Wear and tear for manual winding ?

[Carlos98326194]

Panerai noobie here.....
I have been really intrigue and in the verge of finally joining the dark side..
I do have one question for veteran ristis.
Do the manual winding Pams like 000 easily suffers from wear and tear due to the frequency of manual winding?
Are they recommended to be service every 5yrs like Rolex ?
As of now I am planning to get one for weekend wear. So I expect to only wind it like once a week.
Experiences from other manual owners?

[subdownunder]

I would say the whether it is wound automatically or manually makes no difference, just make sure you release the winder lever!

[bcacncnc]

I also have a PAM 000 for weekend warrior duties. So far the only "incident" I have had is where I think the gears somehow got stuck when I tried to set the time and it wouldn't move "forward" or "backwards". I think what happend was I did not pull out the crown properly and it was "inbetween" if you know what I mean. I am very careful now of pulling the crown out to the proper notch.

The zero is also really quick and easy to set on the weekends since you don't have the date, you simply have to set the time, and wind and then off you go.

[B. Doggy]

No, you're good. I manually wind my 312 quite often, they're made for it. It's no different than manual wind watches made back in the day, where they were required to be wound daily. No harm...

[Carlos98326194]

Thanks for the reply.

[karmatp]

You have to remember that mechanical watches were manual for many years before the the auto feature was made. These watches are built to be wound daily if needed, they can handle it for sure.

[Speed]

Originally Posted by subdownunder

I would say the whether it is wound automatically or manually makes no difference, just make sure you release the winder lever!

Is this correct???

Is the winder lever supposed to flop around when you wind your PAM? I only release the lever when setting the time :-/

Leaving the lever open seems like a bad design. Mine has been working fine / without the lever open.

[B. Doggy]

Originally Posted by Speed

Is this correct???

Is the winder lever supposed to flop around when you wind your PAM? I only release the lever when setting the time :-/

Leaving the lever open seems like a bad design. Mine has been working fine / without the lever open.

Yes, you should always release the lever when turning the crown....

[stockae92]

I ALWAYS release the lever (unlock the crown) before winding

let's look at this way. the lever press against the crown and create pressure. if you are winding it with the lever in locked position, that will increase wear and tear between the lever and the crown

and then its the water tight seals. the crown is pressed against the seals (gaskets) to make it water resistant. if you wind it with the crown pressed against the seals, then will increase the wear and tear with the seals.

it won't break anything with winding the watch with crown locked. but i wouldn't want to do it too often though.

Frank

[expensivetaste]

My understanding is that there is no association between manual winding and additional wear and tear, as this is what the watch was designed for. Whether winding clockwise or counter, I am sure the designers of these wonderful time pieces have taken this into consideration. As far as service goes I would get it serviced regularly, just as you would with any machine.

[utc66]

In the Omega section on timesone, some guy wound all his autos every day. Turned out that several of them needed repair to the stem or something like that. Omega told him that auto-wind watches should not be wound every day due to excessive wear. A watch repair person commented on the thread that Omega was correct. Autos are meant to be wound occasionally and manuals every day. It might be hard to find that thread again, not sure what key word to use to search, but it was an eye-opening thread to many.

[mike]

Originally Posted by B. Doggy

Yes, you should always release the lever when turning the crown....

[B. Doggy]

Originally Posted by utc66

In the Omega section on timesone, some guy wound all his autos every day. Turned out that several of them needed repair to the stem or something like that. Omega told him that auto-wind watches should not be wound every day due to excessive wear. A watch repair person commented on the thread that Omega was correct. Autos are meant to be wound occasionally and manuals every day. It might be hard to find that thread again, not sure what key word to use to search, but it was an eye-opening thread to many.

This doesn't make any sense to me. There's no reason a winding mechanism would be built any different on an auto vs. a non-auto watch. I've never heard that winding an auto every day would somehow be bad for it. I'm sure others would concur....

[Wisconsin Proud]

Originally Posted by B. Doggy

This doesn't make any sense to me. There's no reason a winding mechanism would be built any different on an auto vs. a non-auto watch. I've never heard that winding an auto every day would somehow be bad for it. I'm sure others would concur....

I ahve the PAM 210 Unitas movement and it definitely has a firmer, more solid feel to it than any auto watch Ive ever had.

It seems the winding parts (stem, crown assembly) are built stronger.

[B. Doggy]

Originally Posted by Wisconsin Proud

I ahve the PAM 210 Unitas movement and it definitely has a firmer, more solid feel to it than any auto watch Ive ever had.

It seems the winding parts (stem, crown assembly) are built stronger.

I've owned a 190 and also have a BP (automatic) and they both feel adequately well built and great for manual winding...

[htc8p]

winding up manual wind watches have no effect on durability. service interval is the same 5-7 years. (they only calibrated my winding system but still charged me for the works.)

since i dont use my pam112 everyday, i let power reserve die then set the time then give it a full wind again.

[Speed]

Originally Posted by B. Doggy

Yes, you should always release the lever when turning the crown....

Thanks Brian / Mike.

Just wound up the 111 as directed. I have to say it feels weird with the lever flapping around...Now if it had a setting where it would sit closer to the crown guard whilst winding.

[htc8p]

dont wind with the crown guard closed. youll break the seals and the winding mechanism

Originally Posted by Speed

Thanks Brian / Mike.

Just wound up the 111 as directed. I have to say it feels weird with the lever flapping around...Now if it had a setting where it would sit closer to the crown guard whilst winding.

[Speed]

Got it.

Thanks!

[Carlos98326194]

Haven't visited this thread since yesterday and glad to be back with a lot of nice inputs from friendly members

[kilyung]

I just looked at a manual wind ETA6497-1 stem (same as PAM stem) and the stem is 8mm thick. In comparison, the stem on an ETA2836-2 automatic movement is 6mm thick. I think the discussion has less to do with manual vs auto and more to do with the relative sizes of watch parts. It stands to reason that an 8mm piece of metal is a little more robust than a 6mm part - sort of like comparing a 1.4mm vs a 1.2mm screwdriver. Does that imply that the 6mm can't/shouldn't be hand wound? Not at all... but keep in mind that the (6497 based) PAM movements were pocket watch engines and engineered to withstand the torque/wear of repeated windings. The referenced Omega (mostly ETA movements) is probably similar to the ETA2836-2 stem so it's smaller and more care should be taken in handling it. Regardless, modern stems are pretty robust so I wouldn't worry about it and just replace the stem (based on wear) at each service interval (just as you would any other worn part).

[utc66]

I found the thread where the guy was winding his autos everyday. Take a look and comment whether it makes sense. In the end the only people who really know are master watchmakers and experienced repairpersons.

http://forums.timezone.com/index.php...73#msg_5028518

[B. Doggy]

Originally Posted by utc66

I found the thread where the guy was winding his autos everyday. Take a look and comment whether it makes sense. In the end the only people who really know are master watchmakers and experienced repairpersons.

http://forums.timezone.com/index.php...73#msg_5028518

This is quite an interesting thread, thanks for sharing it. I'm going to post it over on the Rolex side and gather opinions...

[expensivetaste]

Hope this helps!
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=42091

[htc8p]

Originally Posted by expensivetaste

Hope this helps!
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=42091

that link is true. has been since the 1980s for me

so the "too much winding of the stem" problem should not be the case unless it wasnt done properly.