The strength of the 5270P (?)

[Acquisition40]

Whether it's run out in 2021 or not... just a few thoughts and wanted to hear others' agreements/disagreements/other perspectives.

1. I wonder if they'll do another price increase for the 5270P (across the line, too) mid-2021 then discontinue it for 2022.

2. 5270P owners seem to really enjoy the watch—I haven't see too many come up for auction or in secondary markets. And/or everyone's speculating that it'll be run out soon and holding on with dear life!

Also, I'm aware of the listenings on Chrono24, etc. But it does seem like they don't pop up as much, and buyers are holding on and loving it. Anyone see this differently?

3. The 5168 is bigger than the 5167; the 6301P is big(ger); 5524, though pilot's watch by design, is on the large end for a PP; and the ladies 7300, as the newer Twenty-4 has a larger presence, too. All the while retaining older movement bases (except for the 6301P, of course). If they do make a larger Nautilus, it's also likely that the next PCC may be larger (maybe 42mm... dare anyone say 43mm??!) and retain the same movement. I think this because I think the 5167 (and even 5065), the current 5711/5712 are quite perfect. And for context, I have a flat 6.75-7in wrist—I enjoy the 36mm 3940 as much as my IWC Big Pilot.

5970 vs 5270 size preference/how they wear is the ongoing debate, but I really like the 5270 size. It's very wearable as a modern, yet "discreet" grande complication. Compared to my 5230G, it does feel large, but not necessarily compared to my Nautilus (exception is that the P feels heavier). While the 5970P is phenomenal, the the salmon dial on the 5270P doesn't make the watch look bigger or smaller as some lighter/darker colored dials do, but it's a discreet warmth. It's also very readable. The dial feels contained and focused. It doesn't "pop" the way other dials do because it draws you in rather than letting the popping "out." It's not "cool" or "fun," but it certainly is a unique, long-and-steady, ready-for-any-stage-of-life relationship. It's not classic or traditional, but it feels timeless.

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Yes, yes, for many who own it, it sucks that it may go onto production year 4 from a value standpoint, but perhaps they wanted to give the world a fair shot. I also wonder if PP wanted to give some of the models another year, since their production was disrupted by the pandemic.

I'm not sure if they knew how "special" the salmon dial was back in the days, but now, we're all aware of it. It seems unlikely that PP will do another salmon dial PCC as a standard production. And combining that with a possible size-up for the next version of the PCC (have they ever done a new design without changing case size?), I think the 5270P will hold a special place in PP history.

What do others think?

S

[PPcollector]

I agree this is probably one of a lifetime version of the PCC having a Salmon dial as a regular production piece. It will be hard to see another one for at least until Thierry retires and his son or whomever takes control of Patek. As for the secondary market, there are quite a few not just on Chrono24 but also on other resellers. Not sure if they are all the same watches but definitely enough to last couple years of supply. Not sure how many Patek produces per year of this particular reference but hopefully not too many since it may be discontinued either 2021 or 2022. So far, the discontinued list released does not include the 5270P

[jon_jon]

IMHO you either love the salmon dial or it is just "meh". Just like diamonds on the dial of men's watch, you either love it or it or not. I think the popularity of the 5270P would be different if it had a blue or black dial. But then the demand for all metals in the 5270 hasn't been there. The 5270 is a great watch and I own the original. But Patek probably overproduced this series for the liking of collectors.

[tom2517]

If you like this watch buy it on the secondary market. The value of this watch is currently very weak, if you buy it at MSRP the moment you walk out the AD you lose tens of thousands.

Will it go up after discontinued? Who knows, maybe or maybe not. The value for Patek PPCs, besides the vintage ones, are pretty stagnant.


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[Burdeens Jewelry]

We got one of these in PO and I absolutely love it to death. The size is very wearable every day. It doesn’t feel chunky or clunky which one might worry with those two complications stacked. If I didn’t have to put the watch in the case I’d wear it every day. Personally I love the salmon in person as opposed to photos. It has a lot more life in person.

[bob101]

It will be discontinued next year. Buy it while you can.

[Calatrava r]

I have seen many on the secondary market in the 160K range. They may have gone up a little. Try to find a nice example used at the market price. You cannot go wrong this watch if you like it and will wear it. People tire of a manual PC. These watches come from an era when all watches were manual wind. Today people want automatic PCs so they can leave them on a winder when not in use.

[Lobha]

The main problem its 5270series is not that popular and the production is high.
if nautilus has salmon dial with long period production, it ll not end up like 5270P cos reference its popular.
It might also impact the ultra rare piece in PCC(salmon dial) cos people have other reasonable choices.

Seems the only hope we have left its the massive retail(tag) price increase.

And for all brother who hold the same position. Its really stunning piece, dont think about secondary price and enjoy it. Keep it for next generation.

