Vintage Rolex All About The Dial, Hands & Case

[Franks07]

Hello all.
Is it stating the obvious to say that it has become abundantly clear to me that the collectibility and value of vintage Rolex has everything to do with the originality and condition of the dial, hands and case and very little to do with the movement?
Rarely, if ever, is there even a mention of the movement in the treads that show off fabulous examples of vintage rolex watches (love to lurk here and drool over the endless string of beautiful vintage Rolex watches). The focus on the "particulars" of the seemingly endless postings of truly stunning vintage examples centers first and foremost on the overall originality of the watch in general; and the relative condition of the dial, hands and case in particular.
Why has the caliber and condition of the movement become almost a non issue in vintage Rolex? Is it because there is an inherent assumption that the Rolex movement will always be "robust" and highly accurate? Perhaps it's due to the fact that replacement "period correct" movements are plentiful?
Just seems to be a very interesting difference from other vintage brands like Omega where the movement caliber and overall movement condition are almost always mentioned in for sale postings and seems to be significantly more important to the collector/buyer.
Just to be a bit different...Here is a picture of the A260 movement in my ref 6205 Submariner ca. 1954.

[bluemartinifan]

That's a good point - I have a $10k vintage SD listed without mention of the movement calibre or condition. I do mention that the operation of the watch is in good working order and it's service history. I have come to expect a certain movement in specific references. Perhaps I should pay more attention to the condition of the movement - but I am not concerned that the watch has the correct movement - especially with the few trusted vintage sellers I by from be

[Vincent65]

I know what you mean, and have noted the same thing myself. I think it's the point you made about expectations for the Rolex movements. It 'almost' goes without saying, but I think most buyers and owners really do care a lot about what's inside and maintaining it.

[omitohud]

It's unfortunate, but when the reality that a rolex dial can cost 5 times or more than the movement, the latter becomes irrelevant.


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[Beaumont Miller II]

I would say ...dial, case, hands, then perhaps bracelet. I would not put the condition of the hands as more important than the condition of the case.

I saw a similar thread discussing this issue relative to Omegas. Vintage Omega collectors appear to pay particular attention to the movement, while apparently Rolex collectors place their emphasis on other aspects of the watch. From my stand point this is because for the most part vintage parts for Rolex movements can easily be found. This however is not the case with some Tudors.

[Dr.Smellody]

My A260 says hi and is doing great after 60 years.

[Franks07]

Very cool Dr. Smellody!
Here is an obligatory full frontal shot of my 6205,
Previous comment by Beaumont Miller II noted and agreed...case is definitely second only to the dial in importance for a vintage piece. Agree also with the inclusion of the bracelet as yet another very important issue that comes before the movement in vintage Rolex circles.
Beaumont Miller II being the consensus resident expert on Sub Ref 5513 might well appreciate my comments related to the anonymity of the movements in vintage Rolex since 5513's might be the best example...with the length of production time and number of variants of the 5513 how many movements were used and what are they?

[Beaumont Miller II]

I will confess that I am not the person to ask what movement came with each particular reference. The 5512 and 5513 with their long production runs had a few over the years.

I almost posted this link in my first post:
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=30759

The other reason why Rolex aficionados MAY not put the movement as the top priority when evaluating a watch is because as you can see from the link, most (NOT ALL) references used one movement...not many references used more than one movement, the 5512/13 being the exception. It MIGHT be redundant to go into great detail about the 1030 movement in your 6538 when that is the movement collectors expect to see in that movement. Makes more sense to talk about the condition of the dial, case, and hands etc. It's when you try to sell a watch with an unexpected movement that collectors start to cast doubt on its originality.
This is in contrast to the vintage Omega Speedmaster which had a calibre 321 and 861 movement depending on the year of production, with the premium price favoring the earlier 321 movement.