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16 September 2022, 04:47 PM | #31 |
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16 September 2022, 08:10 PM | #32 | |
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1) AP is practically a one design company, that for some reason (IG fame) has been in the general public's spotlight the last few years. They add complications and change case sizes, that's it. So if you can't get a RO, you can't get an AP. 2) While I agree with you on the fact, that AP wants people who buy multiple watches in their time with the brand, as a luxury brand they do not necessarily want customers to buy 4-5 pieces a year. From a corporate standpoint because of 1) AP probably also wants to grow their customer base. Reason for this being, that once the hype ebbs down they have a better chance of retaining at least some clients who stay with the brand. I am pretty sure that AP Le Brassus isn't happy about clients receiving 4-5 pieces a year while others are shunned in the process. Depending on AP Singapore's short term strategy (most probably to maximize profits) they might see things differently. For AP itself it's not good news if someone receives 4-5 pieces a year, especially when they would be able to sell 2-3 to other clients in no time. Even if the customer is the biggest whale in the sea, it's still bad business from a long term perspective. Once he moves on (and in most cases he will) he will be lost as a brand advocate for AP as well. That's not to say that the member here who has received 4 pieces this year isn't generally interested in AP, but I'm sure he's not the only one who has been allocated such an amount by the respective boutique in such a short period of time. AP Singapore SAs or other affiliates who do business like this should probably have a look at how well business is going at Panerai atm. And Panerai never snubbed their customers to that degree as far as I'm aware. Here in Europe SAs are even telling you as much. They want to build a loyal customer base and therefore they tell you straightforward, that you won't be able to purchase everything that comes to your mind immediately, regardless of the fact, that you could spend the money right away. I don't like the hassle to get a watch allocated here either, but at least it's not totally dishonest. |
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17 September 2022, 12:12 AM | #33 | |
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With AP, I guess a buyer of a flipped watch would want to register that for themselves so I’m guessing AP find out it’s been sold? I realise that money is money and making a profit is all some people care about, but for me I was so happy to get a 50th, selling it just wouldn’t enter my mind. AP House London and Vanessa in particular have been superb to me and I’d feel I was doing a dirty, so what you’ve said about reallocating watches to areas that don’t flip as much makes sense. |
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17 September 2022, 12:12 AM | #34 | |
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17 September 2022, 12:18 AM | #35 | |
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In particular, it seems to me that the likelihood of a long-term client sticking around for an uncertain future is much greater than for those swept up by the recent hype. Long-term client's have demonstrated that they will buy watches that do not appreciate by a factor of x2-3 the moment they walk out the door - that is a complete unknown for the IG generation of clients. In fact, reports are that AP's experiment of allocating some fraction of the 50th anniversary production to new clients turned into a flipping bonanza. |
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17 September 2022, 02:50 AM | #36 | |
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they've expanded into another market with the code line, that's more than enough for a while. they didn't even need to do that because they're cemented in history with what they did with the RO line and how it saved the mechanical luxury watch market people praise rolex's lineup and the fact that they continue to make very minor changes but when you look at it rolex has 3 designs. the classic "dressy" watches with a fluted bezel, ceramic divers/gmts with rotating bezels that all basically look the same except for the colors of the bezels and the daytona. they're not exactly crazy diverse either lol |
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17 September 2022, 03:51 AM | #37 | |
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I’d also note, there’s nothing wrong with this. It’s a mechanical watch - a relic from the past (that hopefully most people on this forum appreciate). IMO there’s no need to go crazy on the iterations/models. Stick to what works.
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17 September 2022, 04:27 AM | #38 |
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In a Rolex forum of all places is a funny location to criticize the lineup of AP designs for diversity. They're in the business of fortifying the longevity of the brand, maximizing long term relationship with brand collectors. Seems like the current demand is beyond their capacity to produce across all the product lines, so I'd say its successful.
Sometimes a brand's direction is not congruent with a segment of collectors and their set of beliefs. And that's OK. |
17 September 2022, 05:40 AM | #39 |
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The price increase was minimal on RO and ROC SS, about 3% correct? I've expressed my interest in a ROC since late 2018 and have been on the list since. I don't really care for a 50th or not so have the patience to wait into next year.
At that point I may just be blunt and say 'I really want to establish a long relationship with the brand. At this point I may purchase in the secondary market but my hope is to purchase through the boutique and more over the years'. |
17 September 2022, 06:13 AM | #40 |
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[QUOTE=VogelPhoenix;12380683]Disagree with basically everything you said, other than the direct reply to the tuna.
I think Tuna is just bitter about not getting an allocation...
