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Old 19 January 2021, 12:21 AM   #1
DocOc
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Seconds hand. Centered or on sub-dial.

I realize that a lot of watches have the second hand in a subdial, especially chronographs that require the one-second timing hand to start and stop with a button. But for simple chronometers that feature this, I don’t understand the reasoning behind it.

Am I missing something?
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Old 19 January 2021, 12:48 AM   #2
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Not absolutely sure of the question but here goes....

The large second hand in a chronograph is obviously for more accurate stop watch use just because it's visually larger. Much like the "doctors watch" dial that used a large second hand, that was designed so a Dr could check patient heart rate more easily than looking at a tiny subdial.

As for an ordinary dial of a watch and whether it should be a subdial second hand or not, is probably just a design element of the watch design. And don't forget that a lot of watch companies used ETA ( and other company's movements) that they bought for their watches and some movements had the subdial and some didn't and they could chose which one was preferable for their case and aesthetics.

But overall I guess a subdial is merely a design element of the watch, which in most cases I actually prefer.

A movement guy could probably chime in and give a better answer about how a movement is put together and how much room etc, it takes up.
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Old 19 January 2021, 12:57 AM   #3
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For me it is the looks, it's what drew me to my watch, others prefer the larger second hand, I prefer the sub dial.

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Old 19 January 2021, 01:01 AM   #4
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For me it is the looks, it's what drew me to my watch, others prefer the larger second hand, I prefer the sub dial.

Dave, I was checking out that watch last week, awfully tempting if I were not waiting for the Explorer, and also now thinking about the new Speedmaster. It's a stunner.
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Old 19 January 2021, 02:11 AM   #5
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For me it is the looks, it's what drew me to my watch, others prefer the larger second hand, I prefer the sub dial.


Love it, sir!

I’ve always liked pocket watches and capturing their look in modern pieces with a subdial is nice. I think JLC hit it out of the park with your piece, on so many levels.

The topic makes me think about our relationship with time, compared to people in the past. We care about seconds. The past (pocket watch era), not so much. Well, the railroad comes to mind as an exception.

That being said, maybe that’s why seconds is not a central element. One can glance down and see the watch is still running.

Again, I don’t know for sure, just speculation.


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Old 19 January 2021, 03:59 AM   #6
DocOc
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To me, having the seconds displayed in a subdial seems to treat the seconds function as an afterthought. To me, it makes much more sense to keep the timekeeping hands concentric, as they are all keeping track of the same time.
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Old 19 January 2021, 04:20 AM   #7
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. . . But for simple chronometers that feature this, I don’t understand the reasoning behind it.

Am I missing something?
Center second hands, or sweep hands, are fairly new to horology.

Older clocks don't have seconds hands, or if they did, they were run off the direct drive gear-set and then made a sub-dial, rather than have more hand-posts sticking through the center.

So, a sub-dial seconds hand is a historically accurate dial depiction, and a style that comes and goes.

Then, in 1945, somebody actually put a date on the dial of a wristwatch too- Oh, the horror of it all - this I just don't understand the reasoning behind.
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Old 19 January 2021, 04:20 AM   #8
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I realize that a lot of watches have the second hand in a subdial, especially chronographs that require the one-second timing hand to start and stop with a button. But for simple chronometers that feature this, I don’t understand the reasoning behind it.

Am I missing something?
If you’re interested in the central seconds complication in general here is a good history of it, as well as how it is implemented:

https://www.watch-wiki.net/index.php...econds#History
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Old 19 January 2021, 07:48 AM   #9
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The seconds sub-dial is actually a hand attached directly to the forth wheel of the geartrain--that's the gear which takes 1 minute to make a complete rotation, of course.

It's more efficient to have a sub-seconds and it takes a few extra gears for a central seconds, but not a big deal in modern watchmaking.
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Old 19 January 2021, 08:56 AM   #10
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Sub dial on dress watches for sure.
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Old 19 January 2021, 08:26 PM   #11
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I prefer sub-dial seconds on dress watches and center seconds on sportier watches. Either way, a second hand is nearly a must-have for me. Also, stunning JLC posted above.
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Old 19 January 2021, 09:53 PM   #12
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I like both options on a second hand. I do like to see it move.
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Old 19 January 2021, 09:56 PM   #13
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Depends on the watch, but overall I prefer the center second hands vs a sub dial.
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Old 19 January 2021, 11:13 PM   #14
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The 15202, now that one I don’t understand
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Old 20 January 2021, 12:54 AM   #15
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I really have no strong preference one way or the other, completely dependent on the watch itself and how it is executed.
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Old 21 January 2021, 03:13 AM   #16
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I really have no strong preference one way or the other, completely dependent on the watch itself and how it is executed.
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Old 21 January 2021, 04:17 AM   #17
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I like small seconds
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Old 21 January 2021, 11:32 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by gnuyork View Post
Dave, I was checking out that watch last week, awfully tempting if I were not waiting for the Explorer, and also now thinking about the new Speedmaster. It's a stunner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AF_Rob View Post
Love it, sir!

I’ve always liked pocket watches and capturing their look in modern pieces with a subdial is nice. I think JLC hit it out of the park with your piece, on so many levels.
Thank you very much fellas, really appreciate your kind comments, I have to say, it is a watch that I really enjoy owning.
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Old 21 January 2021, 11:57 PM   #19
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I like small seconds
That's one nice small seconds subdial Did you get the bracelet sorted out?

For what it's worth, I'm a big fan of the small seconds "complication" whether it's in isolation or part of a chrono subdial layout.
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Old 22 January 2021, 01:23 AM   #20
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That's one nice small seconds subdial Did you get the bracelet sorted out?

For what it's worth, I'm a big fan of the small seconds "complication" whether it's in isolation or part of a chrono subdial layout.

Indeed it is. It’s sapphire.

Off to Geneva. Supposedly expedited. Will post to Journe thread when it returns.
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Old 22 January 2021, 10:26 AM   #21
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A small seconds register, when executed well, just adds so much character to the watch. This is by far the favorite in my collection. Hard to capture all the different subtle hues and details as they change with the angle of the light.






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