fit this fake part were not disclosed in the auction.

Are you all saying you would accept this and move on? The bezel does not fit the watch, it falls off when the watch its turned upside down. Given a jeweller sold this time piece, I find that to be an amazing oversight, don't you?

[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by 77T

OK - but he was selling parts.




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Huh? So if you had bought this and opened the case up and found a pile of seiko parts inside, you would be ok with that?

[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by 101031-28

OP you knew what you were getting. Get the watch fixed and enjoy! Seller was upfront with the watch and its condition. I spoke with them prior to placing my bid (you won) and they were very professional and honest about the watch being a project/for parts only type deal.

You talking about Rafal? The guy is an out and out crook. He neglected to mention so many things in the ebay listing. Such as the fake parts, the glue on the dial where had attempted to perform a restoration himself but ran out of talent etc. Luckily, paypal are starting to see this form my perspective.

[77T]

Originally Posted by oysterquartz17000

Huh? So if you had bought this and opened the case up and found a pile of seiko parts inside, you would be ok with that?

Now you’re just crafting alternative points. The auction had all the parts shown for all to see.

There were no Seiko parts.

You regularly post “is this legit” types of threads yet never asked about this bezel before buying.

We didn’t miss the point you treat TRF like a buying service.


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[101031-28]

Originally Posted by oysterquartz17000

You talking about Rafal? The guy is an out and out crook. He neglected to mention so many things in the ebay listing. Such as the fake parts, the glue on the dial where had attempted to perform a restoration himself but ran out of talent etc. Luckily, paypal are starting to see this form my perspective.

Watch was being sold as is. If the project was out of your repair means, probably would have been best to move on to the next 25k red sub deal out there.

[Littletommy]

Originally Posted by oysterquartz17000

You talking about Rafal? The guy is an out and out crook. He neglected to mention so many things in the ebay listing. Such as the fake parts, the glue on the dial where had attempted to perform a restoration himself but ran out of talent etc. Luckily, paypal are starting to see this form my perspective.

Looking at the listing, it's obvious that this was sold as a 'parts watch' with no returns. Seems to me that PayPal was correct in siding with the seller!

[Chewbacca]

There’s lots of money in vintage scams. Read the details.

Be careful.

[CorradoBrit]

Originally Posted by Littletommy

Looking at the listing, it's obvious that this was sold as a 'parts watch' with no returns. Seems to me that PayPal was correct in siding with the seller!

No foul there

[214270Explorer]

Originally Posted by 101031-28

OP you knew what you were getting. Get the watch fixed and enjoy! Seller was upfront with the watch and its condition. I spoke with them prior to placing my bid (you won) and they were very professional and honest about the watch being a project/for parts only type deal.

OP clearly not paying attention to the listing notes. Clearly.

[Onikage]

Does the movement and everything check out? You could have yourself a 1680 red with a little more part shopping. I can think of worse problems myself. Agree this isn't a dishonest listing.

[haven_seeker]

I must say I’m a bit put off by the OP’s original thread joking/poking fun about the auction, just to see him end up winning it in the end???

After all this, just pretending that stuff never happened and now he wants us to focus on the fact he’s disillusioned by the state of the watch.

And despite the seller’s description, it’s somehow not the OP’s fault.

Incredible.

[CorradoBrit]

Originally Posted by haven_seeker

I must say I’m a bit put off by the OP’s original thread joking/poking fun about the auction, just to see him end up winning it in the end???

After all this, just pretending that stuff never happened and now he wants us to focus on the fact he’s disillusioned by the state of the watch.

And despite the seller’s description, it’s somehow not the OP’s fault.

Incredible.

Probably a cunning plan to put other potential bidders off so he gets a better price. Things didn't work out as expected and now OP is crying over spilled milk. Boohoo

Very rarely do I congratulate PP for siding with seller but in this case perfectly justified given all the facts. This thread should be deleted as a dealer is being unfairly maligned.

I need to dredge a few ponds if people are paying $7K for damage like that

[Old Expat Beast]

I don't get it. Why did you say you didn't bid on the watch in this thread, OP?

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=694434

[CorradoBrit]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

I don't get it. Why did you say you didn't bid on the watch in this thread, OP?

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=694434

I'm guessing the high bidder didn't follow through and this deal was done off Ebay. Hence the PP dispute and not Ebay. Nice to get the truth.

[Old Expat Beast]

I'm wondering why I shouldn't just delete this thread and show OP the exit for dishonesty and wasting members' time.

[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by Onikage

Does the movement and everything check out? You could have yourself a 1680 red with a little more part shopping. I can think of worse problems myself. Agree this isn't a dishonest listing.

Thanks and yes everything else checks out. I am not too worried about the rest of the watch. I already have a 9315 bracelet from 1971.

[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

I'm wondering why I shouldn't just delete this thread and show OP the exit for dishonesty and wasting members' time.

This purchase was made long after the ebay listing ended. I contacted the seller after the auction ended and my opinion had been changed on the piece by other members. To my surprise he told me he had a non paying bidder and asked me if I wanted the watch for a considerable discount. I hope this clarifies things for you. In the other thread you can see my feelings on this watch change in my last few posts. Am I being dishonest? Read that other thread once again please.

[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by CorradoBrit

I'm guessing the high bidder didn't follow through and this deal was done off Ebay. Hence the PP dispute and not Ebay. Nice to get the truth.

Yes, sadly thats what occurred here. I am not sure why people are stating I was dishonest. This purchase occurred in the last two weeks. The auction ended three or four weeks ago now. If you read the other thread Iam bagging this watch for half of it, then when I read some other comments about it my opinion changed.

I will point out though, the thread spans two pages and no one noticed the watch had the incorrect bezel, I didnt notice this either. So my situation could easily have been any other buyers situation.

[oysterquartz17000]

Can I also point out one more major fact here.

When the watch is turned over, the bezel falls off, the insert comes out.

This watch was sold by a jeweller. In the ebay listing, does he mention the ill fitting part? No. OK it was a parts auction, however the watch was depicted as an intact piece. He would have known it was falling to pieces when inverted, why didnt he mention it?