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17 September 2022, 11:16 PM | #41 | ||
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Actually that's exactly what I was getting to with this statement. AP does have plenty history apart from the RO, but for some reason they seem to be ignoring everything apart from Genta's design, much to the frustration of people sincerely interested in the company itself. Atm AP has basically nothing to offer apart from RO based designs. Even the concept range has a hard time differantiating itself from an Offshore. The Code to me personally is just a joke, but to each his own. Market seems to agree with someone around here suggesting that only about 10 percent of all AP watches are Codes. And even for these few models, they basically had to force clients to buy one for the longest time. Once things cool down, I don't believe they will be selling any more. Since the cancellation of the Jules Audemars range the company does not even offer a dress watch range. Imo AP could easily sift through their archives and come up with innovative designs based on historical references. PP and VC do that masterfully, why can't AP? Quote:
AP should not be happy with SAs allocating 4-5 pieces a year to the same customer, because let's be honest, at that rate there won't be much left for him to aspire to after 2-3 years. Imo AP should rather be focusing on creating a loyal customer base through allocating 1-2 pieces to existing clients and those interested they do not deem flippers. They would then be able to offer each more and more complicated (and expensive) pieces in the years to come, keeping both whales and new clients happy. |
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18 September 2022, 05:30 AM | #42 |
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No, No, NO, I think you have it all wrong. They want someone that CAN buy 40-50+ pieces per year but doesn't get upset when they only get to buy 1-4 per year. The mortals that can only buy 4-5 per annum need not apply. All the super likeable people getting offered 50th's on first piece not withstanding!
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18 September 2022, 05:41 AM | #43 | |
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This particular point is one reason I’m GLAD AP isn’t doing the same crap PP is doing. PP forces you to buy annual calendars and stuff you don’t want. And there are tons of stuff I don’t want just to get to an aquanaut or Nautilus. Makes no sense. At least with AP the code is a nice watch - and I wasn’t forced to buy one either. Though out of my own desire to collect I would be down for a CODE at some point. With PP, I was asked to buy an annual calendar, a chrono, a perpetual calendar - what? I don’t want or need 3-4 PP on leather straps. I dislike leather anyways and always prefer bracelet or at least rubber straps. I’m happy AP is producing more desirable sport models in the iconic case design - whether it’s concept or offshore or royal oak - at least I like and want those. |
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18 September 2022, 10:03 AM | #44 |
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Actually as APWhale said I do have 4 ROs and a Code including the first 15510ST my boutique received. So I am all set. But thanks for your concern.
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18 September 2022, 10:11 AM | #45 | |
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18 September 2022, 10:39 AM | #46 | |
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I dont think there are any watches to built a relationship with AP / dont like code, used to own an ROO and ROC so what else was I supposed to buy? a diver maybe and then - everything that's desirable from AP aka ceramic pieces, tourbillons or skeleton pieces are not available. I keep seeing the same watches being released with marginal updates at least patek has variety. |
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18 September 2022, 10:46 AM | #47 |
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I am a big AP fan but I agree with @dauster. AP's catalogue is severely lacking compared to PP and VC. I think it's inexcusable that AP does not have a proper dress line like the calatrava and patrimony/traditionelle. Also some middle of the road complications such as annual/complete calendars, dual times, dead beat seconds etc would be a welcome addition to the catalogue.
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18 September 2022, 12:10 PM | #48 | |
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18 September 2022, 03:10 PM | #49 | |
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You’re telling me I can get an aquanaut or nautilus (I don’t care which reference I would take any reference from those lines) without having to buy pieces from their dress watch lineup? You’re kidding right? If you do know an AD of PP that would allow me to get any aquanaut or any nautilus references please let me know. |
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18 September 2022, 03:59 PM | #50 | |
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It’s not happening without buying multiple dress watches. Was flat out told that by my AD Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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18 September 2022, 07:07 PM | #51 |
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19 September 2022, 01:29 AM | #52 | |
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No I said nobody is forced to do anything and it’s subjective - one thinks a code a is cool watch maybe followed buy a diver and others prefer to buy Patek dress watches. I’d rather buy a Patek dress watch than a code for example - 6119 vs code not even a question imo but since you seem to like AP and only want Patek sports watches just stick with AP… Lastly, I pointed out that there is no ladder to climb for AP in terms of progressively buying watches because they do not have enough variety unless you get to the interesting pieces that are reserved for the VIPs. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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19 September 2022, 05:09 AM | #53 | ||
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19 September 2022, 05:30 AM | #54 | |
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Same here. I’ve had the PP journey laid out to me and with time lines too. But I’m not buying 2 watches that I have zero interest in owning (and at a cost of c. £55k) just to be considered to wait 5-10 years for the 3/4 new PP I would like to own. Sorry, that’s not a game that I’ve played in 30+ years of buying nice watches and I’m pleased to say not something that AP House here in the Uk play either. Life is too short to play such games and if that means I’m not buying any new PP then, you know what, I’ll live and I’m sure the AD, Boutiques and PP will too. For me AP are vastly superior watches in terms of engineering, style, finish and heritage too |
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19 September 2022, 09:44 AM | #55 | |
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19 September 2022, 09:55 AM | #56 | |
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19 September 2022, 10:03 AM | #57 | |
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AP needs to bring back forged carbon, ceramic, etc... in the offshore line and the diver line. They used to make such interesting watches in all those other lines. Same with the concept line. They are completely neglecting practically the other lines in favor of the codes (which honestly suck except for the most expensive ones), and the RO. I still remember the millenary carbon one was an awesome watch. I really don't know why they discontinued that line. The Jules audemar line had potential as a dress watch, but only their tourbillon pieces were something special. |
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19 September 2022, 12:02 PM | #58 | |
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19 September 2022, 12:15 PM | #59 | |
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19 September 2022, 12:28 PM | #60 | |
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