Sorry for my poor english. Its not my first language.

[tom2517]

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

I have seen many on the secondary market in the 160K range. They may have gone up a little. Try to find a nice example used at the market price. You cannot go wrong this watch if you like it and will wear it. People tire of a manual PC. These watches come from an era when all watches were manual wind. Today people want automatic PCs so they can leave them on a winder when not in use.

Yeah they all went up a little because of Patek’s price raise back in October, if anything the raise benefited the secondary pricing more.

[Banter]

One of the grey dealers told me Jay Leno is picking up all the 5270g-013, the ones with “Jay Leno Chin”. He probably wants people to remember his legacy like Paul Newman Daytona.

Also this model had the shortest run.

[Kittayos]

Originally Posted by Banter

One of the grey dealers told me Jay Leno is picking up all the 5270g-013, the ones with “Jay Leno Chin”. He probably wants people to remember his legacy like Paul Newman Daytona.

Also this model had the shortest run.

Admittedly it’s the ugliest model of all 5270s. It shouldn’t come out in the beginning IMO.

[bob101]

All these PPCs will do well long term particularly 5270P and 5270J which will be discontinued next year most likely. These are the real collectors pieces long term. First in house PCC is historically important as are the models of the series with less no’s.

[ragsk]

Originally Posted by bob101

All these PPCs will do well long term particularly 5270P and 5270J which will be discontinued next year most likely. These are the real collectors pieces long term. First in house PCC is historically important as are the models of the series with less no’s.

Why the J over the R? Shorter production run?

[bob101]

Originally Posted by ragsk

Why the J over the R? Shorter production run?

Exactly just launched July time last year.

[ts3]

Originally Posted by bob101

All these PPCs will do well long term particularly 5270P and 5270J which will be discontinued next year most likely. These are the real collectors pieces long term. First in house PCC is historically important as are the models of the series with less no’s.

When reading about the 5270 being discontinued soon I am wondering why (other than for the potential benefit of those who own them) and what next. After all Patek invested a ton in developing their in house manual chrono and PCC movements not that long ago.

What do you expect? An upsizing and a new case and dial just like replacing the 5170 with the 5172 or a new movement as well?

I for one could not care less about the 5172 but do like some of the 5170s.

[tom2517]

Originally Posted by bob101

All these PPCs will do well long term particularly 5270P and 5270J which will be discontinued next year most likely. These are the real collectors pieces long term. First in house PCC is historically important as are the models of the series with less no’s.

Well, hope Patek does discontinue 5270s because they are not doing well in the secondary market, that is the last trick left to pull up the prices.

[kneedeep]

Originally Posted by tom2517

Well, hope Patek does discontinue 5270s because they are not doing well in the secondary market, that is the last trick left to pull up the prices.

Discontinuing is the only trick left to try to offset too many pieces made. And I expect more of the "discontinue" strategy in the last phases of the mania.

[JorgeCCW]

one thing is the position of the watch in Patek history and another one is its behavior in the market. I am just gonna say this, with pieces of 100k and above your demand gets smaller.
But it also true that you just need one person to be interested to get a good price for it.

[AR5150]

I most definitely love it to death. The size is very wearable every day. It doesn’t feel chunky or clunky which one might worry with those two complications stacked. If I didn’t have to put the watch in the case I’d wear it every day. Personally I love the salmon in person as opposed to photos. It has a lot more life in person.

[soundserious]

Eh, it would be hard for me to spend that kind of money and not get a 5970 instead. In any metal I’d take it over the 5270.

[raystinger]

I was recently in a similar predicament whereby I was deciding between a 5970g or 5270g-018. Both are quite similarly priced with the latter being around 20k less. I ended up with the 5270g because of its technically superior movement and a more elaborate case design. The 20k saving certainly also helped to tilt the balance. I can understand the charm of the 5970 but I believe that the 5270 will eventually hold its own weight due to the CH29 movement being first in-house manual chrono by Patek. It will take some time for people to start appreciating this but since I am in this for the long haul, the near term value is not much of a concern to me.

[fbx]

Get it and wear it!


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[Acquisition40]

Originally Posted by ts3

When reading about the 5270 being discontinued soon I am wondering why (other than for the potential benefit of those who own them) and what next. After all Patek invested a ton in developing their in house manual chrono and PCC movements not that long ago.

What do you expect? An upsizing and a new case and dial just like replacing the 5170 with the 5172 or a new movement as well?

I for one could not care less about the 5172 but do like some of the 5170s.

Really nice way of putting it. PP most likely won't discontinue the PCC movement even if they replace the 5270-line.

Strange, but all too usual in the world of watches: the success of the 5270 will hinge on how well received the next version of the PCC.

S