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Old 5 March 2018, 03:55 PM   #1
anh0nym0us
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Icon5 Spotted in jewelry store, fraken-sub or fake?

Hi all,

tl;dr - Spotted this sub on display in a fairly large jewelry store at a mall. I can't recognize the model & many things look off. Is it fake?

Wife and I walked by a pretty large (imply reputable?) jewelry store at the mall and this sub caught my eye. It just looks... wrong. I am not sure if it's fake, but it certainly does not look genuine. Admittedly, I am fairly new to Rolex, but have been researching & lurking the forums. I figured this would be a good learning opportunity. Here are the things that look wrong to me:

1. Dial. Crown logo & font look off (too skinny & tall?). I am not familiar with tritium dials, but it seems the luminous dots shouldn't protrude like that.
2. Bezel. Dot on the bezel is wrong. The 4 should probably be a flat four to be consistent with the tritium dial. I was also able to turn the bezel in both directions. Either the spring is defective, or something is not original.
3. Case. The lugs seem more consistent with an older model (16610?) but the crown guards are too wide (more like a 116610 model). Btw, the lugs have holes.

The jeweler admitted that the bracelets are not original to his knowledge. When I asked about the case, he said that perhaps that's custom as well. He did not know much else about the piece.

The more I study the picture, the more I believe that the entire thing might be fake. Though, it seems strange that a pretty big jewelry store in the middle of a mall would proudly display a fake. So part of me think that maybe the watch is real with some after-market parts. I don't know enough about the tritium models to identify what's real (if any).

What does TRF think? Am I was way off base with my speculations? If real, what model is it? If fake, what model is it "trying" to copy?

Thanks.
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Old 5 March 2018, 08:27 PM   #2
Haywood_Milton
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Yikes! Look at that crown! That dial!

What is the name of this store?
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Old 5 March 2018, 10:01 PM   #3
crowncollection
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Ouch, where is this store ?


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Old 5 March 2018, 11:58 PM   #4
crazymcmichael
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as fake as fake could be... a jewelry store in a Southern country i guess ? Or is it owned by shady
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Old 6 March 2018, 12:51 AM   #5
socalwatchcollector
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Ouch is right.. Store name?
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Old 6 March 2018, 02:55 AM   #6
crazymcmichael
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what price did it cost? LOL!!
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Old 6 March 2018, 05:06 AM   #7
cop414
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Fake and a very bad one at that.
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Old 6 March 2018, 05:48 AM   #8
crazymcmichael
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hands look like plastic 2....
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Old 6 March 2018, 06:01 AM   #9
CorradoBrit
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Shocking when even a 'reputable' jeweler can't be trusted. I hope you have pointed them towards this thread.
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Old 6 March 2018, 06:05 AM   #10
anh0nym0us
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haywood_Milton View Post
Yikes! Look at that crown! That dial!

What is the name of this store?
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazymcmichael View Post
as fake as fake could be... a jewelry store in a Southern country i guess ? Or is it owned by shady
The store is located in a fairly busy Westfield mall around Los Angeles, CA. I am not sure what the rules are about revealing the name. Their other pre-owned rolexes passed my eye-test and they appear to be an authorized dealer for several other watch brands (e.g., citizen, gucci, etc.). They look legit and it is likely that they just got bamboozled on this one.

I am thinking about going in to tell them, I'm not sure if I should or even how to go about doing that.

Anyway, if you're in the area & would like to know, PM me for the store name.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crazymcmichael View Post
what price did it cost? LOL!!
I don't remember the exact price, but it was definitely around $7500 (give or take a few hundreds).

Quote:
Originally Posted by crazymcmichael View Post
hands look like plastic 2....
Yea I thought they look off as well, either plastic of some "cheap" metal.
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Old 6 March 2018, 06:49 AM   #11
CorradoBrit
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Talk to the manager. I don't see how they can be offended if you tell them they need to authenticate a watch they're selling. Hardly does their reputation any favors selling counterfeit watches. If they continue to refuse to acknowledge there's a problem then name and shame.
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Old 6 March 2018, 06:54 AM   #12
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If a store doesn’t have the in house expertise to ID a fake, they can’t be trusted selling used watches. That’s a good reason to name them. People should know walking in that authenticity is not gauranteed.
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Old 6 March 2018, 07:05 AM   #13
freefly
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There is a remote possibility that it's a total franken/parts-build "conversion" using junk parts, but with a legit case & movement. I say "conversion" as the case and winding crown are from a GMT, not a Sub, and look like they "could" be a legitimate.
Obviously you would need to pop the back to confirm what's inside. I'd be curious to see the reference & SN engravings between the lugs as well (takes 2 seconds to pop the bracelet).

Either way, I would certainly pass on that one...
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Old 6 March 2018, 05:03 PM   #14
anh0nym0us
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freefly View Post
There is a remote possibility that it's a total franken/parts-build "conversion" using junk parts, but with a legit case & movement. I say "conversion" as the case and winding crown are from a GMT, not a Sub, and look like they "could" be a legitimate.
Obviously you would need to pop the back to confirm what's inside. I'd be curious to see the reference & SN engravings between the lugs as well (takes 2 seconds to pop the bracelet).

Either way, I would certainly pass on that one...
This. I was hoping to learn exactly this kind of info. Thanks.

I do see the resemblance of a GMT case & crown now that you've mentioned it. It makes a lot of sense and would explain why the bezel turned in both directions. I now also think that this might have been a GMT that was poorly converted to a Sub with after-market parts.

I'll try to get the reference & serial if I have the opportunity.
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